Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith

monkey

Guest
Haven't seen the movie yet.

The original STAR WARS came out the year I graduated from High School.

Didn't see it 'till twelve years later.

Yes, it was 1989, I rented it on VIDEO (remember that?) and was woken up by my baby in the middle of it (had to heat up a bottle).

OK, OK, enough............'we get the point'.

Anyway, I probably won't see this new STAR WARS movie 'till about 2015........... (if I'm stilll here.........cholesterol, high blood pressure, stress, etc......)

So I'll critique it then.

PS I thought that Episodes IV and V weren't very good.
 
theinfiniteweird said:
Anyone else care to comment? :)

Just got back. Right now I would rank it a close second to ANH in the overall series, and it may overtake it upon repeat viewings.

The first thing my friends and I talked about on the ride home was how much Hayden impressed us. Whatever help he got from the dialogue coach Lucas got for him really showed. He gets the "Most Improved Player" award.

I felt Anakin's fall was handled well. It was a bit rushed, but then again, you can't have Anakin walking around on screen for five minutes trying to decide what he is going to do. Besides, he was already willing to embrace the darkside as was established in the Tusken slaughter. I think that it was a mistake to have Padme die from just losing the will to live/broken heart. Anakin's force-choke should have fatally injured her. The fact that she can't muster the strength to live for her twins who are going to need her is a terrible flaw in her character. Other than that I found the film extraordinary. The CGI, dialogue, acting, and, most importantly, story were great. :D

How I rank the saga as of now:
ROTS: 9.5/10
ANH: 10/10
AOTC: 8/10
ROTJ: 7.5/10
TPM: 7/10
Empire: 7/10
 

Ska

New member
EIII: The side salad before the meal...*SPOILERS WARNING*

Well, that is, as they say, that. All the Yoda ear wearing, Jedi light saber armed, and Darth Vader caped obessed fans can now move on with their lives.

Is ROTS worth watching? Yes.

Is ROTS the best out of the prequel trilogy? Yes.

Is ROTS the best out of the entire SW series? No.

To my friends who attended along my side, I referred to EIII as sleeping in late for work...and hurriedly tying your shoes as you run out of the door. Let's face it. There was a lot that had to be included in the final chapter. Most of it was explained well enough to comprehend. But some of it seemed rushed, forced, and "untied".

First and foremost, the purpose of this movie was to show Anakin giving in to the Dark Side. This was portrayed very well in the movie. You could feel his anger towards the Jedi and his fear of losing Padme. Hayden's acting was much improved over ROTS. He didn't seem whiney...just pissed off at the galaxy. My only complaint is that there wasn't enough of Vader in the suit. I was under the impression that he would have more screen time.

Speaking of the Dark Side, what can I say about Darth Sidious/Palpatine?! In my opinion, he made the movie. The best scenes were the conversations between him and Anakin/Vader.

Two characters I was disappointed in: Chewbacca and Obi-Wan. As with Vader in the suit, I expected Chewie to have more screen time. All he did was send Yoda on his merry way. It seemed like a forced way to have him in the movie...just for the fans' sake. And poor ole Obi-Wan...betrayed to say the least. Some of his lines were failed attempts at comedy. Ewan's acting in the openning scenes (space battle up to the "rescue" of Palpatine) was cheesy at best. It took until Anakin's turn for Obi-Wan to really show some emotion. And once he did, the rest of his performance was great. His conversations with Vader during the fight were strong and emotional...just what it needed to be.

Two characters I was relieved about: C3PO and Jar Jar. The biggest problem I had with TPM and AOTC was the comic mischiefs of these two. C3PO's lines during the arena fight in EII killed any sense of worry for the Jedi. And I needn't say anything about Binks...we all feel the same about him. But I'm not here to talk about the previous two films. I was more than happy that ROTS had a serious/dark feel to it than the previous two. C3PO's few lines were typical original trilogy lines and were well timed throughout the movie. And Jar Jar didn't say a word...just a few times shown on screen. Thank you Mr. Lucas!

One scene that confused me was the conversation between Yoda and Obi-Wan near the very end. Yoda mentioned that he could teach Obi about the Force's power of immortality...and how he could talk to Qui-Gon. I know this was to answer why Obi vanished during his fight with Vader in EIV, but I left more confused than I came. Now I don't go around saying that I know more about Star Wars than anyone else, but if I didn't understand what the hell Yoda was talking about, how about the younger viewers watching the movie? I was really hoping this would be explained more...maybe the DVD's will answer. My friend who read the scrpt beforehand said that it mentioned a Book of Wills that was to be brought up by Yoda, but I don't know anything about it.

Two more complaints, and then I'll shut up. First, Obi-Wan's chase after Grievous. What the hell was Kenobi riding? It looked like something out of a Final Fantasy game, not Star Wars. It kept making that annoying sound. Once Obi fell off the creature, I was so relieved that I wouldn't have to hear/see it again. BUT THEN IT RETURNED, AND OBI GOT BACK ON IT! While we're on the topic of Grievous, what a let down his fighting was. Seeing pictures of the videogame with Grievous armed with four light sabers, I was so pumped to see him in action. It took all of less than a minute for Kenobi to slice off two of his arms...making their duel more of the same light saber fighting that we've seen over and over. Which leads into...

...my last complaint. The light saber fighting. If quantity is what you like, then quantity is what you get. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for the boss fights. But enough is enough...they got repetitive fast. And the fights were filmed so close up and fast that you couldn't even see what was going on. Just a blur of light among the shadows...then a couple of shots of their faces...then more light. Now EIV's Vader vs. Kenobi fight doesn't even compare to the rest, but at least you could tell what was going on. I expected the Obi vs. Vader duel to be the end all of all light saber fights. But it was nothing out of the ordinary...just more of the same. And the fighting on the floating platforms over the lava look too computer generated. One thing I did like about this part of the fight was that the small standing area forced them to not jump around, and you could actually see what was taking place.

Now these complaints may seem like I did not enjoy the movie. The fact is, I really liked it. It tied the story together for the most part. I did expect a little more surprise in how it all unfolded, but with all that needed to be included, I understand that what was expected to happen happened...and not much else more. Sure it was a little sad seeing the epic end, but now Lucas can focus his attention to a certain fedora wearing archeologist.

Rating the Star Wars series:
EI: TPM - C+
EII: AOTC - C-
EIII: ROTS - B
EIV: ANH - A
EV: ESB - A-
EVI: ROTJ - B+
 
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Episode 3 & the other prequels have now made Anakin/Darth Vader the main character of the entire Star Wars saga. :cool: Han Solo's part now seems smaller than Jar Jar's. :(
 

theinfiniteweird

New member
SKAbatula said:
Sure it was a little sad seeing the epic end, but now Lucas can focus his attention to a certain fedora wearing archeologist.

AMEN to that!

Episode 3 & the other prequels have now made Anakin/Darth Vader the main character of the entire Star Wars saga.

And while the first three (IV-VI) didn't do a good job at showing Vader being the main character, he actually is. The whole story of Star Wars is supposed to be about Vader's life. But as you say, it didn't seem that way until now.
 

vaxer

Moderator Emeritus
Even though I disliked EP1 and 2 I loved EP3. It has so much more an 'original Starwars' feeling to it, and it finally makes the connection. I'm happy with what GL did this time.
 

Canyon

Well-known member
Having seen all six movies, here are my ratings for marks out of ten.

Episode I - 7
Episode II - 10
Episode III - 9
Episode IV - 8
Episode V - 10
Episode VI - 7
 
George Lucas - epitaph

GEORGE LUCAS

Born 1944 Died ???

The creator of ?Jar Jar Binks?








They should send a time capsule carrying Jar Jar into space to show alien life what great mistakes mankind have made.
 

Deadlock

New member
WARNING: MASSIVE SPOILERS!

I agree with my man, Ska? both on this:

SKAbatula said:
Is ROTS worth watching? Yes.

Is ROTS the best out of the prequel trilogy? Yes.

Is ROTS the best out of the entire SW series? No.

?and on your lightsaber insights. You really hit that one on the head. ;)

I enjoyed the movie. I left the theater without having that feeling that I?d just been ripped off. I enjoyed the dark atmosphere and the film?s tighter focus.

But?

As I started thinking harder about the movie, things started to occur to me.

One thing that caught my attention was ROTS used many elements from the original trilogy (especially from Empire Strikes Back). It wasn?t just people and places, but also shots, dialogue, and soundtrack. Now this may be perfectly appropriate, as this was the final piece of the bridge. But after thinking about it, I?m not so sure. It?s as if ROTS was trying to leech on the positive feelings I have for the original trilogy by trying to copy it more closely. I couldn?t believe how similar the Kenobi/Anakin fight in ROTS was to the Skywalker/Vader fight in ESB: same tight hallways, same cross-country battle, same precarious fighting out on narrow catwalks.

Though greatly improved, I still think the dialogue was pretty clunky in places. Much of the Anakin/Padme stuff didn?t work for me; though their last (and most important) conversation was the exception. Which is good. For all 3 prequels, I haven?t been able to swallow Samuel L. Jackson?s lines? I don?t know what it is, but they all just sound really bogus to me.

Besides the styling of the film I had some issues with the story too.

First of all, the Anakin?s turn to the dark side. The angle the movie took was very unexpected, at least to me. Having Anakin torn between two sides claiming to offer the best way toward galactic peace and pulling him in two directions, was? well? I lot more complex than what I was expecting. Okay, on to my problem: one minute Anakin is telling Mace Windu how he shouldn?t cut down a ?defenseless? person and feels morally justified in saving Palpatine. Two minutes later, he?s hacking down cute little Jedi-kiddies. What??? :confused:

Which leads me to my next point: What?s up with the Jedi Order?! They spy on people, try to kill downed opponents, put hits out on people, leave wounded former members to die? What the heck, dude? Where?s the moral high ground? It seems that the Jedi fell victim to an ?ends justifies the means? attitude. This doesn?t seem consistent with the stoicism and morality we?d seen previously? especially the difference between Obi Wan leaving Anakin to fry versus Luke lugging Vader down to a shuttle bay. That seemed really merciless and out-of-place.

Finally, Padme. I know she was pregnant with twins and all (and BTW what?s up with her not knowing? Is there no pre-natal care on Coruscant?)? but she was SO marginalized in this movie. EP1, she?s a pistol-packing queen. EP2, slight demotion to pistol-packing senator. EP3, she gets cut down to simpering hair-brusher trapped in a tower like Rapunzel. This problem was only magnified by her death? She died of a broken heart?! Where?s the Leia-esque verve? Doesn?t she want to live for her kids? sake? Lame.
 

VP

Moderator Emeritus
Hits? Hist? Htis? Htsi? Hsti? Hsit? Thsi? Tish? Tshi? This? Tsih? Itsh? Iths? Isht? Isth? Ihts? Ihst? Siht? Shti? Sthi? Stih?
 

Ska

New member
Deadlock said:
EP3, she gets cut down to simpering hair-brusher trapped in a tower like Rapunzel.

:D HAHAHAHA

Deadlock said:
Doesn?t she want to live for her kids? sake? Lame.

Damn I forgot to add that in my review. Yeah the fact that she just gave life to twins didn't seem to give her any will to live. It sounds like even if she had lived, we would have seen her on Springer sooner or later for child abandonment.

EDIT: to fix my quote error...computers...meh!
 

DaFedora

New member
Instant classic - last piece of the puzzle

I'm not gonna rehearse every good remark already made, still I gotta write these lines down for the sake of fandom. I think you guys caught the main pieces that are worth discussing.

Episode III was surprising, unless you read the novel/screenplay, have a very visual mind and seen the thousand of spoiler photos. I personnaly think - regarding the main plot lines and drama - Lucas couldn't have pulled this one off better than it is. Narratively and in the wider visual parts, it's truly epic.
The very slow process that turned Anakin into Vader, his serious and potentially succesfull attempt to quiet the darker sides of his inner self (even apologizing to Kenobi seemed a beakon of hope) was well portrayed.
By the slow turning web of deceit built by Palpatine around Anakin, as by the ambiguous decisions of the Jedi Council it's clear nothing was clear, black-and-white anymore, the line between good and right becomes dangerously thin in ROTS.

The feel of hesitation and non-linearity marks the movie, contrary to the previous prequels, where the enigma unravels without much plotting, conspiracy. Of course there are subplots of deceit, but it all culminates to a unsurpassed climax in ROTS. The large opening was just an attempt at showing-off in CG and sharp turning camera angles, though I expected the war to open up rather fast, but all came to the dazzling effect: a deep view down below to the manic war maze of battleships. Only good droid humor in the beginning (not the Astromech versus surface spaceship sabotage droid) was R2 having to shut up the comlink he got to communicate with the jedi. Yoda's bashing imperial Crimson Guards (in red) in Palpatine's office by a simple force push was sublime (same effect as the Ninja-type, arms-up position in Ep II): 'I've had enough, no bull****' attitude. In TPM, Yoda even looked confuzingly fuzzier and less-serious than AOTC & ROTS. ROTS: realistic frowning and force-fealt pain of death (like a head-ache).

Anakin's grimmy make-up was excellent, adding to the hatefull expression that was very realistic and truly meant (I'll always remember the lines 'You put her up against me !!!' and 'I hate youuuu !!!' ) At one time, I even thought in some parts he faintly reminded me of a focused-looking Jeff Goldblum. Yet I also heard comments on how Palpatine's degenerated face (at the end of the struggle with Windu and further on), that the rubber mask looked a bit clodded over the eyes. Apparently, one of the characters on the Star Destroyer bridge was a CG rendering of Grand Moff Tarkin, of whom a friend remarked he moved away too woodenly - too obviously CG.

I even loved the introduction and entire campaign feel to Kashyyyk. Lucas manages to keep expanding the armor vehicle technology and infantry (increasingly diverse Clone regimental color insignia and strategic outlining as in AOTC), to a point that I'm giving up looking up all the specs and names.

As to Padmé's 'smaller' part: I also had the feeling it was always Anakin conforting her whenever he came back shortly and needed to depart in a hurry. The stuff that really made my throat clogg up was him killing younglings without mercy; the tragic, fearless execution of 'Order 66' by the Clones resulting in Jedi genocide - really the feel of helplessness and cold betrayal of the Jedi moved me as well as the inhumane suffering of Anakin's massacred torso being crippled in flames and torturing emergency operation. Even the bold threatening of Bail Organa upon his arrival to the Temple made me realize the insanity of a totalitarious regime and the unjustified imperative of bureaucratic executive power (a great repetitive theme in the Indy series too: remember his furious outburst to the French administrator in Port Gentil).
I can't hold a grudge to the fact Obi-Wan leaves Anakin to fry - he's obliged to kill him in order to stop the madness, but he feels betrayed as a friend too. (Approximative) quote:"You were like a son to me!"

It was surprising, maybe even disapointing how fast Dooku was dealt with (bearing in mind he managed to severely injure both Jedi rather masterfully in AOTC). Although Anakin warns Dooku that his powers have doubled since their last encounter, it's not completely satisfactory. Dooku's catchy reply: (quote by approximation) 'The higher the ambition, the deeper her the fall' !

Also, Palpatine's ironic story of 'rise and fall of a Sith' (his Master whom he killed single-handedly), worked alright for me. Sometimes a pitty his voice acting, along with his laughs at times made him look like a comicbook caricature (reminding me of Gargamel from the Smurfs). Then again, Grievous Russian-alike voice may have seemed a bit overacted, but the only other option was that it sounded hoarse, and here he's snappy. I wish we'd seen more of the (rather small) alien inside him as Obi can-opened his carcass with his lightsaber, but him burning up from inside and his eyesockets ejecting flames was fair enough. Using a blaster to do the job was not Jedi style, but hey Kenobi simply crushed 3 or 4 of Grievous' guards with one block too, avoiding unnecessary stretching the action and pace of the story. The backsetting spinning action of forward-chopping lightsabers was a nice treat, but I guess it's hard enough synchronizing arm movements while cöordinating lightsaber blows for the experts at ILM.

It's weird how Palpatine, himself actually realizing that all great men who seize high(est) powers, eventually fall and succumb to their own weakness or hunger towards power (irony of was that the story's Sith Lord could prevent anyone from dying except himself), while he himself wishes to achieve ultimate power, having learned nothing from that lesson (that someday he'll eventually fall). Blinded by ambition and overconfidence allright. Breaking loose of the chains was OK, though Vader shouting "NOOOO!" after realizing Padmés death and Palpatine grinning in irony was too much of a cliché line not to catch the drama. He should've shouted something less pathetic, like: "Why !!!" (falling to his knees, cracking up the floor through raying his dark force anger instead of balling his fists like a moron, (then turning to Palpatine:) "You promised me she would live!... (shouting): "You... (pointing at Palpatine, maybe even attempting a shortly aborted choke on Palpatine) lied to me!" ... (Palpatine giving the comment how it was his choice to make , Vader looking up to a zoomed-in camera): I will revive/avenge you, Padmé. I will find a way." (then again, I'm not George Lucas).

Indeed, a lot of references to other films: close hallways, a space that reminiscenced the long surfboard-shaped bay in ESB whith walkway around it. Even the breaking of the panoramic window in Palpatine's chambers during the duel with Windu instantly reminded me of the dark Cloud City spiderweb glassed room in ESB. And the departure of Yoda was a great hommage to Spielberg's E.T.'s farewell to Elliot and capsule liftoff.

The birth of the twins are forever engraved in the minds of fans, the moment was only slightly spoiled by the medical droid. The delivery of Leia and especially Luke to Beru and Owen Lars was almost like romantic art. It moved me to tears, and didn't strike me as a cheesy moment, or a kitsch copy of Luke's watching the binary sunset. No, here I felt symbolic ties that bined the generations of the Star Wars protagonists, the feel of universal connectivity, although apart of distant worlds between the heirs of a destroyed Republic.
 
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soapboxtop

New member
My impression...with spoilers.

Spoilers included. I posted this somewhere else too, thought I'd share my opinion here as well. ;)











Overall a good experience. The movie had its weak points but mostly, the good parts made up for it. One major beef I have is not about the movie itself but the theater. The sound levels were way too loud. I was cringing at every explosion. Not good.

So the whole story revolves around Anakin turning to the dark side. We see him seduced by Palpatine, yet it seems to be all happening too fast. I hear the movie was supposed to be 3 hour long, yet had to be shortened because of the PG13 rating and Luca's fears that a movie too long would keep moviegoers away.

Yeah, so what of Lord of the Rings? Didn't the last movie last 3+ hours? Anyway. Let's talk about the actors.

Samuel L. Jackson in his role as Mace Windu. Could Mace Windu be less likable than he was in Episode III? Here comes Anakin telling him all about Palpatine's plan but Mace Windu turns around and addresses him in a cold manner to reward him? No wonder Anakin turns to the dark side! I would have wanted to kick his *** right then and right there myself.

Natalie Portman as Padme. Anakin strangles her and she loses the will to live, even though she's carrying not one but two babies? Was that selfish of her? Also, the scene when she gives birth to Luke and leia bothered me. It happened way too fast and here she's naming the babies and dies. Too fake.

Flashback to earlier in the movie, for the award of cheesiest line ever. Padme and Anaking are together. Anakin: "You are so beautiful" Padme: "That's because I'm so in love with you." Anakin: "No, that's because I'm so in love with *you*!"

Eyes roll, the whole scene's a joke.

However, Padme redeems herself with this line at the Senate "This is how democracy dies, with the sound of thundering applause." Now that was memorable.

Ewan McGregor as Obi-Wan Kenobi. Probably the best character along with -shudders- Yoda. He was quite convincing, especially at the end. Now, is it me or the Obi-wan/Anakin scene at the end reminds me of Frodo and Sam at Mordor, especially when Obi-wan cries out "I loved you! You were supposed to be the Chosen One!"?

The younglins, 3 to 10 year old padawans slayed by Anakin...I almost regret they didn't show the actual slaying, just Anakin brandishing his sword. A twisted part of me wanted to see the slaying. That would have certainly made cinema history. But then PG 13 would have turned into R...Order 66 was one of the greatest scenes ever, and I believe this is due in part by the extremely well done score of John Williams at the moment, it was dark and poignant.


I'm not a huge fan of Star Wars but I did grow up with it, overall, one of the best Star Wars ever. I actually cared for the main characters. One big flaw for me: the whole movie had a video game look to it, some of the space battles were way too confusing. You wonder how they could not smash into each other's fighters.

The best part of the movie, I think, was in Palpatine's role. How a republic can turn into the evil Empire on reasons of peace and stability. Hmm....reminds me of our current political situation. Of course, the Third Reich was the original influence, however it is plain to see this was updated to include references to what's happening right now with Iraq.

So, that's about it for now. I thought Star Wars was dead after the crap we were fed with The Phantom Menace, but seeing the third episode seems to put the previous two into perspective, like a slow decent to Hell.
 

Aaron H

Moderator Emeritus
Not much that I can add. ROTS really made up for TPM and AOTC (which wasn't half bad).

Personally, I have always felt that the events of TPM could have been summed up in an opening crawl or a flashback scene. Instead Lucas should have started with AOTC (as Ep. I), done more with the Clone Wars and Anakin's slip to the Dark Side (as Ep. II), and ended with the Jedi Purgings & Anakin becoming the "more machine than man" version of Darth Vader.
Lucas spent so long setting up the political events of Ep. III that the story that he needed to tell more ended up needing to be rushed.

I wanted to see more of Bail Organa for crying out loud. Here he plays a vitial role in the survival of Leia, and all we see of him in Ep. I & II is reduced to a few glancing shots of him acting like scenery!

I also wanted an explanation of why the cave on Dagobah is "strong in the dark side, it is".

Those lingering details and questions could have been answered if Lucas had not bothered with Episode I (at least as he made it).

All that aside, however, I have to take what I have been given by the Flannled One and rank my movies in the order that I would view them (thus in the order of my favorites, even it is hard to compair it to the original trilogy)

1. ESB
2. RotS
3. RotJ
4. ANH
5. AotC
6. TMP (it barely makes it on my list)
 

Canyon

Well-known member
Great reviews, guys, but will you leave Padme alone! :mad:

She's heavily pregnant, for crying out loud. A lot of pregnant women are constantly riding an emotional rollercoaster and she not only has that to deal with, but the possibility that she might lose Anakin, or she may even die herself.



DaFedora said:
Breaking loose of the chains was OK, though Vader shouting "NOOOO!" after realizing Padmés death and Palpatine grinning in irony was too much of a cliché line not to catch the drama. He should've shouted something less pathetic, like: "Why !!!" (falling to his knees, cracking up the floor through raying his dark force anger instead of balling his fists like a moron, (then turning to Palpatine:) "You promised me she would live!... (shouting): "You... (pointing at Palpatine, maybe even attempting a shortly aborted choke on Palpatine) lied to me!" ... (Palpatine giving the comment how it was his choice to make , Vader looking up to a zoomed-in camera): I will revive/avenge you, Padmé. I will find a way." (then again, I'm not George Lucas).

Dafedora, you're a genius! You should have written the script for that part. :D
 
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