Who's more responsible for Indy 5 delay?

Who is more to blame for Indy 5 delay?

  • George Lucas

    Votes: 21 80.8%

  • Steven Spielberg

    Votes: 2 7.7%

  • Raving Fans

    Votes: 3 11.5%
  • Total voters
    26
Forbidden Eye

Forbidden Eye

Well-known member
I used to think Spielberg was to blame for Indy 4's long delay and why Indy 5 is seeming to be a long-shot more and more(he certainly takes a lot of blame as shown here here)

However, I was looking through my copy of "The Complete Making of Indiana Jones" and I found the beginning of the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull chapter interesting:

J.W. Rinzler said:
"The short version is I thought we'd just barely got by in Indy III because the MacGuffin had always been the problem," Lucas says. "I felt we patched together something to make it seem interesting, if not compelling, but the story with the father carried the movie. So I said, 'I think we've played this thing out.' Steven was kind of interested in doing another one , Harrison was very interested in doing another one , but I was finished with it. I said, 'I'm the one who has to think up the stuff and I can't think up anything.'"
...
In December 1992, Lucas joined Ford for the two-day location shoot in snowy Jackson Hole, Wyoming. "Over the years I'd think about other MacGuffins and stories for Indy IV, but nothing really worked," Lucas says. "But when I was working on Young Indy with Harrison, the obvious suddenly dawned on me: If I did it when Indy was older, I could have it be in the 1950s. And if I did it in the '50s, maybe we could change that into a '50s movie-and what is the equivalent of a 1930s Saturday matinee serial in the '50s? Science-fiction B-movies. I thought, Hey that could be fun. The obvious thing was Earth versus the Flying Saucers, so I thought, That's the MacGuffin: aliens. For God's sake, it can't miss."
Click to expand...

So it seems as though Lucas himself got tired of the Judeo-Christian MacGuffins, so any chance of seeing it in Indy 5 seems doubtful. Also, it took a while for Lucas to actually think of that ingenious <STRIKE>alien</STRIKE> interdimensional-being idea, how long will it take for him to think of another new idea? Will he ever? And of course, how long would they actually create a script with that idea? Look how long it took Indy 4. And of course, Harrison is getting up there in years.

So who's to blame for why Indy 5 isn't in development yet? Lucas or Spielberg?
 
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Stoo

Stoo

Well-known member
It's most likely Lucas because he is the story guy. That said, I don't see why blame must be laid on anyone. George & Steven are not robots programmed to meet public demands. (We were lucky enough to get a 4th film.) Let them do what they want.

Do I wish for another Indy movie? ABSOLUTELY...but it is silly to **** on the creators if it never gets made.

Forbidden Eye, be happy with what we've already been given! That's my philosophy.;)
 
Henry W Jones

Henry W Jones

New member
Stoo said:
It's most likely Lucas because he is the story guy. That said, I don't see why blame must be laid on anyone. George & Steven are not robots programmed to meet public demands. (We were lucky enough to get a 4th film.) Let them do what they want.

Do I wish for another Indy movie? ABSOLUTELY...but it is silly to **** on the creators if it never gets made.

Forbidden Eye, be happy with what we've already been given! That's my philosophy.;)
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I have to agree. We should praise Steven and George for giving us 4 Indiana Jones adventures and tons of other great films. I would also like to see another but.........

edit:But to guess, both. Lucas probably doesn't have a story and Spielberg when he talks about doing KOTCS it seems like he was hesitant to do that one. Plus with all the hate out there for KOTCS probably gives little motivation to start another.
 
InexorableTash

InexorableTash

Active member
Seriously though: if Lucas would let his perfectionist tendencies slip a bit he could have his minions lock Tom Stoppard in a room with a complete collection of Time/Life books and a typewriter, wait a week, then call a conference with Steve and Harrison. The point of a MacGuffin is that the object itself is incidental to the plot.
 
D

Darth Vile

New member
Stoo said:
It's most likely Lucas because he is the story guy. That said, I don't see why blame must be laid on anyone. George & Steven are not robots programmed to meet public demands. (We were lucky enough to get a 4th film.) Let them do what they want.

Do I wish for another Indy movie? ABSOLUTELY...but it is silly to **** on the creators if it never gets made.

Forbidden Eye, be happy with what we've already been given! That's my philosophy.;)
Click to expand...

Agree with you there Stoo.
 
BadDates

BadDates

New member
InexorableTash said:
Seriously though: if Lucas would let his perfectionist tendencies slip a bit he could have his minions lock Tom Stoppard in a room with a complete collection of Time/Life books and a typewriter, wait a week, then call a conference with Steve and Harrison. The point of a MacGuffin is that the object itself is incidental to the plot.
Click to expand...

I completely agree with you there. Since KOTCS I've been working my way through Young Indy and the expanded universe stuff: the Bantam novels, the video games etc. and time and again I find myself thinking "this basic concept would've been fine for a fourth, fifth, sixth etc. Indy movie." I don't really mind what Indy goes after or whom he's running from...I just want to see him being Indy!
 
Forbidden Eye

Forbidden Eye

Well-known member
Stoo said:
That said, I don't see why blame must be laid on anyone. George & Steven are not robots programmed to meet public demands. (We were lucky enough to get a 4th film.) Let them do what they want.
Click to expand...

Actually, I agree. I always thought Lucas gets way more hate then he deserves, and it's no secret here that I really enjoyed Kingdom, and if it were the last Indiana Jones movie, I'd be happily content.

Forbidden Eye, be happy with what we've already been given! That's my philosophy.;)
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I agree. The reason I made this thread was because I do get irked that Ford, Lucas and sometimes Spielberg, tease their fans and keep bringing it up(though that's probably more the fault of the media and the fans) only to keep us waiting with no clear answer whether it'll be made or not. Still, we'll have 4 movies, a television series, several video-games, comics, theme park attractions and lots of toys forever. That's reason enough to be satisfied.
 
M

Montana Smith

Active member
Forbidden Eye said:
I always thought Lucas gets way more hate then he deserves...
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That's because he has the three Star Wars prequels to his name... Spielberg doesn't have those on his conscience.

After all the years of anticipation of three prequels and three sequels, to finally see The Phantom Menace was a huge let down. That was a confidence shaker, and the next two didn't raise much hopes.

Then along came KOTCS, and really it was better, but still a let down. I can't ignore the feeling that Lucas is in a different mindset now. If Spielberg became more serious in tone with regards to history (as John Rhy Davies suggested), then so did Lucas with the heavy political content of the three SW prequels. Yet, Lucas offsets the heavy politics with heavy-handed humour, and the rule that a cliffhanger must be more extreme in order to be 'better' than before. This shows itself throughout KOTCS.

Now that Indy has been re-introduced in this new post-war environment, it's easy to see how Lucasn and Spielberg would get bogged down in discussions about how best to proceed.
 
Attila the Professor

Attila the Professor

Moderator
Staff member
InexorableTash said:
Seriously though: if Lucas would let his perfectionist tendencies slip a bit he could have his minions lock Tom Stoppard in a room with a complete collection of Time/Life books and a typewriter, wait a week, then call a conference with Steve and Harrison. The point of a MacGuffin is that the object itself is incidental to the plot.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I usually think of Stoppard as a great choice too. Last Crusade was comedic, but it was comedic with content. He's all over that script...I'd love to know just how much of the dialogue was actually his. Some rumors suggest just the Henry/Indy stuff, while others indicate nearly all of it. (I'd wager that the scene in Donovan's penthouse is, actually..."that's usually where the ground falls out from underneath your feet" and all that.)

Of course, agreeing with you more or less places the "blame" - which I think is silly, because the story <I>is</I> important - at Lucas's feet. He's not wrong to want the MacGuffin to have some story resonances, however, even if that's really only a big element of the film in the third and fourth films.
 
indyclone25

indyclone25

Well-known member
i would think lucas is the hold up , but i'm not going to blame him , finding those macguffins is a hard thing to do. granted the next indy film will most likely be set in the 60's there will be many things indy couldn't get away with by then , like carrying a gun and whip in his luggage,or thre fact he could carry a gun in any country just at his waist. there is alot of stuff to consider . i would love to see another indy film , but is it really going to happen? i really doubt it. the fans are the ones really bogging down the whole waiting for another movie for me . you hear them complaining and begging and it just hard to hear and see.
 
H

Henry Jones Junior

Member
I think it'd be cool if they did the haunted castle thing Lucas wanted to do for Indy III now. It's been long enough since Poltergeist that Spielberg might not have a big issue playing in that world. It maybe wouldn't require crazy action sequences with CG and also would fit in with Lucas' B Movie aesthetic (50's/60's haunted house films ala The Haunting).
 
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