Ha Satan, The Devil, Iblis, Lucifer, Legion, Baal... [Archive]

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 01:18 PM

I recently read this quote and felt like sharing. Tis the season!

The Big Bang was Lucifer falling from heaven, and that the entire Universe, including humanity, are the broken parts of Lucifer, and that evolution is the process of Lucifer putting himself together back into an angel.

What quotes or insights into "The Devil" do you have?

Lonsome_Drifter

10-30-2009, 01:26 PM

Where in the Hell did that quote come from?

Stoo

10-30-2009, 01:28 PM

Guitarist, Steve Vai, plays him in the movie, "Crossroads".:D

F*@#ing Welcome Back, F*#k Face!;):p:hat: It's about time.

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 01:30 PM

Guitarist, Steve Vai, plays him in the movie, "Crossroads".:D

F*@#ing Welcome Back, F*#k Face!;):p:hat:

Thanks...:hat:
LOL!
Don't get kicked out like I did!;)

...or is that your Captain Howdy impression?

That the best you got? Steve Vai?

Where in the Hell did that quote come from?
From an old Jesuit student

Pale Horse

10-30-2009, 01:34 PM

Elle ne se plaignit en aucune façon de la mauvaise réputation dont elle jouit dans toutes les parties du monde, m'assura qu'elle était, elle-même, la personne la plus intéressée à la destruction de la superstition, et m'avoua qu'elle n'avait eu peur, relativement à son propre pouvoir, qu'une seule fois, c'était le jour où elle avait entendu un prédicateur, plus subtil que ses confrères, s'écrier en chaire: "Mes chers frères, n'oubliez jamais, quand vous entendrez vanter le progrès des lumières, que la plus belle des ruses du diable est de vous persuader qu'il n'existe pas!" ~Charles Baudelaire 'The Generous Gambler'

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 01:36 PM

Elle ne se plaignit en aucune façon de la mauvaise réputation dont elle jouit dans toutes les parties du monde, m'assura qu'elle était, elle-même, la personne la plus intéressée à la destruction de la superstition, et m'avoua qu'elle n'avait eu peur, relativement à son propre pouvoir, qu'une seule fois, c'était le jour où elle avait entendu un prédicateur, plus subtil que ses confrères, s'écrier en chaire: "Mes chers frères, n'oubliez jamais, quand vous entendrez vanter le progrès des lumières, que la plus belle des ruses du diable est de vous persuader qu'il n'existe pas!" ~Charles Baudelaire 'The Generous Gambler'

"praise the progress of knowledge, the best tricks of the devil is to persuade you that [he] does not exist! "

...nice!

Dr Bones

10-30-2009, 01:47 PM

For the Devil or Lucifer to exist one assumes there must be God???

Now wouldn't any all powerful God simply vanquish or render powerless the Devil if he was such a threat to God. The Devil is not a man and so would God's rule of non interferrence in free will no longer apply in his case?

i.e if the devil existed and God had not stopped him, this implies either he wouldn't for some strange reason or he simply couldn't.

If the devil could not be stopped, then surely by some underhand deed or crossing a line that God wouldn't/couldn't, the devil would have destroyed God as could/would not stop him, meaning God was not all powerful/wise and therefore could he be the same God we are taught is all powerful?

I don't see how the Devil can exist without God but also how they can they co-exist as one would surely have killed the other?

Organised religion...baloney keeping the unwashed masses in line and on the bread line for thoudsands of years whilst escalating mortals into power in "his" name.

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 01:51 PM

I don't see how the Devil can exist without God but also how they can they co-exist as one would surely have killed the other?

Interesting take on their roles, but not definitive...

Dr Bones

10-30-2009, 01:55 PM

Interesting take on their roles, but not definitive...

Obviously just my casual thoughts/observation.

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 01:58 PM

Obviously just my casual thoughts/observation.
Cheers!

Watch out! He's behind you!;)

Pale Horse

10-30-2009, 01:59 PM

I don't see how the Devil can exist without God but also how they can they co-exist as one would surely have killed the other?

Yeah, really makes you understand the concepts of omnipresent and omnipotent in a whole new light. Doncha think?

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 02:15 PM

Yeah, really makes you understand the concepts of omnipresent and omnipotent in a whole new light. Doncha think?

You really going to leave us dangling with your Exorcist story? If you had an experience this might be the time and place!

Dr Bones

10-30-2009, 02:18 PM

Cheers!

Watch out! He's behind you!;)

I believe in something....seen too much not to.. just not what some crusty old book and weirdo in a dog collar or funny hat says it is.

C'mon palehorse...spill!

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 03:12 PM

I believe in something...C'mon palehorse...spill!

Lets hope he's composing something for us...

While we wait:

How are you fallen from Heaven,
Lucifer! Son of the Dawn!
Cut down to the ground!
And once you dominated the peoples!
Didn’t you say to yourself:
I will be as high as Heaven!
I will be more exalted than the stars of God!
I will, indeed, be the supreme leader!
In the privileged places!
I will be higher than the Skies!
I will be the same as the Most High God!
But you shall be brought down to Hell, to the bottom of its pit.

And all who see you, will despise you. . . .
• Isaiah 14:12-19

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 03:17 PM

. . . “Lord! In your name, even evil spirits are under our control!”
And He said to them: “I saw Satan falling like
lightning from Heaven.
You know: I gave you power . . .
over all the strength of Satan. . . .
Nevertheless, don’t take pride in the fact
that spirits are subject to your control,
but, rather, because you belong to God . . .
The Father has given Me all power. . . .”

-Luke 10:17-22

Come on Pale don't leave us twisting in the wind...

Pale Horse

10-30-2009, 03:53 PM

You really going to leave us dangling with your Exorcist story? If you had an experience this might be the time and place!

If the judeo/christian account of God holds that he cannot be in the presence of sin, as evidenced at the garden of gethsemane, yet outside of him, nothing exists...where does that put sin, and how is it held?

It must be something on the inside.

Kevin

10-30-2009, 04:07 PM

Now wouldn't any all powerful God simply vanquish or render powerless the Devil if he was such a threat to God.

Satan is not a threat to God. He is only a creature, powerful from the fact that he is pure spirit, but still a creature. He cannot prevent the building up of God's reign. However, Satan is a threat to man and his immortal soul; he exists to lead man away from God and disobey God.

Finn

10-30-2009, 04:37 PM

Oh, how nice.

A whole thread dedicated to li'l old... me.

Pale Horse

10-30-2009, 05:04 PM

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/wikiality/images/0/00/BabySatanTRANSbkg.png

Be afraid...be very afraid...

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 08:57 PM

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/wikiality/images/0/00/BabySatanTRANSbkg.png

Be afraid...be very afraid...

When he comes it will be in a friendly way!

http://extmovie.com/zbxe/book/1657849/page/files/attach/images/563814/849/657/001/the-omen-damien-crosses.jpg

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 09:38 PM

I made a slight change, but I think it's better now.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2689/4059999358_1d3892d498.jpg

metalinvader

10-30-2009, 09:57 PM

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 10:03 PM

...shouldn't this be in "The Song Game" thread?

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I'm in league with satan

I was raised in hell

I walk the streets of Salem

Amongst the living dead

I need no one to tell me

What's wrong or right

I drink the blood of children

Stalk my prey at night

Look out beware

When the full moon's high n'bright

In every way I'm there

In every shadow in the night

Coz I'm evil in league with satan

Evil in league with satan

I'm in league with satan

Obey his commands

With the goat of Mendes

Sitting at his left hand

I'm in league with satan

I love the dead

No one prayed for Sodom

As the people fled

I'm in league with satan

I am the masters own

I drink the juice of women

As they lie alone

I'm in league with satan

I bear the devils mark

I kill the new born baby

Tear the infants flesh

metalinvader

10-30-2009, 10:07 PM

...shouldn't this be in "The Song Game" thread?

But..But...It's on topic!!:eek:

I'm flabbergasted.

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 11:15 PM

But..But...It's on topic!!:eek: I'm flabbergasted.

When you're right, you're right...

Rocket Surgeon

10-30-2009, 11:29 PM

Oh, how nice.

A whole thread dedicated to li'l old... me.

Do you know what happened to my Halloween poem?
Have you seen my Baseball?

Gear

10-31-2009, 12:07 AM

Do you know what happened to my Halloween poem?

Satan liked it so much, he stuck it up his butt.

Rocket Surgeon

10-31-2009, 12:14 AM

Satan liked it so much, he stuck it up his butt.
Intimately aquainted with the Devil's rectum?

Tell him give it back, and wash your hands before you get back...

Peru1936

10-31-2009, 01:05 AM

"praise the progress of knowledge, the best tricks of the devil is to persuade you that [he] does not exist! "

...nice!

Talk about convenience.

Gear

10-31-2009, 02:51 AM

... how can [God and Satan] co-exist as one would surely have killed the other?

Jesus and the Devil battle back and forth, though. Like that Bible verse:

"Hi. I'm Jesus, and I feel like kickin' Satan's ass all day today."

And the savior bursteth in on Satan atop the toilet and began smacking him, and Lucifer's alleth

"Jesus, what'r you doin?! Gah! Knock it off, man!!..."

*Jesus rips off the Devil's shirt and slams out of thy bathroom*

"... Man... You're goin' crazy out there!.. C'mon, Jesus... What's your problem?"

Jackass: XIII

Rocket Surgeon

11-05-2009, 12:36 PM

Jesus and the Devil battle back and forth, though. Like that Bible verse:

Well I guess not only does God play dice, he takes bets from the Devil, (see Book of Job).

Not only does God play dice, but... he sometimes throws them where they cannot be seen. - Stephen Hawking.

Pale Horse

11-05-2009, 12:52 PM

Jesus and the Devil battle back and forth, though. Like that Bible verse:

You know me, G....no contention here, but which verse. I love eschatology and apologetics.

Jack Nelligan

11-05-2009, 01:00 PM

For the Devil or Lucifer to exist one assumes there must be God???

Now wouldn't any all powerful God simply vanquish or render powerless the Devil if he was such a threat to God. The Devil is not a man and so would God's rule of non interferrence in free will no longer apply in his case?

i.e if the devil existed and God had not stopped him, this implies either he wouldn't for some strange reason or he simply couldn't.

If the devil could not be stopped, then surely by some underhand deed or crossing a line that God wouldn't/couldn't, the devil would have destroyed God as could/would not stop him, meaning God was not all powerful/wise and therefore could he be the same God we are taught is all powerful?

I don't see how the Devil can exist without God but also how they can they co-exist as one would surely have killed the other?

Organised religion...baloney keeping the unwashed masses in line and on the bread line for thoudsands of years whilst escalating mortals into power in "his" name.

The devil in not a threat to God, only to man!

Dr Bones

11-05-2009, 04:46 PM

The devil in not a threat to God, only to man!

So I reitterate, why would God not stop him?

If God is a father would he not remove any threat to his children as any father would remove/kill a snake from his child's crib?

To leave such a threat could be perceived as a a multitude of weakness such as pity, arrogance at his own power that he can crush him when he sees fit, yet mankind suffers until then.

God would be beyond these failings would he not?

I can see how an all wise and all powerful, perfect God can exist, but this to me then precludes the long term existence of the Devil.

Perhaps Satan's greatest trick was not in convincing us he doesn't exist but in convincing some that he actually survived the wrath of the surpeme being and still exists to torment us.

I am not quoting chapeter or verse as I am only putting forward my own silly observations and questions and not those of learned or otherwise accreditted scholars in such matters...again if you/they believe in all that stuff.

Pale Horse

11-05-2009, 05:00 PM

So I reitterate, why would God not stop him?

To leave such a threat could be perceived as a a multitude of weakness such as pity, arrogance at his own power that he can crush him when he sees fit, yet mankind suffers until then.....

Good Questions, doc.

I'll offer these immortal words from Curly Bill in City Slickers "Day's not over, yet...."

Jack Nelligan

11-06-2009, 11:24 AM

So I reitterate, why would God not stop him?

If God is a father would he not remove any threat to his children as any father would remove/kill a snake from his child's crib?

To leave such a threat could be perceived as a a multitude of weakness such as pity, arrogance at his own power that he can crush him when he sees fit, yet mankind suffers until then.

God would be beyond these failings would he not?

I can see how an all wise and all powerful, perfect God can exist, but this to me then precludes the long term existence of the Devil.

Perhaps Satan's greatest trick was not in convincing us he doesn't exist but in convincing some that he actually survived the wrath of the surpeme being and still exists to torment us.

I am not quoting chapeter or verse as I am only putting forward my own silly observations and questions and not those of learned or otherwise accreditted scholars in such matters...again if you/they believe in all that stuff.

Man is still suffering for the original sin by Eve in the Garden!

kongisking

11-06-2009, 11:44 AM

For the Devil or Lucifer to exist one assumes there must be God???

Now wouldn't any all powerful God simply vanquish or render powerless the Devil if he was such a threat to God. The Devil is not a man and so would God's rule of non interferrence in free will no longer apply in his case?

i.e if the devil existed and God had not stopped him, this implies either he wouldn't for some strange reason or he simply couldn't.

If the devil could not be stopped, then surely by some underhand deed or crossing a line that God wouldn't/couldn't, the devil would have destroyed God as could/would not stop him, meaning God was not all powerful/wise and therefore could he be the same God we are taught is all powerful?

I don't see how the Devil can exist without God but also how they can they co-exist as one would surely have killed the other?

Organised religion...baloney keeping the unwashed masses in line and on the bread line for thoudsands of years whilst escalating mortals into power in "his" name.

...Absolutely right.

Jack Nelligan

11-06-2009, 11:54 AM

...Absolutely right.

How exactly would the devil go about destroying God when he has been cast out of heaven and has no power to get back? As for God not destroying the devil, the devil has to live out eternity in a fiery burning hell as eternal punishment and he has to live with the fact that he will never be able to destroy God and his only recourse is to feed off the lost souls of mankind. A mankind that is still being punished for the original sin of Eve in the garden.

Pale Horse

11-06-2009, 12:01 PM

chuckle.

Okay, the potential apologetics aspect of this thread is now gone...

Jack Nelligan

11-06-2009, 12:20 PM

chuckle.

Okay, the potential apologetics aspect of this thread is now gone...

I'll happily bare the label of Apologists. Peace be with you!

Rocket Surgeon

11-06-2009, 12:27 PM

chuckle.

Okay, the potential apologetics aspect of this thread is now gone...

Don't give up yet! You have to help balance th Looney Skip Rooneys around here...

I'll happily bare the label of Apologists. Peace be with you!
That's not all your bearing, and making apparent...

Jack Nelligan

11-06-2009, 12:49 PM

Don't give up yet! You have to help balance th Looney Skip Rooneys around here...

That's not all your bearing, and making apparent...

No need for help from the MOD’s as an apologetic editor. I think your apparent lack of faith speaks for it self!

Quote of the day:

“God is dead”: Nietzsche

“Nietzsche is dead!”: God

In the end, you had better hope you are as smart as you think you are!

Rocket Surgeon

11-06-2009, 12:55 PM

No need for help from the MOD’s as an apologetic editor. I think your apparent lack of faith speaks for it self!

(Singing)Here we go again...

Ok, my comprehension-challenged "Ravener", an example please.

Quote of the day:

“God is dead”: Nietzsche

“Nietzsche is dead!”: God

I'll let you off easy on those, (knucklehead) but have to ask, where did I write that? I mean, are you even TRYING?

In the end, you had better hope you are as smart as you think you are!

Hmmm, seems you're the only one who's assuming anything around here...

Attila the Professor

11-06-2009, 01:06 PM

No need for help from the MOD’s as an apologetic editor. I think your apparent lack of faith speaks for it self!

Yeah. When it comes to Pale Horse and Rocket Surgeon, you really don't know what their religious convictions might be. I think you're barking up the wrong tree.

Jack Nelligan

11-06-2009, 01:19 PM

Yeah. When it comes to Pale Horse and Rocket Surgeon, you really don't know what their religious convictions might be. I think you're barking up the wrong tree.

Barking up it...I'd rather do something else on it! ;)

Thanks anyway!

WilliamBoyd8

11-07-2009, 09:44 PM

http://www.brianrxm.com/posts/post_walterhuston_devil.jpg

Walter Huston in the 1941 film "All That Money Can Buy", based on the story
"The Devil and Daniel Webster"

:)

Dr Bones

11-08-2009, 07:34 AM

How exactly would the devil go about destroying God when he has been cast out of heaven and has no power to get back? As for God not destroying the devil, the devil has to live out eternity in a fiery burning hell as eternal punishment and he has to live with the fact that he will never be able to destroy God and his only recourse is to feed off the lost souls of mankind. A mankind that is still being punished for the original sin of Eve in the garden.

And forgiveness is divine...doesn't sound very forgiving does he?

So generations suffer for thousands of years for the taking of one flipping apple? Come on! Harsh!

To me this version of "God" (created by men proclaiming themselves to be knowledgable in such things...:rolleyes: ) sounds petty and gulity of all the small emotions of mankind and therefore to me cannot be God.

Any being capable of wrath, jealousy and bearing a grudge for one small sin for thousands of years can't be the loving, merciful all wise God people claim exists.

For thousands of years man has spouted and dictated the "trrue" intent, word and wisdom of god, often contradicting eachother, even causing wars. S'funny cos I haven't heard God himself say a dammed word.

I'm not saying God doesn't exist...just that every mortal on this planet probably knows diddly about Him, despite what funny hat, collar or title they give themselves.

Rocket Surgeon

11-08-2009, 10:44 AM

...funny cos I haven't heard God himself say a dammed word.

The skull does not speak to everyone, it seems...

Dr Bones

11-08-2009, 03:36 PM

The skull does not speak to everyone, it seems...

Well as I don't wear a dog collar or have a PHD in fantasy...sorry...theology, I would be more likely to be detained under the Mental Health Act for hearing such voices than proclaimed a holy or enlightened man.

Funny how power/position can distort the voice of God. :confused:

I would worry more about the agenda or mental health of those he does "speak" to.

Rocket Surgeon

11-08-2009, 03:59 PM

Well as I don't wear a dog collar or have a PHD in fantasy...sorry...theology, I would be more likely to be detained under the Mental Health Act for hearing such voices than proclaimed a holy or enlightened man.

Funny how power/position can distort the voice of God. :confused:

I would worry more about the agenda or mental health of those he does "speak" to.

Well, like anything administered by man, it's subject to corruption. Even the Devil quoted scripture to for his own ends.

I appreciate your distain, but it shouldn't end there. The "dog collar" isn't a sign of carte blanche. I've know priests who were ass holes and taught by some who held multiple doctorates in science and mathematics. Men of truth and fact.

You do yourself a great disservice, (if you are indeed serious) by applying the blanket label.

By the way, the "skull" reference was merely a jest...

Dr Bones

11-08-2009, 04:14 PM

Well, like anything administered by man, it's subject to corruption. Even the Devil quoted scripture to for his own ends.

I appreciate your distain, but it shouldn't end there. The "dog collar" isn't a sign of carte blanche. I've know priests who were ass holes and taught by some who held multiple doctorates in science and mathematics. Men of truth and fact.

You do yourself a great disservice, (if you are indeed serious) by applying the blanket label.

By the way, the "skull" reference was merely a jest...

I appreciated the crack RS...:D

I am just being..ahem...Devil's advocate...to spark debate.

I acknowledge and completely respect those who had the call to do God's work and admire them for doing so, just as much as I despise the minority who use religion as justification to subjugate or worse still commit the atrocities we are seeing around the world.

I also consider myself a man of faith (and sarcasm). So no, I was not entirely serious. I hardly ever am.

I do however wonder about any word of man that is proclamed to be that of God and how those who do not and cannot truly know him can truly 100% represent him.

What I am saying is I am more inclined to accept the word of God from God than put my complete faith in the words of a fellow mortal.

Rocket Surgeon

11-08-2009, 07:58 PM

So no, I was not entirely serious. I hardly ever am.
Good to hear, now that's out of the way...back to it, you Godless wretch and defiler of everything sacred! The power of Christ compels you!
;)

Stoo

11-08-2009, 08:28 PM

http://www.brianrxm.com/posts/post_walterhuston_devil.jpg

Walter Huston in the 1941 film "All That Money Can Buy", based on the story
"The Devil and Daniel Webster"

:)I want to see that, William! Walter Huston was great.;)

How about the Bill Cosby version of Beelzebub from this long-forgotten Disney movie? (Same year as "Raiders"!)

http://www.moviegoods.com/Assets/product_images/1010/48711.1010.A.jpg

Rocket Surgeon

11-08-2009, 09:28 PM

Weak movie overall, but I did like Peter Stormare...
http://www.hollywoodthrowdown.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/stormare.jpg

...liked Tilda too...hmm