KOTCS had the most brutal fist fight

Raiders90

Well-known member
Agent Spalko said:
The Dovenchenko fight is a joke. Left hook... right hook... left hook. Repeat. There was no spontaneous improvisation like the Pat Roach fights. And the fact that old Indy doesn't even get his ass kicked like he did against Pat says just how lazy it was.

It wasn't left hook, right hook. Indy got held in a head lock of sorts, punched in the back of the head to the ground, pulled up off the floor by his ear, at which point he crawled and pretended to surrender (similar to the way he did when he threw the sand in the German Mechanics eyes) and hit Dovenchenko with a good sized log, at which point (as Dovenchenko fell to his knees because Indy hit him in the stomach with the log), Indy kicked him in the face, Indy then splits the log over Dovenchenko's head (which didn't hurt him at all) as he got up, punched him hard three times in the face which knocks him down at which point he's devoured by the ants.
 
Dovechenko must really be a wuss if he can get his ass kicked by a smaller old guy. At least with Pat you knew Indy didn't stand a chance against him. He was totally outmatched. He always barely survived by the skin of his teeth. Now I'm supposed to believe that some 7 foot tall Eastern Bloc Ruskie gets his ass handed to him by a meager 65 year-old part-time teacher with a log? Give me a break. :rolleyes:
 
There was something quite disgusting about Dovchenko's sickeningly pale face just before he collapses to the ground. Nasty.
 

davejames

New member
Salacious said:
Note: I am discounting the Truck Chase fight since it was just a few punches thrown. If the entire Truck chase including Indy being dragged underneath and behind the truck is counted...then that would be #1.

I know it wasn't a traditional kind of fight, but it still WAS pretty damn brutal. Those two were kicking and punching the crap out of each other, and it went on for quite a while too. And how can you not love Indy slamming that guy's head repeatedly into the dashboard? :D

Then Indy throws him out the window and runs him over with the big ass truck!!

Yeah, the more I think about it, the more I think that fight probably tops the one with the mechanic. I mean, the mechanic was just some guy who was standing in Indy's way. But Indy and that driver really had it IN for each other. The look of fury and determination on Indy's face throughout that whole sequence is just awesome to see.
 

deckard24

New member
Agent Spalko said:
Dovechenko must really be a wuss if he can get his ass kicked by a smaller old guy. At least with Pat you knew Indy didn't stand a chance against him. He was totally outmatched. He always barely survived by the skin of his teeth. Now I'm supposed to believe that some 7 foot tall Eastern Bloc Ruskie gets his ass handed to him by a meager 65 year-old part-time teacher with a log? Give me a break. :rolleyes:
7 feet tall, not quite!!:rolleyes:

Jijikine(Dovchenko) is only 6ft3 1/4", and was only a few inches taller then Ford(6ft1). As for his size build wise, they were really roughly the same. If anything Ford was more stockier built then Jijikine. Now Pat Roach was a different story build wise and height(6ft5), and way outmatched Ford in sheer bulk! Of the two, Roach was way more formidable then Jijikine to Ford!
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1216826/bio
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0730053/
 
deckard24 said:
7 feet tall, not quite!!:rolleyes:

Jijikine(Dovchenko) is only 6ft3 1/4", and was only a few inches taller then Ford(6ft1). As for his size build wise, they were really roughly the same. If anything Ford was more stockier built then Jijikine. Now Pat Roach was a different story build wise and height(6ft5), and way outmatched Ford in sheer bulk! Of the two, Roach was way more formidable then Jijikine to Ford!
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1216826/bio
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0730053/

I just watched the Dovchenko fight again. He's almost a full foot taller than Ford unless osteoporosis has shrunk him.
 

MolaRam2

New member
Silentrascal said:
Agreed. I think they were striving for as good a fight as the Ford/Roach one from Raiders, and it just wasn't anywhere near as good.

The Dovchenko fight probably sounded good on paper, but on film it doesn't work. It's hard for a simple fist fight to stand out amongst 1000s of CGI ants. One of the problems with CGI is it allows film makers to create these huge spectacles which might end up not working.

Ford vs. Roach as a Flying Wing rotates around in circles=pure genius.
There is the threat of the propelers and the wheels on top of the threat of Roach.

In the Dovchenko fight, the ants were suppose to be the additional threat, but they just didn't work.

I like the additional threats in the ToD Ford/Roach fight. The conveyor belt and rock gring were great ideas. Having a voodoo doll being used on Indy at the same time really amped up the tension. Even with all the stuff going on in the ToD Roach fight, the focus is still on Indy's fight. In the Dovchenko fight, the focus is more on the ants.

As someone else suggested, a fight on top of the Jungle Cutter ending with Dovchenko being cut up in the jungle cutter's blades would have been awesome.
 
MolaRam2 said:
As someone else suggested, a fight on top of the Jungle Cutter ending with Dovchenko being cut up in the jungle cutter's blades would have been awesome.

That's exactly what I was expecting but the Jungle Cutter is barely seen at a distance and Indy takes it out with the RPG. Basically everything in that sequence is in the trailer. And people say Last Crusade is lazy...
 

Darth Vile

New member
Agent Spalko said:
That's exactly what I was expecting but the Jungle Cutter is barely seen at a distance and Indy takes it out with the RPG. Basically everything in that sequence is in the trailer. And people say Last Crusade is lazy...

There is no substance to the claim that the scene is lazy... as it's clearly not. Is it well executed? I believe so. Is the fistfight brutal? Subjective of course, but I believe it conveys some sense of reality whilst feeling fantastical. Is it as original/unique as the counterpart scene in Raiders? No it's not... but it certainly doesn't make it bad as you allude to...

For the record, I too was expecting some more action with the Jungle Cutter. It could have been great, but I can only imagine that Spielberg/Lucas felt they could not better the tank scene in LC (which it would have resembled).
 

Lonsome Indy

New member
actually i count this fight a close second behind The German Mechanic.

i wasn't distracted at all with the ants, and there were some times when i had to cover my eyes. i remember sitting there with my dad when his nose begins to bleed saying ew... in a whisper. i mean the punches sounded like they hurt. which was what i wanted. and Indy got his fair share of hits on him. causing for some improv.

the TOD fight has some good moments, but then it starts to get comical for me. especially with Willie on the sidelines trying to coach him. let alone the voodoo doll.
 
deckard24 said:


Really.

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deckard24

New member
Agent Spalko said:
You do realize these are all based on forced perspective photography, unlike the one I showed that has them on level ground with zero steep angled camera shots? He was at best 3-4 inches taller then Ford, if Ford has shrunk a bit from his youthful height of 6ft1 to say 6ft! A foot taller is ridiculous, that's like me at 6ft telling people I'm 6ft8! LOL
<a href="http://s286.photobucket.com/albums/ll116/drjones24/?action=view&current=tvspot2_020.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll116/drjones24/tvspot2_020.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
<a href="http://s286.photobucket.com/albums/ll116/drjones24/?action=view&current=ij4_66.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll116/drjones24/ij4_66.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
<a href="http://s286.photobucket.com/albums/ll116/drjones24/?action=view&current=ij4_51.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll116/drjones24/ij4_51.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
 

Katarn07

New member
Hey Spalko, you don't have to like the fight, but don't go making up stuff about it just to disagree it was brutal. He isn't a full foot taller and he's not buff at all like Roach was. Indy does fight dirty and Dovchenko I think at one point removes Indy's hat, grabs him by the hair, and delivers an unblockable punch to Indy's face. That's not having the crap beat out of you?

I didn't think it fit with the Roach/Vogel fights for the reason it was so brutal. It felt like something inspired more by Bourne/Casino Royale's fist fight bouts, not the original three films. There really was no humor to it at all. Nothing wrong with that. It's unique and fresh for these films rather than being redundant. At least we got a fist fight between Indy and a Roach inspired baddie.
 
And you realize that they are fighting on an incline and Indy is standing uphill of Dovchenko on the slope and he's still towering over him even in the wide shots.
 
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deckard24

New member
Katarn07 said:
Hey Spalko, you don't have to like the fight, but don't go making up stuff about it just to disagree it was brutal. He isn't a full foot taller and he's not buff at all like Roach was. Indy does fight dirty and Dovchenko I think at one point removes Indy's hat, grabs him by the hair, and delivers an unblockable punch to Indy's face. That's not having the crap beat out of you?

I didn't think it fit with the Roach/Vogel fights for the reason it was so brutal. It felt like something inspired more by Bourne/Casino Royale's fist fight bouts, not the original three films. There really was no humor to it at all. Nothing wrong with that. It's unique and fresh for these films rather than being redundant. At least we got a fist fight between Indy and a Roach inspired baddie.
The Bourne/Casino Royale comparison is a great one, especially considering they referenced both those films in the pre-production days as influences for what they were going for realism wise!:hat:
 

deckard24

New member
Agent Spalko said:
Abd you realize that they are fighting on an incline and Indy is standing uphill of Dovchenko on the slope and he's still towering over him even in the wide shots.
It's called movie magic Spalko! Spielberg and every director worth his salt uses it to convey whatever it is they want to depict! When a director wants to show someone as extra tall, they shoot over the shoulder shots of their opponent and shoot from the ground up, with a steep looming perspective.

This picture clearly shows Igor Jijikine as having maybe 4 inches on Ford! There's no reason arguing it!
<a href="http://s286.photobucket.com/albums/ll116/drjones24/?action=view&current=ij4_51.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll116/drjones24/ij4_51.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
Also why would Jijikine be listed at 6ft3 1/4", if he's 7 feet tall? That makes no sense at all, that's an 8 3/4" difference!LOL
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1216826/bio
See for yourself!
Also check out his website with pics of him standing next to Clint Eastwood(6ft4), Arnold Schwarzenegger(6ft2), and Quentin Tarantino(6ft2)! How does a 7ft guy look roughly the same height as all of them, while standing prefectly straight right next to them?
http://www.igorjijikine.com/
 
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Katarn07

New member
Agent Spalko said:
Abd you realize that they are fighting on an incline and Indy is standing uphill of Dovchenko on the slope and he's still towering over him even in the wide shots.

Once again, it's called forced perspective. The shots above posted by deckard are better means to gauge their respective heights because they're on even ground and not hunched at all in action poses. They're also wide shots with no camera trickery. What you see is what you get. Those mean nothing to you?

You sound as annoyingly ignorant as Clinton or RA. I'm done arguing because apparently you are never wrong despite the evidence being clearly supplied above :rolleyes:
 
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