The Raven

The Raven (http://raven.theraider.net/index.php)
-   Indiana Jones Trilogy (http://raven.theraider.net/forumdisplay.php?f=18)
-   -   The Submarine: U-26 Wurrfler (http://raven.theraider.net/showthread.php?t=19712)

Stoo 12-17-2009 03:26 PM

The Submarine: U-26 Wurrfler
 
A thread for all things related to the submarine & secret island base in "Raiders". Their appearances are brief but the scenes are interesting ones, especially regarding the concern of how Indy survives the voyage...




Transplanted posts from the Nuked Fridges thread:
Quote:

Originally Posted by emtiem
Well, strictly according to the film there's nothing to say it did, is there?

Yes indeed; I know it was intended to (and I wish we'd seen that) but then the finished film and the script are different things! As far as the film goes: no submersion.

Since certain shots of Ford on the periscope were eventually cut, it appears to be a common perception that the U-Boat does NOT dive (thus allowing Indy to ride the entire way without suffering too much). There is, however, quite a bit of EVIDENCE IN THE FILM to prove that the sub SUBMERGES.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Monatan Smith
I just looked at the Raiders script, and it's fairly detailed on this point. As Indy is running along the deck of the 'Wurffler' it begins to "submerge". He climbs the ladder to the bridge of the conning tower and the water is rising around him. At the top he braces himself between the 7-foot radio mast and the 20-foot periscope. The radio mast is disappearing under the water, so he hangs on to the top three-feet of the periscope, "...to Indy's slowly dawning delight, the dive stops. No more of the periscope goes under." He then lashes himself to the 'scope with his whip.

Half of him is warmed by the sun, but the whip tightens with the wet, cutting into his skin, he sees shark fins, and he loses consciousness. When the U-Boat stops, the script reads: "Once again, he has survived. To fight again."

I presume this is the correct script. It was revised 3rd August 1979 and is headed up: 'Raiders of the Lost Ark', Screenplay by Lawrence Kasdan, Story by George Lucas.

This is (apparently) the 3rd of 5 drafts (minus the shooting script) and is included in the comic adaptation, etc. We all know that, as has been presented in the final film, Indy doesn't have his whip in the scene so he must have survived the trip by brute strength alone.:eek: (The sub definitely does dive...there's no doubt about it.)

As a matter of interest, here’s a page about the real-life U-26 which had its maiden patrol in May 1936. (Fits right into the Indy timeline!) http://www.uboat.net/boats/u26.htm

Dr Bones 12-17-2009 03:57 PM

Scanned from my copy of Empire Magazine's Indiana Jones Diary.




No doubt about it like you say :hat:

Montana Smith 12-17-2009 09:56 PM

I'm sure I've seen aerial film of the submarine just below the surface with Indy clinging onto the periscope. It could be on the bonus material disc of the Indiana Jones 'original trilogy' box set DVD.

emtiem 12-18-2009 05:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stoo
AThere is, however, quite a bit of EVIDENCE IN THE FILM to prove that the sub SUBMERGES.


Okay; but what is that? Off the top of my head I can't remember- there might well be, but I don't remember it diving. Don't we even see it sailing towards the sub base?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Bones
No doubt about it like you say :hat:


That's not actually in the film, though, is it? I like the idea, it's fun, but it's not in the film.

DoomTown 12-18-2009 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emtiem
Okay; but what is that? Off the top of my head I can't remember- there might well be, but I don't remember it diving. Don't we even see it sailing towards the sub base?


How about the U-Boat captain saying "Tauchen! Tauchen das U-boat!" Tauchen is german for "dive". :)

emtiem 12-18-2009 08:57 AM

Yep, that would work! :)

Stoo 12-18-2009 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Bones
No doubt about it like you say :hat:

Right on, Brother Bones!:up: (I have that mag. It's great.)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Montana Smith
I'm sure I've seen aerial film of the submarine just below the surface with Indy clinging onto the periscope. It could be on the bonus material disc of the Indiana Jones 'original trilogy' box set DVD.

There are quite a few photos but...footage? Does anyone know exactly where it is so I don't waste time looking for it?
Quote:

Originally Posted by emtiem
Okay; but what is that? Off the top of my head I can't remember- there might well be, but I don't remember it diving. Don't we even see it sailing towards the sub base?

The dive is only seen from the interior of the sub but the sights & sounds are telling clues.;)
Quote:

Originally Posted by KVoss
How about the U-Boat captain saying "Tauchen! Tauchen das U-boat!" Tauchen is german for "dive".:)

You beat me to it, Mr. KVoss.:D Here's the illustrated version:

The command to dive. "Tauchen!"



The order is repeated in this shot. You can also hear it being said in the background by an unseen character.



The ballast wheels are being turned. The sub's tanks are filling with seawater in order to submerge.



The periscope is in the "up" position. (If it was down, the viewfinder and handles would be below deck.) A klaxon is heard which indicates that the sub begins to surface after the island has been spotted. (I think German U-boats used ringing bells rather than klaxons but that's beside the point...;))


...and "la pièce de résistance". INDY ON THE PERISCOPE IN THE MOVIE!:whip:


Montana Smith 12-18-2009 09:48 AM

Great pictures, Stoo. Maybe that last one is the footage I had in mind?

Here are some pictures and diagrams of the real U-26 Type IA:

http://xmages.net/out.php/i214447_1.JPG

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=149950


A slightly different version of the black and white photo is also in the 'Complete Making of' book (p.105). The caption reads: 'Ford clings to the specially rigged submarine scope (deleted from the film), while bearded mechanical effects supervisor Kit West watches from the water, and Spielberg stands with a bullhorn.' This photo is a few moments before or after the one Dr Bones put up.

As you all probably already know, the submarine pen used was the genuine German wartime one still at La Rochelle, France, complete with original German graffiti on the walls. The Wurrfler submarine used was owned by a German company, who would only permit it to be used at sea if the waves were less than a metre high, as it was so valuable. I think it was the same sub that was being used to film 'Das Boot'.

emtiem 12-18-2009 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stoo
...and "la pièce de résistance". INDY ON THE PERISCOPE IN THE MOVIE!:whip:



Ooh, great spot! I never knew that was there! Can't wait for the Blu Ray...

martinland 12-20-2009 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stoo
The command to dive. "Tauchen!"
[...]
The order is repeated in this shot. You can also hear it being said in the background by an unseen character.
[...]
The periscope is in the "up" position.

TO END THIS DISCUSSION ONCE AND FOR ALL with evidence taken from the finished movie only:

Right after the first command a guy with swiss accent replies (the shot of this guy talking appears right next to one of the shots of the periscope being used) in german:

"??? das Periskop nach oben, Herr Oberst!"

Just checked again on the DVD:

Unfortunately it's a pretty weird swiss accent and I never could make out the first word which I always assumed to be "Fahre" which would mean "Sliding into...".

Anyway the reminding sentence is pretty clear:

"...the periscope into 'up' position, Herr Oberst!"

So, for me it's always been clear that they dive, but only w/ up periscope!

:gun: :cool: ;)

Bye,
Ml

Stoo 09-10-2012 04:47 PM

*BUMP*
Quote:

Originally Posted by emtiem
Ooh, great spot! I never knew that was there! Can't wait for the Blu Ray...

People have been reporting that it's very visible in the new, IMAX screenings.

Crack that whip 09-10-2012 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stoo
*BUMP*
People have been reporting that it's very visible in the new, IMAX screenings.


Indeed it is. Have you not seen it? I remember you saying you wouldn't be able to catch the AMC marathon on the 15th, but that you would at least be able to see Raiders of the Lost Ark in IMAX before you leave on whatever trip you're taking; I hope this is the case - you really need to catch it on the BIG screen. :up: :whip:

Indy's still quite small in the frame, of course, so it's understandable that plenty of people never noticed him there in the original theatrical release, but for people like us who know about it and look for him in the shot, he's quite clear. I have a feeling the clarity of the impending Blu-ray release will settle a lot of the sorts of questions and occasional debates that have come up here and in other centers of Indy fandom over the past few decades.

Goodeknight 09-11-2012 08:00 AM

Okay, so we see a teeny tiny Indy on the periscope. But he didn't lash himself to it with his whip, no matter what early scripts say!

He clearly has NO WHIP when he climbs aboard and runs across the deck as the crew of the Bantu Wind cheers him on.

So that sequence was never intended to be shot. If it was, then we'd see him with his whip. Perhaps he got resourceful and just used his belt.

Henry Jones VII 09-11-2012 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodeknight
Perhaps he got resourceful and just used his belt.


I could see THAT happening :D

Goodeknight 09-11-2012 10:08 AM

And if any of you weren't already aware, it's the same u-boat from Das Boot, the film that came out the same year, 1981.

Quote:

The outdoor mock-up was basically a shell propelled with a small engine, and stationed in La Rochelle, France and has a history of its own. One morning the production crew walked out to where they kept it afloat and found it missing. Someone had forgotten to inform the crew that an American filmmaker had rented the mock-up for his own film shooting in the area. This filmmaker was Steven Spielberg and the film he was shooting was Raiders of the Lost Ark.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Das_Boot


Crack that whip 09-11-2012 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodeknight
Okay, so we see a teeny tiny Indy on the periscope. But he didn't lash himself to it with his whip, no matter what early scripts say!

He clearly has NO WHIP when he climbs aboard and runs across the deck as the crew of the Bantu Wind cheers him on.

So that sequence was never intended to be shot. If it was, then we'd see him with his whip. Perhaps he got resourceful and just used his belt.


... unless he stuffed the whip down the front of his clothing. :p ;)

Pale Horse 06-19-2018 11:56 AM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:33 AM.

Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.