Star Wars Prequel Trilogy

[raider84]

Whitch was better Epsode 1 or 2:)

I relly think thay almost tie. Thay both were mostly good excepet some parts with anakin:confused:

[wolfgang]

I'll have to say episode 2. I really like em both, thoguht both of m have things I like and things i cna't stand, but episode 2 was MUCH more exciting than I expected it. Plus I also LOVE the duel between dooku and Yoda, and seeing Yoda on a duel has been my dream since the first time i saw empire

[British_Lion_2003]

I thought they were crap and a scar on Star Wars (the real three).

[wolfgang]

Aw, come on, they weren't that bad. I know why people say that (well, i think), and its because everyone wanted something like the first triology, and it was more advanced and some characters were diferent. but if you look at it the way I do, it isn't bad at all, beacause it was going to be like that since the moment George Lucas decided to devide it in two triologies...Now, if it happens with indiana Jones (which it won't) that would be DIFERENT

[vaxer]

I don't really like the first one, I find it pointless and annoying. As for the second one, I thought it was much better but it still had a bad taste (I still went to see it five times). I stick to the first trilogy, cause watching EP1 is so boring that I usually turn the movie off before the end.

[Jedi Daniel]

Star Wars Episode 2 Attack of the Clones was a huge improvement over Star Wars Episode 1 The Phantom Menace. You can't beat the classic Star Wars movies though.

[Kumba]

I think you should change the title to "Which do you think was worse"

[bob]

To be honest although i enjoyed both Ep 1 and 2 as fun movies i cannot really say to particularly like them as films. Episode 1 was a pretty souless CGI movie with extrememly limited character development; Episode 2 was an improvement but the dialouge was so hideously awful in places that it defies logic how anyone could put that into a hugely respected franchise such as Star Wars. There was an awful overuse of CGI in both movies yes CGI can work but not for things that main characters are supposed to be involved in CGI should be used as next gen mattee paintings really - to build up the background not to entirely make up environments wholly.

[indydude]

exactly! that is one of the things that bothers me about the prequels, it is like a really high tech video game, they did not have one actor play a clone trooper even in the close ups, it is fine to use CGI when it is necessary but it dominated the whole movie! I hope to see an improvment in EP3. and the diologue was horrible, it lacked all that suttle humor the old ones had, instead it had stuff like c-3p0's head being replaced by a battle droid's head which is supposed to be funny but is really not. overall 2 was better than 1.

[Canyon]

http://www.fox.co.uk/i/posters/swepii_buy_big.gif

Episode II by far!

I like Episode I, although I agree with Bob, in that it could have done with some more character development, but it some ways, the more I see that film the more I like it.
Now for Episode II. When I saw that in the cinema, I was totally blown away. I thought the story was excellent, and I really liked the way that the story slowly unfolded and also the way in which Anakin's character has developed.

I know there is more to a film than special effects, but I have to hand it to these guys. ILM did the most amazing job and one of my favourite scenes is when Anakin and Obi Wan are driving in mid air. Seeing that in the cinema was amazing. You felt like you were actually in that car. I also loved the scene where Yoda fights Dooko. I thought that was done really well.

Having recently seen the extras on the DVD (they're about 3 1/2 hrs long!) I was really impressed and I really don't understand why people slag off this film. To my way of thinking, it's brillaint, and I really think that George Lucas in back on form, which gives me confidence in Indy 4!


http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/38172000/jpg/_38172940_clones300.jpg"You know I don't like it when you do that!!"

http://www.azcentral.com/ent/gifs/1107newon.jpg"Wow! Go Yoda!"

[Indy4ever]

I believe Ep. II is better, but The Empire Strikes Back will always be my favorite. ESB is just a great film. The story is tight and flows beautifully. I also like that the three main characters (being Han, Luke and Leia) really undergo significant character development.

If you think about, probably 90% of the world population has heard the line, "Luke, I am your father."

[Indygirl21]

i know both movies have gotten a bad rap (and personally, i think ep. 1 deserved it, that movie gave star wars a bad name) but ep.2 was very entertaining and fit in more with the original ideas of the trilogy. plus you gotta love that yoda-count dooku scene, that was awesome! yoda is my hero! lol. ooh and the scene with C3PO was really funny, when he says "im quite beside myself" and all that. but the original trilogy is ten billion times better

[westford]

Episode II, but if they cut out the stupid romantic picnic scenes it'd be better. And Anakin's 'wet dream' about his mother. :rolleyes: The Zam Wessel chase part was cool though, and the CGI was generally better than Ep I - less 'fluffy' too.

[Nox]

First, IIRC, Vader actually never says, "Luke, I am your father."

Second, I didn't like either of them. Like the Matrix and other new action movies, they're simply showcases for the CGI guys. I also thought that the whole Anakin-turning-towards-the-Dark-Side scene was extremely cheesy and full of cliches. II was better than I though, at least it had some interesting action scenes. (I'm a sucker for big battles scenes - I love watching hundreds of guys march toward their deaths, as long as they're CGI robots or clones, of course)

[wolfgang]

NOx, what do you mean he never says it? He does,, everyone's seen it. unless your being specific and saying that what he said was "No, Luke, I am your father" instead of "Luke, I am your father." But hats just being, well...specific. I guess your right, though

[Leia Organa Solo]

Episode II: Attack of the Clones by far.

Oh man, there was some much irony in that movie...and yes...I cry during that movie as well.

Did anyone see it in IMAX?

[indydude]

AotC was WAY better than ep1 (which was sickening excuse for a Star Wars movie) but that does not mean it was any good, OK I must admit the Yoda vs. Dooku battle was neet, but the movie still was terrible. I refuse to think of the prequals as SW movies. I hope to see a MAJOR improvement in ep3, and I also hope Lucas does not direct it (although he will) because the originals were good but the prequals sucked, and the old ones were not really directed by Lucas. sorry prequal fans but I am sickened by by the prequals.

[Jedi Daniel]

If you would accept the prequels for what they are and stop critisizing them and comparing them to the original trilogy you might enjoy them.

[indydude]

you are right, they do tell the story and I guess that is what matters.

[wolfgang]

Yeah, well, Jedi Daniel, I love both triologies...well the prequels not yet a trilogy but. anyway, I can understand if some people do not like the prequels when comparing it with the old one, i don't know how it feels becasue (thoguh my favorite trilogy id indy) I love em both, but i wouldn't fight back defending it because I try to know how it feels. its sort of as if indy passes his hat and whip to another person and then making a trilogy of that person...i think. i hope i typed my message the way i wanted.

[swords]

Im thinking AotC here...

[Edited by swords on 06-25-2003 at 07:42 pm]

[DutchIndy]

EP: II

[H. Jones Jnr]

Oooh I gotta disagree with all of you.

I much prefer EP:1, although I don't think it's a fantastic film.
Simply put, I found EP:2 too much - too much everything. It ran at a break neck pace (which only Return of the Jedi could be charged with) and quite frankly felt like it was really trying to compete with the Matrix.

I find EP:1 a much purer film for this reason. Purer in intention as well as a much more rounded story with a complete ending. It was old fashioned film making.

Whereas EP:2 was George Lucas crapping his underpants worrying about how they're gonna compare it to the next Matrix film.

Plus, I found Yoda's sabre fight at the end just plain embarrasing. It was quite clearly just a gratuitous crowd pleaser that would make the masses chuckle.

In contrast EP:1's sword fight at the end was perhaps the best sword fight I've ever seen. Granted some of it was CG, but the majority wasn't.

For the reasons above I believe EP:1 to be more "Star Wars" than EP:2 - a Matrix wannabe.

[wolfgang]

You know, I really don't think it was comprting against the Matrix. I found them both quite different. And, come on, so the Yoda duel was funny, so what? it was awsome in my opinion. I loved it...o well

[indy148]

I always thought that the last two looked more futuristic then the 4, 5 & 6 !!!! I mean , they are supposed to take place before the last trilogy.,..

[wolfgang]

Yes, thats true, but thats only because we are on the the 21st century, for example, if you look at Lukes's house in episode 2 it looks better than in episode 4(excluding the fact that its suppose to look older anyway since its a few years after episode four), but its the same anyway....besides, George was aware of this, i read he did it on purpouse, why??? I dunno.

[Jedi Daniel]

The reason why the the prequels look more fresh, clean and futuristic is because the Empire hasn't taken over yet. When we get to the originals everything is a mess, dirty and old because of the Empire. This was done on purpose.

[intergamer]

in response to the subtle humor thing, the prequels lack a Han Solo persona (aka Indiana Jones)...Han Solo made the originals for me

[Indycrusader]

Oh, yeah, Han did it all. Without Han, or let's just say Ford, you lose the humor of the movie. And the cute rogue.
I like Ep II better, but the trilogy will never be beat. Ep I was too much politics. Ruined the movie. Without the battles at the end, Ep I would have been a complete failure. Which it almost was anyway.

[Paul]

I don't know why Episode 1 and 2 get such unjustifed comments, I really don't. I'd like to know what is so terrible about them; really would like to know. Because the Episode 1 and 2 I seen were fantastic films.

Many people would disagree that they are inferior films, In fact not only myself but friends, and online friends, even family have agreed with me that Episode 2 is one of the best. IMO Lucas has BRILLIANTLY written the prequels so far. And yes- some of the dialogue is "bad". But the dialogue HAS been "bad" in SW movies since 1977. I don't see why now it upsets people. If the next complaint will go to CG then once again..I don't understand people. Technology has advanced. Lucas can't just go ahead and build thngs like Kamino.

Anyway onto Episode 1; it has to be the most underrated film since The Temple of Doom. People don't like the childish "kiddy" aspect of it (I think some people forget that SW is actually a kids series)- but I will tell you right now, when Episode III comes out, you will most likely look back at Episode I and see why Lucas made it the way it is and laid down the character development in droves, and you will probably love it. If you still don't; then I'm very sorry. But don't expect people like me to understand why you can't.

With that said, I guess I'd have to choose Episode 2. I guess because it's more "mature" in nature, I can't think of much I don't like about it. there are soo many things about Episode 2 I love that I don't want this post to go on for too long so Ill just leave it here:

It's my favorite of the Star Wars films. Yes that's right, I like it better than the overatted Empire. Do you're worst.

[Edited by Paul on 10-20-2003 at 04:25 pm]

[Indy 4]

Of the Star Wars prequals made so far, I would say I like Episode II the better between the both of them. Episode I was good, but Episode II was more in depth with the characters and storyline. It was way more mature in it's story than Episode I. I also like Count Dooku/Darth Tyrannus better than Darth Maul. Dooku was much more interesting, and was not built for hype like Darth Maul. I also liked who they show the relationship that Obi-Wan and Anakin have, and how it is eventually crumbling apart.
Even though Episode II is my favorite of the Star Wars prequals so far, my favorite Star Wars film over all is THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK. In Empire the story was excellent, the conflict between good and evil is very well represented with the battle between Luke and Darth Vader. Plus Empire has the strongest revalation out of all the Star Wars films. When Vader told Luke he was his father, that set a VERY strong mark in the Star Wars saga. The Empire Strikes back is truely as Classic Star Wars as you can get.

[Brock]

"NOx, what do you mean he never says it? He does,, everyone's seen it. unless your being specific and saying that what he said was "No, Luke, I am your father" instead of "Luke, I am your father." But hats just being, well...specific. I guess your right, though"
Actually, it's not, "Luke, I am your father," nor is it, "No Luke, I am your father." It's simply, "No. I am your father."

[jamie]

I cant stand Ep1. I thought it was terrible, one of the biggest disappointments of my movie going life. And I really wanted to like it. It was just terrible throughout.
The movie wasnt even neccessary and there was no point to it, it didnt really tell us anything we didnt know. Then theres the Jar Jar aspect, which Im sure I dont need to explain, there was Jake Loyd who couldnt have been any more irritating, there was long pointless scenes that were nothing but an excuse for CGI, such as the Pod race, and then the dodgy fake looking battle between the battle droids (which were terrible in themselves, kind of like robotic Donald Ducks) and the Gungans. This battle never come close to any of the ground battles in the OT, and crappy looking droids are no substitute for Stormtroopers.
The only thing this movie had going for it was the saber duel at the end.

Attack Of The Clones, on the other hand, I thought was excellent. It totally exceeded my expectations, and it was much closer to feeling like a Star Wars movie. You've gotta love seeing the clone army of Stormtroopers for the first time or seeing the Star Destroyers launching with the Imperial March playing. Great stuff.
And unlike in TPM, Ewan McGregor was great as Obi Wan.
The only fault with this movie was the romance between Anakin and Padme, which was corny and painful to watch in the extreme. He should have just made it more casual like Han and Leia in the OT.
Jim

[merancapeman]

THEY BOTH STINK! They don't follow the story at all! If you remember Yoda's wise words, "Power does not make one great". If power does not make one great, whats up with the Puppet on speed scene with Dooku? I have to go soon, so i'll make this quick, but in Episode one, just an example, WHAT THE HECK IS A NUCLEAR REACTOR DOING IN A DOCKING BAY!!!

[Katarn07]

Yeah, I like 'em but not as much as the originals. I mean, The Phantom Menace doesn't seem as epic as any of the others and for that it suffers. Plus you just wanna kill Jake Lloyd because he can't act!

Attack of the Clones would have been as good as the originals save for the corny love story.... what was George doing?! The romance in Empire Strikes Back and all the Indy movies was a kijillion times better than... than... than that.

Oh yes, Episode III will definately be the best of them. Not only will it be epic (if George can do that still), but the pictures are stunning and beautiful. They have some retro looking control panels and some neat sets remeniscent to the originals.

I just wanted to see what you thought of them since so many people seem to hate them. Oh, and if you don't even like SW at all that belongs in another topic.

[Ayrun]

I found it difficult to chose one of the four options….

You see, I thought those 2 movies were okay… but not near as good as the originals.
But I can't say they completely 'sucked'.
- sigh –
So I went for 'good'… although that might be a bit overrated. ;)

[skywlkrinc]

I like them both, but definitely not as much as the Original Original Trilogy (my thoughts on the Special Editions should be known......Han Solo shoots FIRST!!!!! The original Sy Snootles song was better!! The rest of the changes were somewhat acceptable)

The prequels do suffer from poor acting (Lloyd, and Hayden at times) and some lame sub plots (the entirety of Anakin and Padme on Naboo), and some really poorly developed and way too comical characters (Jar Jar, Dex). However, for the most part Lucas made up for it with the sheer coolnes of the lightsaber battles. Come on, face it.....we ALL wanted to see some serious Jedi fighting. Though, the Anakin/Dooku final fight was lame and the Yoda/Dooku fight (Remember Yoda is my all time favorite Star Wars character and Lucas can't go wrong with more Yoda) was a little too comical and far fetched with Yoda jumping around like a maniac. The two prequels as a whole are pretty good.

I hope Episode 3 will meet all of our expectations (Anakin/Vader vs. Obi-Wan ultimate Jedi battle in the lava pits), but I'm already prepared for a little dissappointment, but I still have faith in Lucas.

I've read rumors that the Original Trilogy DVDs will not contain the Original Trilogy, nor the Special Editions of '97, but some kind of new Special Special Editions with more butchery...er...improvements....upon the trilogy (let's hope this is a false rumor)

Luke

[LASTCRUSADER]

I thought both films were good. I also think that they get a bad wrap. Sure they aren't as good as the originals but I still find myself watching them quite a bit.

[Finn]

They were not masterpieces like the original trilogy, but quite enjoyable rides. Decent flicks at least. Nothing fancy though, but likeable.

[Junior Jones]

I'm not a Star Wars fan, but I liked them a lot.

From my experience, the people who really hate them are Star Wars fans who went in with high expectations that the prequels couldn't possibly meet.

When you go into the theater expecting to see the greatest movie ever made and it turns out to be a pretty good movie, that's a major disappointment. If you expect to see a pretty good movie and its turns out to be pretty good, you're satisfied.

That's why I'm not getting my hopes up for Indy 4. I'm expecting it to be good, but not as good as Raiders. Hopefully I'll be pleasantly surprised.

[Finn]

Originally posted by Renderking Fisk
Leia was a slut for kissing two men.
...other one of them actually being her brother. Now that is <i>too</i> much even up to this date! Save our children from such abuse!

[Katarn07]

I think Junior Jones has a point. The thing about them being 'just good and not great' to the SW fans is probably true. I don't think they're great but I was able to see them being some good movies. I still think George could do some better casting and writing as far as love goes. I say forget trying to make them all a PG rating (heck, if a PG-13 rating were around when the others were made, I'm sure at least Empire would be rated that) and do what needs to be done to give us an excellent story instead of an ok one.

[bob]

I am not really the worlds biggest Star Wars fan (although I will buy the DVDs)I have a fondness for the series but thats about it.

I think that the PT considering the amount of money and the talent behind it is enormously dissapointing, and I don't see how anyone can argue otherwise they are just for me ropey bland PT movies because of:

1- An absolutely dreadful script, I love the background of GL's universe and the mythos but the scripts are simply dreadful. The dialogue is awful even for something being intentionally corny and the stories lack dramatic hook.
2- Overuse of CGI. Apart from a few beautiful shots in PM the CGI in the PT really is deprimental to the movies, the actors performances have become more and more wooden as a result of not acting with real actors, and there is a sense of superficiality to the action series; no one seems genuinely endangered.
3- Completely superficial characters. Obi-Wan lacks any sort of depth to his character through two movies, and Anakin's performance in SWII has all the subtlty of being run over by a bus.

As a result i just can't sit through them although I would like to enjoy them.

[Katarn07]

Ewan McGregor's performance is one of the highlights of the movies (as was Liam Neeson's in TPM).

And as for Anakin, I felt his crying about his commiting murder is one of the better scenes in all of the movies.

And the thing with the CGI and a lot of the dialogue.... Oh wait, I agree with those ;)

[westford]

Originally posted by Ayrun
I found it difficult to chose one of the four options….

You see, I thought those 2 movies were okay… but not near as good as the originals.
But I can't say they completely 'sucked'.
- sigh –
So I went for 'good'… although that might be a bit overrated. ;)
Same goes for me. Thanks Ayrun, you saved me some writing! ;)

[skywlkrinc]

I never said I didn't think the prequels were good. Hell, I waited in line at the Chinese Theatre in Hollywood to get tickets for both of them. I'm just saying Lucas could have and should have done better, but for the most part they are really good movies. Episode 2 is way better than Episode 1, but it was supposed to be like that. Lucas had a lot of stuff to develop during Ep1.

Luke

[Canyon]

I quite enjoyed Episode I: The Phantom Menace and felt that it was an entertaining film.

My favourite part was the fight scene between Qui Gon Jin, Obi Wan Kenobi and Darth Maul.

I can honestly say that I thoroughly enjoyed watching Episode II: Attack of the Clones, and felt that it was not only an entertaining film but it was also a film that blew me away and I felt that every scene was done extremely well.

What I don't understand is why people compare Episode I to Episode II because by rights, they are two different types of movie. I feel that Attack of the Clones is if anything a much darker film, something that Empire Strikes Back managed to achieve.

Not for one moment do I believe that Episodes I and II are anywhere in the league of Episodes IV, V and VI but they are, in my opinion, highly enjoyable films to watch. ;)

[Indy's_main_man]

I gotta be the wet blanket

I didn't enjoy either. They were very long and drawn out. Overrated If you ask me.

[Strider]

Episode 2 was a big fat waste of money! What a bunch of poodoo it was! I can't believe I could stand whaching the whole movie!

[Indy's_main_man]

Episode one wasn't exactly up to snuff with the original triology either

[Strider]

Yeah, but it had SOME good elements....... But not much.

[Indy's_main_man]

The pod racing subplot didn't have too much bearing on the story

[Strider]

And Jake Loyd was intolerable!

[Kate]

All right. *prepares to get flamed*

I think all the SW movies suck. George Lucas is simply not a good writer or director. He's just an egomaniac who has a lot of influence in Hollywood because of his money.

[Ayrun]

Lucas was the brain behind the Indy movies... so.. I wouldn't be that hard on him.

[Kate]

But Speilberg was the director..... and that makes all the difference.

[Indy's_main_man]

amen.......that's all I can say. I think he's in it for the money. He comes off greedy. "let's make more and more films because we know the fan base will go because it has 'star wars' on it"

[Kate]

It's all about the merchandising, agreed? If there were no action figures, gummi fruit snacks, wading pools, etc. all featuring Jar Jar binks on them, there would be no SW period. But I STILL think Han Solo is hot.

[Ayrun]

Okay.. Listen; I agree that these prequels weren't all that necessary if you ask me. In fact.. I think it been better if he hadn't made them at all… although it's always a pleasure to see Yoda again ;) ….
But without Lucas there was no Indy. I rest my case.

[Indy's_main_man]

Indy was the best thing he did.

[Kate]

OK.

And as I hate arguements, I rest mine too.

Yoda rules.

Peace out.

[vaxer]

Originally posted by Indy's_main_man
amen.......that's all I can say. I think he's in it for the money. He comes off greedy. "let's make more and more films because we know the fan base will go because it has 'star wars' on it"

Even thought I'm not much of a G. Lucas fan anymore since he slightly damaged the SW trilogy with the prequals (EP1 especially), I wouldn't say it's all for the money. When you think of it Lucas hasn't made many films, he could have made millions of SW films taking place somewhere in the infinite SW timeline. What I believe is thet this guy just forgot how to write (or forgot to hire a writer to write his wonderful ideas). Plus what would you do if you owned the SW franchise? I'd go nuts...like him.

[Strider]

Originally posted by Ayrun
Lucas was the brain behind the Indy movies... so.. I wouldn't be that hard on him.

I've said It before and I'll say it again:
Spielberg made Indy what he is!

[Strider]

Err... I didn't mean to quote you Ayrun, I meant to quote Kate. Oops.

[Ayrun]

Well.. hey.. I'm not going to disagree with you.. but Indy is a creation of both Spielberg AND Lucas.
And that's a fact.
I have no problem with Spielberg and no problem with Lucas. They both made some great movies.. and they both made some 'not-so-great' movies. But hell... nobody's perfect.

[Indy's_main_man]

Originally posted by Kate
OK.

And as I hate arguements, I rest mine too.

Yoda rules.

Peace out.

It's not yoda that ruled. It was Frank Oz, who did the voice. He also did the voice of fozzy bear on the muppets. Plus he just directed "the stepford Wives"

back to the topic at hand, yes, Lucas thought up Indy. However, he was just the producer. Spielberg was the main man. It seems George has forgotten that with this whole Indy 4 script rewrite thing. The point is that Lucas didn't have a reason, other then money, to make the prequels.

Ayrun , name a bad Spielberg movie

[Ayrun]

1941

[Finn]

To me, Lucas reminds the type of a fan fiction writer who puts his works in databases and asks for feedback... but awaits nothing but positive comments, e.g. the type of fellow to whom it's enough that he himself likes his works.

Now, if you go in and tell him it's decent stuff, maybe even good, but there are points here and there you could add in more or take out or edit somehow generally to make it even more better... and he attacks you, telling you something about his artistical liberties or separate point of views... or practically says out loud its his story, not yours.

But these guys still tend to do it because they like what they do and enjoy it... so they're not that bad.

Of course, can't really say Lucas would have done exactly something like this, but if he would like to please the audience more, it could be useful for him to consult another professional writer who is in reputation of being a good one. Not because he thinks no one can know SW better than he does, but to get hints about how to polish the basic aspects of structure and such every piece of fiction has.

[Ayrun]

Originally posted by Indy's_main_man
back to the topic at hand, yes, Lucas thought up Indy. However, he was just the producer. Spielberg was the main man. It seems George has forgotten that with this whole Indy 4 script rewrite thing. The point is that Lucas didn't have a reason, other then money, to make the prequels.

Lucas made the original Star Wars trilogy and contributed (in my mind far more than 'just a producer') a lot to the Indiana Jones movies.
He may mess(ed) up the prequels (although the opinions differ on that), but I believe he still earns some respect.
Fisk and Finn are right.
Lucas doesn't need to make these prequels for the money. He does it because he feels it was the right moment to make them.

Originally posted by Indy's_main_man
Ayrun , name a bad Spielberg movie

And please don't use the SW prequels created by Lucas to put Spielberg on a pedestal. Spielberg isn't perfect, nor are his movies.
Besides; a 'bad' movie doesn't exist… Yes, I know I answered the question anyway.. but it's simply a matter of taste.. Even the worst movie around has at least 1 fan.

[Finn]

Originally posted by Indy's_main_man
Indy was the best thing he did.

There is a "prequel" to Raiders that is generally considered by many mainstream movie critics as a mediocre movie... so we should not wait for people to say that it's all great with Indy either (if we go outside this gig, of course).

Now, I can't remember who was the name of the reviewer who put this in when ToD was doing a screening in telly.

If Raiders of the Lost Ark last week was a noble stallion galloping down the open plains of adventure, then this one probably goes nowhere except down the meat factory processing line.

Lucas knew how to make bad movies even back then... or at least movies that were misunderstood.

<small>Yes, ToD is a great adventure movie, at least compared to the ones we've had lately... and I still find even <i>these</i> decent.</small>

[Indy's_main_man]

Trust me...I have no problem with misunderstood movies. I think I've stated before that one of my favorite movies was "Toys"...that was panned by the critics but it's whismey has developed a sort of fan base. I also like "death to smoochy" but that's a whole different story.

I'm not using Lucas to make spielberg seem godly or anything. But you have to admit, Lucas as a director, hasn;t made many solid films besides thre trilogy.

[Finn]

Originally posted by Indy's_main_man
Lucas as a director, hasn;t made many solid films besides thre trilogy. Which trilogy are you talking about now? The IJ trilogy or the original Star Wars trilogy?

Just asking, because out of all those six films, Lucas has directed only one.

[Finn]

Anyone else seen "Plan 9 from Outer Space" by Ed Wood? This flick is offically considered the worst movie ever made. However, it's so bad a movie you almost start considering it a parody and goes over the line, then you like it just for the heck of it.

[Ayrun]

Originally posted by Renderking Fisk
There's a western called "Defiant"... perhaps the WORST movie ever made. There are some movies that have some good qualities, but I dare you to watch that western and find me one good thing about it.

Double DOG dare you.


Okay, If I have the chance, I'll have a look. :)

But even if I hate it… that doesn't mean I take back what I said. (sorry.. I'm kind of stubborn)
Somewhere out there, there might be someone who likes it.. or at least doesn't find it all that bad.

btw.. I looked at us.imdb .. but can't seem to find it...

[bungle92]

You know, Im actually looking forward to seeing Episode 3. Call me crazy, but I have a feeling this film may be pretty good and restore our faith in the series. I mean this is after all the last Star Wars that's ever gonna be released and maybe Lucas has finally noticed the voices of disappointment from us fans over episodes 1 and 2 to go the extra mile and try to make the film good. I'm sad at the same time that this will be the end of the film series. I can't think of a time in my life when Star Wars (and Indiana Jones) wasn't part of my vocabulary. I look forward to seeing this like Batman Begins in '05.

On a further note, I've grown to like Attack of the Clones. It's flawed allright but I find stuff to enjoy about it.

[Ayrun]

Well… I don't hold that high hopes for episode 3.
It might be better than the 2 others, but how great this third one may be; it cannot make up for what's missing is the other two parts…
Don't get me wrong; episode 1 and 2 are good movies.. and despite the fact that we actually should not compare them with the originals (because they're all part of the same story) many of us do. And if you compare them, the originals – for most of us – are way better then the 2 prequels.
I only wonder if the third part is able to link the prequels with the originals. That the next time we speak about Star Wars we're speaking of all six of them.. or if we're still dividing them into 2 parts.

[Aaron H]

The main difference between the original and the prequels is that the original was Science-Fantasy and the prequels are Science-Fiction. Two entirely differently genres.

[Ayrun]

Yeah.. good point.
That would mean.. in order for the third to link the first 2 with the original 3.. the third episode would have to be something in between science-fiction and science-fantasy…

[Ivo]

There are no words to describe how much these movies suck.

I'm a huge fan of the original series but the prequels have been largely lame. I do find some things about them I like but the bad far outweighs the good. As loyal as I am to the overall story I can't overlook poor film making.

Reasons why I don't like them:

The Scripts:

Two of the worst scripst written for major motion pictures in many, many years if not ever. There's no excuse for this either. Lucas should have torn down his ego a bit and realized what a poor writer he is overall. He should have created a storyline to follow with the basics of the plot and hired a team of great writers to fill in the details and make a good script.

The Acting:

Incredibly poor acting by most. You can excuse some of the actors like Ewan, Jackson and a few others due to poor scripts as mentioned earlier but Hayden and Natalie's acting jobs couldn't be saved by the best script in the world. One thing that made me realize Lucas went for style over substance with a few of the actors cast was a tidbit from the Phantom Menace documentaries. One of them shows the final decision process in casting Jake Lloyd in the role of young Anakin. It is painfully obvious to me that the other kid could actually act. Jake could not, period, and no one has ever been able to convince me otherwise. Jake appears to have had the right look and thus got the part. There were many stories about how hard it was for Lucas to get a decent performance out of Jake once cameras were rolling and this didn't suprise me one bit. He also hasn't gotten an acting job since then so I rest my case.

Directing/FX:

Too much CGI. Many scenes which are meant to be impressive end up looking far too cartoonish. I really feel that Lucas should have lightened up on trying to show everything we missed from the first movies and just made it more of an insular affair. One thing that could have helped is if he had simply integrated more real sets into the production and had more of a balance between them and CGI effects. LOTR is a great example of balancing the two. I still shudder at many scenes that look like blue screen nightmares such as the part where Padme falls from the ship in AOTC.

Overall these movies have shown that Lucas isn't really the genius that we all thought he was. In fact, if you look at his track record he isn't very original overall. Both Indiana Jones and Star Wars were updates of older ideas and themes though done very well for modern audiences. His best movie ideas have always fared better when he didn't direct them himself.

Rant over.

[Indy's_main_man]

He makes a good point. Lucas is turning into an eccentric old coot. hiding in his house rewriting the script hoping all the fans won't dislike him...even though a lot do.

[Katarn07]

Originally posted by Finn
Anyone else seen "Plan 9 from Outer Space" by Ed Wood? This flick is offically considered the worst movie ever made. However, it's so bad a movie you almost start considering it a parody and goes over the line, then you like it just for the heck of it.

That movie's for real?! I thought it was just a madeup movie written for Seinfeld. It's the movie they're going to see when they're waiting in the Chinese Restraunt and then later the one Kramer spills his hot coffee and starts that big law suit.

On topic, I still have high hopes for Ep III in terms of atmosphere. I've seen some pics and even some videos that have leaked outta the Hyperspace section of their website (you gotta pay to get in even if you subscribe to the magazine :rolleyes: ) and they look great. I saw pictures of Mon Mothma (a minor character from Return of the Jedi) and she looks great. I've seen a picture of Tarkin (the Grand Moff from A New Hope) and he looks great. There's a Mon Calamari (a species in Return of the Jedi. I think this is the first time they're in the prequels! I could be wrong about that though....) and I even saw a very low res video clip of Ewan and Hayden sparring in tee shirts. Looked sweet :cool:

[Finn]

Originally posted by Matthias1138
That movie's for real?! I thought it was just a madeup movie written for Seinfeld. It's the movie they're going to see when they're waiting in the Chinese Restraunt and then later the one Kramer spills his hot coffee and starts that big law suit. Yep, that movie's pretty much for real (http://akas.imdb.com/title/tt0052077/).

[Gobi-1]

I absolutley love the prequels. They're just as good as the original films IMO. I'd even ranked them above the Indy films.

[Katarn07]

The title for the last installment was announced today:

Star Wars: Episode III: Revenge of the Sith

I like it. Lots of folks think it's just another dumb prequel name but I think it fits the mood. It's also a nod to the original trilogy's last installment, Star Wars: Episode VI: Return of the Jedi.

I think this movie is going to be spectacular. If the romance is not present or at least better written than AotC, it'll be just as good (hopefully better) than the originals.

[Finn]

Originally posted by Katarn07
I like it. Lots of folks think it's just another dumb prequel name but I think it fits the mood. It's also a nod to the original trilogy's last installment, Star Wars: Episode VI: Return of the Jedi. Yeah, as we know, the original Ep VI title was supposed to be <i>Revenge of the Jedi</i>.

[Katarn07]

Actually it was never intended to be that but one of those things Lucas did to ensure no one realized Anakin would be redeemed. He is the the Jedi that is returning afterall. Also, why would a Jedi seek revenge?

I also read in an interview with Mark Hamill that David Prowse said 'No, Obi-Wan killed your father' instead of 'No, I am your father' to ensure the plot point didn't leak out before the movie came out.

The Wookie homeworld (Kashyyyk) is going to be in it I hear. I suppose that's where we'll see Chewbacca.

[Gobi-1]

The fan club section of Starwars.com posted 42 peices of Kashyyyk artwork and it is simply stunning.

[Rick5150]

Finn says:
Anyone else seen "Plan 9 from Outer Space" by Ed Wood? This flick is offically considered the worst movie ever made. However, it's so bad a movie you almost start considering it a parody and goes over the line, then you like it just for the heck of it.
I bought this movie on DVD about two years ago and printed out a detailed list (http://www.angelfire.com/il/dauber/PLAN-9.html)of all the bloopers and when they occurred. Then I sat back with a whisky and followed along. Hysterical. My favorite part is that Bela Lugosi really died during filming and they replaced his character with a stand-in who bore no resemblance to him whatsoever. To hide the fact, he holds a cape over his face for the remainder of his scenes. Well, that and the fantastic dialog. For example, "Visits? That would indicate visitors!" Funniest serious movie I ever saw.

[Katarn07]

Originally posted by Renderking Fisk
Link?

Can't link stuff to 'Hyperspace' which I subscribed to reluctantly to get my hands on some exclusive figure. You also get the Insider magazine (which I've subscribed to for the past seven years) so I suppose all I really did was renew. I saw the pics and they're simply stunning. I am thinking of ending my membership after RotS is released.

I know where to find a bunch of pics so if anyone's interested, just send me a PM. I'm not hosting the images either so I'm not doing anything illegal.

[intergamer]

George Lucas was notorious in the original trilogy for going against all the better knowledge of everybody working on the movie, and ferociously, continuously forcing the actors to Speak Faster, Speak Faster, deliver the lines faster. It made all the cheesy dialogue seem to work, seem to make sense, and added to the immersion. George Lucas seems to have lost his fire though. Listen to the prequels, listen to the dialogue in RotS. It would all work if it was spoken very quickly, over-the-top quickly, as in the original trilogy. Every single character talks like a steamboat out of gas, even Anakin (compare to Luke). A line from epIII like "I'm worried about you, they think you're under too much stress"; it's extremely lame is spoken slowly, pompously, but makes sense if its delivered at conversational, or faster-than-conversational speed. Why do you think we bought cheese like "But I wanted to go to Taschi station and pick up some power converters!". We bought pounds and pounds of that cheese.

Faster = More Natural
Lucas used to be obsessive about this, what happened?

The only character who should speak dramatically is Palpatine (and he does, and it's the only natural-sounding acting in the movie)

[IAdventurer01]

Wow... I think you may be on to something. I never noticed that before, :confused:

So, we should watch the prequels on DVD on slowest fast forward to accellerate the sound? :rolleyes:

[Junior Jones]

Would getting the movies in PAL format be enough, or does it need to be faster than that?

[Jay R. Zay]

i don't think this is the point. ;) PAL is, in fact, only 25FPS : 24FPS faster than cinema film. which is a fraction of 1/25th of a second. this probably doesn't change so much.

[intergamer]

It's OK Junior-Jones, they don't have sarcasm in Germany.

[intergamer]

You can't just speed up the movie, because the battles are too fast; the jedi are too good with the lightsabers, the blades don't seem to have any real weight to them.

[Jay R. Zay]

It's OK Junior-Jones, they don't have sarcasm in Germany.

;)

the rest of this is an explanation why, whether a joke or not, PAL has almost nothing to do with acceleration. and as probably video formats are not common knowledge AND there is no connection to reality about this "sarcasm", it probably isn't very suitable for a joke, wouldn't you agree? perhaps you could just reduce your superiority and omniscience to a level that a german could bear. thank you for your contribution to international understanding.

[intergamer]

perhaps you could just reduce your superiority and omniscience to a level that a german could bear. thank you for your contribution to international understanding.

No problem. Try not to invade Belgium before I finish talking here. Ready?

The humor to me came from the fact that it is apparent that watching the movies in PAL won't do anything because they're really at the same speed.

There. What? You conquered France already? You silly Germans!

[Deadlock]

No problem. Try not to invade Belgium before I finish talking here. Ready?

:D That's hilarious.

[Jay R. Zay]

The humor to me came from the fact that it is apparent that watching the movies in PAL won't do anything because they're really at the same speed.

but they aren't at the same speed. could it be you who is poorly informed or who sees a joke in anything he doesn't fully understand? or is this a joke, too, that my non-existing german humor doesn't understand?

try to make sure that what you think is a joke actually is a joke and that what you think is a fact actually is a fact. i think this is even more hilarious than jokes about germany. :D

[intergamer]

but they aren't at the same speed. could it be you who is poorly informed or who sees a joke in anything he doesn't fully understand? or is this a joke, too, that my non-existing german humor doesn't understand?

YES... it is...

In conversion, the speed is normally adjusted for the framerate difference (it only plays well at one speed). In all honesty, one can actually tell the distinction. Now, that's far beyond the point - in my post "at the same speed" meant "basically at the same speed", you should have taken that so literally. At any rate, I thought Junior Jones was funny, and the US is home to the greatest comedians of all time, so there you are.

[Colonel Vogel]

Just saw Revenge of the Sith and thought it was excellent. Ewan McGregor was great as Obi-Wan and Yoda kicked the Emperor's butt. It was a shame Jar Jar's scenes were cut so much. However, Ep. 3 is now my favorite Star Wars movie after A New Hope. :cool:

[Pale Horse]

After recently pulling a 4/6 marathon, I would have to say intergamers assessment of the patterns of speech is dead on, which surprises me just a little as I don't ever give him enough credit as a linguistic man.

[Indydan13]

[QUOTE=Colonel Vogel] It was a shame Jar Jar's scenes were cut so much. /QUOTE]

It's good to see there's at least one person who enjoys Lucas'....well..."characters of the prequals". (I hope you weren't being sarcastic or I'd look like a dumba**)

I agree with Intergamer. Too many slowly spoken lines made one want to fall asleep at some points. There was only 2 performances in the prequals that came somewhat close to the original 2 GREAT performances in the OT were Obi-Wan and Yoda, though Yoda got annoying after a while.

You may be asking who the two OT GREAT performances were? Well, in my opinion....Darth Vader (dur) and the best Pirate shown onscreen...Han Solo.

[roundshort]

Hey, Luke was a whiny bitch no matter how slow or fast he talked, but you at least carried about him. Anakin was a whiny bitch that you just want to beat up. The problem with the the I to III is that Lucas never built a team you carried about. When they needed ships, they had ships, needed speeders they had speeders etc. In the first three Luke ad to sell his land speeder, he didn't need it but it was dramtic build empathy, in the last three they had too much, and you never cared about them.

[TombReader]

'It was a shame Jar Jar's scenes were cut so much.'

I agree.I was glad that he survived until the end,though.It was a great big F-U from Lucas to all the haters out there.

IMO,the single most important flaw for the Prequels have been lame fans.It's ironic that so many people whine about(insert character's name)'s whining.

No one here of course,though. ;)

[Raiders112390]

Since my thread was closed and I was told to use the search function, hopefully this one won't be closed.