Whatcha playin? (Video games wise.)

Montana Smith

Active member
Having played GTA IV for a little while now, I've been starting to wonder, is it essential to socialize? It's almost as annoying as having to socialize in real life!

Roman rings up wanting to go out at inopportune moments. I'm concerned about that druggie, Jakob. He calls and asks me to take him to a show.

Then there's Michelle who blows hot and cold. I mean, all I did was run over a pedestrian and she freaked out and refused nookie rights.

Is there a payoff for getting drunk with your mates? Well, getting drunk is pretty funny, with Niko staggering around and falling over.

But do you get better job offers and opportunities if they're giving you the thumbs up instead of the thumbs down?
 

Le Saboteur

Active member
Attila the Professor said:
Fair enough. And yeah, that was more or less what I was asking, with the "next" portion of my phrasing pointing towards wanting to go for something that was either superior to others in the (potentially loose) genre, essential for its reputation or other qualities, or different enough from what I have played as to open up a new facet of the sandbox concept to me.

While limited in terms of physical area to explore, I would encourage you to plunk down your hard earned cash for the Game of the Year edition of Batman: Arkham City. It includes all of the DLC released to date, and a digital copy of the animated movie Batman: Year One.


Finn and I have often discussed the merits of storytelling in an open-world environment, and this is one of those instances where it manages to gel together. In other words, the story doesn't lag even when you're attempting the side missions.

Dig the ultra-slick trailer for Hugo Strange. (One of Batman's overlooked villains.)


Personally, I find Sleeping Dogs to be far more compelling than any of the Grand Theft Auto games ever were. I'd opt for the former versus the latter if money isn't too tight.
 
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Montana Smith

Active member
Le Saboteur said:
While limited in terms of physical area to explore, I would encourage you to plunk down your hard earned cash for the Game of the Year edition of Batman: Arkham City. It includes all of the DLC released to date, and a digital copy of the animated movie Batman: Year One.

Finn and I have often discussed the merits of storytelling in an open-world environment, and this is one of those instances where it manages to gel together. In other words, the story doesn't lag even when you're attempting the side missions.

Oh, now that looks good!

Can you play it with a mouse and keyboard? (I'm figuring there's a lot more hand-to-hand than ranged combat).

And is Arkham Asylum GOTY worth playing first?
 

Finn

Moderator
Staff member
Montana Smith said:
All apart from the inability to continue after the end of the game without using a mod. And the mod isn't a perfect solution as there were choices you made that aren't recognized in the aftermath.

These games are so big that without poring over a guide you wouldn't know whether you'd done everything before you elected to go into the final battle.
I originally thought that it would have been possible to code in an ability to continue exploring the world you helped forge once the credits have rolled.

However, after thinking about it more closely, it would have been a rather dull world to explore. Say you help the Legion win. It wouldn't have been too hard to replace the common NCR troopers in and around Vegas with legionnaires, but their appearance would have been little more than flavor. I doubt they'd given you new quest lines or dedicated dialogue, so all you'd be hearing is stock lines like "Ave, true to Caesar" over and over again.

And talking about the quests, there is very little that don't involve NCR personnel in some capacity. And given how in only one of the endings the NCR doesn't withdraw from the area, the result in most cases would have been a whole bunch of failed quests in the log and again, a very dull game world to explore.

On the other hand, I can think that letting you continue after the end to play the DLCs would have been a reason enough, even if the area surrounding Vegas proper would have felt empty or undeveloped. For example, the premise of Honest Hearts certainly feels jarring to do mid-story. The conflict over the dam is brewing, the Courier in the middle of it all... and all of a sudden he or she just decides to take a couple of months off by departing with a random caravan that's looking for a guard? Okay.

In the end, I ended up finding a story justification for it when I went and assassinated Caesar. That way, the Courier needs to get away from the Mojave to escape the Legion's wrath, and the world holding the status quo in his absence can be explained by the Legion needing to regroup. Also, bearing the news of Caesar's death gives you few extra lines of dialogue with Joshua Graham.

Of course, there is nothing in the game that states this outright, but given how neatly all the pieces fell together, I couldn't help but wonder if this was actually meant to be the in-story justification for the add-on. Not a complaint though, as working it all out by myself gave me far greater sense of accomplishment.

Montana Smith said:
But do you get better job offers and opportunities if they're giving you the thumbs up instead of the thumbs down?
There are definitely rewards. You make 'em happy enough and they start offering specific favors in return, which you can utilize by calling them at any given moment. For example, Roman will send a free cab to your location. Little Jacob is a gun merchant, who will drive up to Niko with a boot full of lethal metal, available for a hefty discount. Different girlfriends offer bonuses too, such as calling the cops off of Niko's backside or allowing him to leave the hospital with his arsenal intact. If I recall right, this only applies to the optional ones, though. Michelle and Kate, the two that come with the plot can be safely ignored.

Have to maintain the friendships, too, or they will stop. Tell 'em you're busy enough times after you've unlocked the ability will make their friendship score drop, and once it goes below a specific threshold, they'll simply refuse.

I have to agree though, the mechanic is a little tedious. You can keep 'em off your back though by initiating the activities yourself. Drinking works probably best, as it doesn't involve a minigame of any kind. Call 'em up, catch a cab to their location, then another to the bar and once more to take 'em home. Won't even have to look around for a yellow car if you remain buddies with Roman.
 

Montana Smith

Active member
Finn said:
I originally thought that it would have been possible to code in an ability to continue exploring the world you helped forge once the credits have rolled.

However, after thinking about it more closely, it would have been a rather dull world to explore. Say you help the Legion win. It wouldn't have been too hard to replace the common NCR troopers in and around Vegas with legionnaires, but their appearance would have been little more than flavor. I doubt they'd given you new quest lines or dedicated dialogue, so all you'd be hearing is stock lines like "Ave, true to Caesar" over and over again.

And talking about the quests, there is very little that don't involve NCR personnel in some capacity. And given how in only one of the endings the NCR doesn't withdraw from the area, the result in most cases would have been a whole bunch of failed quests in the log and again, a very dull game world to explore.

On the other hand, I can think that letting you continue after the end to play the DLCs would have been a reason enough, even if the area surrounding Vegas proper would have felt empty or undeveloped. For example, the premise of Honest Hearts certainly feels jarring to do mid-story. The conflict over the dam is brewing, the Courier in the middle of it all... and all of a sudden he or she just decides to take a couple of months off by departing with a random caravan that's looking for a guard? Okay.

In the end, I ended up finding a story justification for it when I went and assassinated Caesar. That way, the Courier needs to get away from the Mojave to escape the Legion's wrath, and the world holding the status quo in his absence can be explained by the Legion needing to regroup. Also, bearing the news of Caesar's death gives you few extra lines of dialogue with Joshua Graham.

Of course, there is nothing in the game that states this outright, but given how neatly all the pieces fell together, I couldn't help but wonder if this was actually meant to be the in-story justification for the add-on. Not a complaint though, as working it all out by myself gave me far greater sense of accomplishment.

I think I mentioned before that with the 'continue after end' mod you find yourself in the projection room watching the ending. The narrator is standing there with you, and he's doing all the various voices himself.

I have a load of other mods with other quests attached to the game, so continuing afterwards was worthwhile.

Finn said:
There are definitely rewards. You make 'em happy enough and they start offering specific favors in return, which you can utilize by calling them at any given moment. For example, Roman will send a free cab to your location. Little Jacob is a gun merchant, who will drive up to Niko with a boot full of lethal metal, available for a hefty discount. Different girlfriends offer bonuses too, such as calling the cops off of Niko's backside or allowing him to leave the hospital with his arsenal intact. If I recall right, this only applies to the optional ones, though. Michelle and Kate, the two that come with the plot can be safely ignored.

Have to maintain the friendships, too, or they will stop. Tell 'em you're busy enough times after you've unlocked the ability will make their friendship score drop, and once it goes below a specific threshold, they'll simply refuse.

I have to agree though, the mechanic is a little tedious. You can keep 'em off your back though by initiating the activities yourself. Drinking works probably best, as it doesn't involve a minigame of any kind. Call 'em up, catch a cab to their location, then another to the bar and once more to take 'em home. Won't even have to look around for a yellow car if you remain buddies with Roman.

Worth pursuing, then. I killed two birds with one stone (and several pedestrians with a Patriot) by asking Michelle out to dinner when I was low on health!
 

Finn

Moderator
Staff member
Le Saboteur said:
Finn and I have often discussed the merits of storytelling in an open-world environment, and this is one of those instances where it manages to gel together. In other words, the story doesn't lag even when you're attempting the side missions.
Yep, made the same observation. The optional stuff actually feels like part of the plot proper rather than a sideshow you'll do to simply gain different gameplay bonuses.

Well... maybe there is that one twist after which you really shouldn't be looking for ringing payphones or hunting down Riddler trophies.

Le Saboteur said:
Personally, I find Sleeping Dogs to be far more compelling than any of the Grand Theft Auto games ever were. I'd opt for the former versus the latter if money isn't too tight.
Maybe about halfway through, it's no doubt forming out to be one of the better sandbox titles I've played, even if there really is nothing groundbreaking here. The devs at United Front have simply taken the most common conventions of the genre and given them an extra layer of polish, resulting in a highly enjoyable game.

Incidentally, what's said above for the side stuff in Arkham City holds true rather well for Sleeping Dogs as well. The world isn't even that large by the genre standards, but sometimes less seems to be more, as it feels far more coherent than, say, anything Rockstar's given us.

Montana Smith said:
Oh, now that looks good!

Can you play it with a mouse and keyboard? (I'm figuring there's a lot more hand-to-hand than ranged combat).

And is Arkham Asylum GOTY worth playing first?
I wouldn't call myself a Batfan, but I appreciate a good game when I come across one. Both entries to the Arkham series are very definitely worth playing.

The controls are fine, too. I had no trouble utilizing the PC standard when giving Joker's mooks a beatdown.
 

Montana Smith

Active member
Finn said:
I wouldn't call myself a Batfan, but I appreciate a good game when I come across one. Both entries to the Arkham series are very definitely worth playing.

The controls are fine, too. I had no trouble utilizing the PC standard when giving Joker's mooks a beatdown.


Excellent news. Think I'm going to give these two top priority post-GTA.

I've had a long fascination with Arkham Asylum, in comics, on film, and in Lego. Also love atmospheric games.
 

DocWhiskey

Well-known member
I've been in a Super Mario craze lately due to nostalgic reasons. I've been playing a lot of Mario's greatest hits. I've been thinking about buying some of Mario's new games, but can't find the time. Eventually I assume.
 

Le Saboteur

Active member
Montana Smith said:
Oh, now that looks good!

It is good. Arkham City is one of the finest interpretations of The Batman to appear anywhere. It's even better than that Nolan schlockfest. Though, I admittedly haven't seen The Dark Knight Rises yet.

Taking on twenty thugs as The Bat is deeply satisfying. Especially watching him move in proportion to his abilities.

It helps that Paul Dini (he of Batman: The Animated Series fame) penned the script for both games. If you haven't had the chance to do so, pick up his work on Batman: Streets of Gotham.

It's also incredibly deep. While it took between twenty-and-thirty hours to complete the main story, I've probably put in about a hundred gameplay hours over the course of the past year. And I'm still not done.

Dig: The Catwoman DLC allows you to free roam Arkham City after you've completed the campaign; she has her own set of trophies, and a couple of mini-missions too. Nightwing is only playable in the challenge rooms, unfortunately, but he's not a mere re-skinned Batman. His moves are unique to his personality/abilities and requires a different touch. The Robin DLC only initially only allowed you to play the Teen Wonder in challenge rooms, but the Harley Quinn's Revenge DLC allows a limited amount of free-roam outside of the main story.

The Riddler's Revenge DLC, et al add a bunch of challenge rooms that can be attempted by any of the four playable characters. Medals, achievements, and trophies abound for each as well.

Montana Smith said:
Can you play it with a mouse and keyboard? (I'm figuring there's a lot more hand-to-hand than ranged combat).

Finn's more knowledgeable than I am since I played it on PS3, but I don't see why it couldn't. Ranged combat is virtually non-existent, of course. Batman likes to mix it up.

Montana Smith said:
And is Arkham Asylum GOTY worth playing first?

Arkham Asylum is definitely worth getting. It's noticeably shorter than its sequel, but Mark Hamill is in fine form as The Joker. That reminds me, AA is at its core your typical Joker v. Batman story with a few extra villains thrown in for color.

I do have one major criticism, though. In the console version at least, the camera is oddly fixed just over Batman's shoulder. It hindered combat and exploration for me.

Finn said:
Well... maybe there is that one twist after which you really shouldn't be looking for ringing payphones or hunting down Riddler trophies.

Agreed. I answered all the ringing phones early in the game, but I'm still acquiring all the Riddler trophies. 414 and counting! I have three or four left for Batman, then need to get the rest of Catwoman's. Fresh eyes have certainly been beneficial.

Finn said:
The optional stuff actually feels like part of the plot proper rather than a sideshow you'll do to simply gain different gameplay bonuses.

Tying the snippets of Hugo Strange's therapy sessions to the Riddler trophies this time around was an interesting touch, and has really brought all the disparate threads together. If you haven't had the chance to collect 'em, try it out. Or, give them a listen on Youtube. I wish there were more of them, but that's because Corey Burton is awesome.

Finn said:
Maybe about halfway through...

I'm still only in the early stages of the game; i.e., just met Amanda Cartwright, but there's definitely a lot going on.

Finn said:
I wouldn't call myself a Batfan...

...but, you could certainly spend some time on the Batman wiki to digest more information about the character than you could possibly ever want to know!


DocWhiskey said:
said something interesting, I'm sure, but it's been so long that he's graced the site with his presence that I'm still in shock.

:hat: Stop in more often.
 

Montana Smith

Active member
Le Saboteur said:
It is good. Arkham City is one of the finest interpretations of The Batman to appear anywhere. It's even better than that Nolan schlockfest. Though, I admittedly haven't seen The Dark Knight Rises yet.

Taking on twenty thugs as The Bat is deeply satisfying. Especially watching him move in proportion to his abilities.

It helps that Paul Dini (he of Batman: The Animated Series fame) penned the script for both games. If you haven't had the chance to do so, pick up his work on Batman: Streets of Gotham.

It's also incredibly deep. While it took between twenty-and-thirty hours to complete the main story, I've probably put in about a hundred gameplay hours over the course of the past year. And I'm still not done.

Dig: The Catwoman DLC allows you to free roam Arkham City after you've completed the campaign; she has her own set of trophies, and a couple of mini-missions too. Nightwing is only playable in the challenge rooms, unfortunately, but he's not a mere re-skinned Batman. His moves are unique to his personality/abilities and requires a different touch. The Robin DLC only initially only allowed you to play the Teen Wonder in challenge rooms, but the Harley Quinn's Revenge DLC allows a limited amount of free-roam outside of the main story.

The Riddler's Revenge DLC, et al add a bunch of challenge rooms that can be attempted by any of the four playable characters. Medals, achievements, and trophies abound for each as well.

It sounds pretty much exactly the game I'd enjoy. I haven't spoken to anyone yet who has much of a bad word to say about these.

The other day I installed the Lego Batman game for the first time, to get a Bat fix. I uninstalled it within half an hour: wasn't a game I could get into. So I won't bother loading Lego Indy!

Le Saboteur said:
Arkham Asylum is definitely worth getting. It's noticeably shorter than its sequel, but Mark Hamill is in fine form as The Joker. That reminds me, AA is at its core your typical Joker v. Batman story with a few extra villains thrown in for color.

I'll start with AA.

Le Saboteur said:
I do have one major criticism, though. In the console version at least, the camera is oddly fixed just over Batman's shoulder. It hindered combat and exploration for me.

I've been reading about that issue. It might not apply to the PC:

Trying to decide if I should get this game for PS3 or 360. I've read that the camera is more zoomed out on the PS3, and more zoomed in on the 360.

I am trying to figure out which is more closer to the PC version, as perhaps that would be seen as the 'lead platform' so to speak. Small issues no doubt, but still.
 

Finn

Moderator
Staff member
Le Saboteur said:
Agreed. I answered all the ringing phones early in the game, but I'm still acquiring all the Riddler trophies. 414 and counting! I have three or four left for Batman, then need to get the rest of Catwoman's. Fresh eyes have certainly been beneficial.
I only played it through once when it came out a year ago, but in that single playthrough, I went after 'em all as well, in no small part thanks to the fact that the reward for solving the puzzles was actually more plot-related gameplay, rather than a pat on the back in the form of a simple gamerscore achievement.

And how could you not. Most of the time, they're just annoyingly sitting there, in the open. The challenge is not the usual "scour the map grid by grid for every nook and cranny", but figuring out the associated conundrum - which is actually fun.

If we're to think about examples of how collectibles are implemented in a game, City is textbook.


Le Saboteur said:
I'm still only in the early stages of the game; i.e., just met Amanda Cartwright, but there's definitely a lot going on.
There is, and will be more, as some of the optional things only unlock as the plot advances.

In fact, another facet of a sandbox I've found excellent with this title is the pacing of the game, at least this far. Besides the engaging main plot, the side stuff is compelling to play as well, and dispenses just right.

The world is fully open from the start, so those who wish to take a break from the story can roam at will and enjoy the sights. And even if the main spot of activity early on seems to be North Point, there's always something worth looking out for in the other districts as well, be they collectibles like shrines or lockboxes or simply a random brawl.

In a good open world game, the impetus to advance between the main plot and the off-hours activities go hand-to-hand, and Sleeping Dogs hits it as close to the sweet spot as I think I've ever seen.

Probably the premise of the game alone has forced the devs to give it some extra thought. Usually you play some kind of an outlaw in these games, but Wei is a cop. Going on a rampage that maims bystanders or causes general mayhem would be out of character for him, so other options are required when the player feels the need for additional distraction.

Le Saboteur said:
...but, you could certainly spend some time on the Batman wiki to digest more information about the character than you could possibly ever want to know!
Heh. Incidentally, I do happen to have a tendency to take wiki walks related to the subject at hand amidst my gaming. Lately, I think I spent almost as much time reading up about the American revolution while playing AC III. And I have to say, freshly comparing actual history to the version presented within and learning background information about the various persons and events I just met or witnessed made it possibly even more engaging experience than simply playing the game. Another reason for me to remain a PC gamer, no alt-tabbing to the browser on consoles (though I suppose you could have a laptop open on the side).

Right now, in other tabs, I have open various articles about - you got it - Hong Kong, its landscape and customs.

So, who says video games can't be educational?

Montana Smith said:
I've been reading about that issue. It might not apply to the PC
I can't recall any major gripes with the camera.

It's another point for PC in the discussion about different control schemes - mouse offers far more fluid and controllable movement and richer field of view than the thumbsticks of a pad.
 

Montana Smith

Active member
Finn said:
I can't recall any major gripes with the camera.

It sounds like the PC got the best view.


I've ordered a copy of Arkham Asylum, as I'd rather do them chronologically.

The Game of the Year edition says it has 3D capability that works on a non-3D screen, and glasses included in the box. Though some report getting headaches using it.
 

The Drifter

New member
I'm not gonna be able to play much of anything for a bit. My old fat 40 gb PS3 died on me after six years of gaming.
It was a good system and it done it's job well. Sigh...

And for the record, Monty. I enjoyed Arkham Asylum a helluva a lot more than I did Arkham City.
 
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Montana Smith

Active member
The Drifter said:
I'm not gonna be able to play much of anything for a bit. My old fat 40 gb PS3 died on me after six years of gaming.
It was a good system and it done it's job well. Sigh...

A car has been sent to collect your fallen domrade...

1000px-Romero-GTA4-front.jpg


:(



The Drifter said:
And for the record, Monty. I enjoyed Arkham Asylum a helluva a lot more than I did Arkham City.

I'm looking forward to seeing AA, but now I'm at the stage of not wanting to read too much beforehand. I want that Fallout 3 feeling of stepping out of the Vault and not knowing what I'm going to see!
 

Finn

Moderator
Staff member
The Drifter said:
It was a good system and it done it's job well. Sigh...
My condolences as well.

If it's of any consolation, six years is actually a helluva good run time for any machine containing delicate electronics.
 

Ska

New member
The Drifter said:
I'm not gonna be able to play much of anything for a bit. My old fat 40 gb PS3 died on me after six years of gaming.
It was a good system and it done it's job well. Sigh...

And for the record, Monty. I enjoyed Arkham Asylum a helluva a lot more than I did Arkham City.

If you need anyone to talk to, I'm all ears...as I've recently lost a PS3 (also a big boned 40gb...she didn't like being called fat) I loved, too. I'm not going to say it's easy to move on (it's not), but the pain gets a little easier as time moves on.

I'm reminded of a quote. "We seem to have reached the age where life stops giving us things and starts taking them away." Couldn't be more true, my friend.

BTW, I found out (after I gave my PS3 to the big garbage truck in the sky) that Gamestop will give you something for trading in a broken PS3. That something might be a high five, but it's worth a try to see what they'll offer towards a new system.
 

The Drifter

New member
Thanks for the support guys. I have my 40 gb in the living room. I may sell him on ebay or trade him into Gamestop. Whichever has the better deal. I replaced him yesterday. I bought a 120 gb slim from a friend of mine. I haven't played any games on the new system yet, and I feel dirty seeing it there on my entertainment center. But, old fatty would've wanted it that way.
 

Montana Smith

Active member
The Drifter said:
Thanks for the support guys. I have my 40 gb in the living room. I may sell him on ebay or trade him into Gamestop. Whichever has the better deal. I replaced him yesterday. I bought a 120 gb slim from a friend of mine. I haven't played any games on the new system yet, and I feel dirty seeing it there on my entertainment center. But, old fatty would've wanted it that way.


Do Gamestop reincarnate dead PS3s as grills?

1601ps3grillisrealwc0.jpg






Really loving GTA IV now. Just had the most incredible car chase across the city, hunting down Lyle Rivas. Almost as much of a workout for the heart as my daily 3 mile run!

The Blista Compact is a great car, but it was making black smoke by the time I put the last bullet into Lyle's head. Seeing that puff of red against his windscreen felt so satisfying. :eek:


I thought of the GTA series when I heard this terrible news last year:


19 October 2012 Last updated at 19:52

Cardiff hit-and-runs: Pedestrians 'targeted by van'


_63605279_van.jpg


Twelve people have been injured in a series of hit-and-runs in Cardiff which have led to the arrest of a van driver.

Both adults and children were hurt, and the 31-year-old man is in custody after a number of collisions in the Ely and Leckwith areas.

Eyewitnesses have said pedestrians were deliberately targeted by someone driving a van in five or six locations.

The A&E department at the University Hospital of Wales is shut to anyone not involved in the incident.

The locations include Grand Avenue in Ely, Cowbridge Road West, and Leckwith Retail Park.

The conditions of those injured is not yet known. Police are due to give more details at a press conference on Friday evening.

Ely sub-postmaster Shady Taha, 29, had just served two girls and a young woman moments before one of the hit-and-runs in Grand Avenue, immediately outside a row of shops.

He said the two girls aged about 10 and a woman in her mid-20s had been browsing the birthday cards in the store before buying a jar of coffee and leaving.

He said: "All of a sudden I heard a bang. I looked out and across the road one girl was on the floor and the other girl was screaming.

"I heard a van speed off but I did not see it."

...


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-east-wales-20009426
 
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