Indy 5 news 2018

IndyForever

Active member
TheFirebird1 said:
https://nerdist.com/indiana-jones-5-story-frank-marshall/
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Let's hope it doesn't get pushed back to 2022 at this rate. Were Koepp's numerous script drafts really that unworkable?
EDIT: This line right here has to be my favorite from the article (emphasis mine):

Interpret that as you will. But as someone who almost passed out from boredom while watching the newest installment of the Bourne saga, I really hope that Marshall and Kasdan take a different route for Indy 5. Again, I didn't mind KotCS, but I'd prefer a slightly less lukewarm farewell to the saga.
Marshal is ONLY the person who is hired to make it physically happen. He has zero influence on the actual storyline. Lucas will most likely be asked for input WHEN Spielberg feels he has something he wants to direct.

If Spielberg wanted to really make 5 it would happen very fast & within 2 years be in theatres but clearly he is dragging his heels now. Ford is just too old now BR2049 proved he is carrying a serious leg injury & cannot run properly. They can shoot around that but 5 would have to let most of the action be either something Indy has initiated or can influence without too much physical action otherwise your into sidekick territory (most likely Asian as well to appeal to the Asian markets which saved Ready Player One from booking a massive loss!).

5 is unlikely to happen the longer the delay the less chance it will ever happen. Announcing a release date & 2019 UK filming start date then cancelling that 3 months later shows either Disney or Spielberg are very unsure its such a good idea to go forward on this final sequel.

Hiring the man who writes bland Disney Star Wars is not a good sign either. If Koepp could not pull the ideas together then its unlikely someone else can as Koepp & Spielberg are pretty familiar with each others strengths & weaknesses.

Its pure unobtanium fantasy vapourware unless there is a dramatic story breakthrough finding a new way to tell a commercial story with Ford as the much older Indy whilst also keeping most of the fan friendly elements from previous films in the franchise.
 

Z dweller

Well-known member
TheFirebird1 said:
Nothing there we didn't already know...
TheFirebird1 said:
Were Koepp's numerous script drafts really that unworkable?
Who knows?
Personally, I don't mind Koepp out of the picture: he already got his chance and blew it with KOTCS.

Thing is, time is ticking away, and writing a decent Indy story starring a nearly octogenarian actor is pretty much...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/AvBVGsd4Lzc" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 

TheFirebird1

Active member
IndyForever said:
Ford is just too old now BR2049 proved he is carrying a serious leg injury & cannot run properly. They can shoot around that but 5 would have to let most of the action be either something Indy has initiated or can influence without too much physical action.
I wanted to talk about this for a little bit before I addressed anything else. First off, most of 2049's footage was filmed in 2016--mind you, only a brief period after the accident--so it's no surprise that anybody, young or old, would still probably be in excruciating pain. Remember, it was decided in a court of law that Harrison could have possibly died in the set incident. But besides that, even on 2049's set, Harrison was functioning perfectly. Hell, according to Ryan Gosling he was doing backflips and other gymnastic moves exquisitely for fun on set, and apparently still packs a punch. So as for physicality, I strenuously disagree with you here.
Moedred said:
I believe the Nerdist report from yesterday was a clarification of this one (from October 1st) but correct me if I'm wrong.
Z dweller said:
Personally, I don't mind Koepp out of the picture: he already got his chance and blew it with KOTCS.
Although I beg to differ on KotCS, I agree with the first part of your statement. Koepp was never exactly necessary for the film, all it really needed was a competent screenwriter.
Z dweller said:
Thing is, time is ticking away, and writing a decent Indy story starring a nearly octogenarian actor is pretty much...
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I get it. Harrison Ford is almost eighty years old. But here's another thing. I really don't care. Especially when it's brought up every two posts. If he can do at least one more movie (even with alternating storylines) it's not a problem. If he can't, well, that's terrible, but we'll have to move on. Bar some debilitating predicament that could ruin the film because of this, there's no reason that it should be obsessed over. People age. Harrison has aged pretty well, if you ask me. But it's not even close to my top reasons of why I'm worried about this film.
It's all about time management. If they can't manage it well, then it's done for. If they can get working immediately, then we're in luck.
 

Pale Horse

Moderator
Staff member
Z dweller said:
...
Thing is, time is ticking away, and writing a decent Indy story starring a nearly octogenarian actor is pretty much...

Uh, they never actually didn't complete a mission. It was more like Mission Highly successful. It's a bad analogy, LOL

TheFirebird1 said:
IPeople age. Harrison has aged pretty well, if you ask me. But it's not even close to my top reasons of why I'm worried about this film.
It's all about time management. If they can't manage it well, then it's done for. If they can get working immediately, then we're in luck.


This. As someone who gets called out as an ageist, it has nothing to do with age. For me, the story has to be compelling. And well acted.
 

Z dweller

Well-known member
TheFirebird1 said:
I really don't care.
We know, but that is completely immaterial.

The fact is, Ford's age makes it objectively very difficult to come up with a good story for Indy 5, particularly if they are not willing to do parallel stories.

The comedy angle has already been done in KOTCS, what do you do next?
I guess they could play the cynical old Indy angle (think Eastwood in "Gran Torino"), but I can't see Ford/Spielberg or indeed the Mouse execs going for that.
Really, who'd want to watch that movie, apart from a handful of hard core fans?

Which leaves us with that wonderful Shifrin tune in 5/4.

If and when Koepp's discarded scripts surface, we'll see how he meant to deal with it.
Meanwhile, good luck to Kasdan Jr., he's gonna need it.
I do hope he was brought in to do parallel stories.

IMO, that's the only way they can try to salvage the project at this stage.


Oh, and shame on you for quoting Ramsey, I can't stand the arrogant p....k. :gun:
 

Z dweller

Well-known member
Pale Horse said:
Uh, they never actually didn't complete a mission. It was more like Mission Highly successful. It's a bad analogy, LOL
True, but you get my meaning.

Unless you just morphed into The Eternally Hopeful Horsie™ , which would surprise me no end. :p
 

Indy Jones

Active member
If the story was about how Indy was pulled into one last adventure (like TOD, where he's in the middle of something and can't not get involved) at a point in his life when he's stopped adventuring--thus leading to a lot of tense/sobering bits about how he just can't do it like he used to--but manages to save the day one more time?

Sounds good to me. But at this point, I don't think you can really get away with glossing over it like KOTCS did. If they're making the film smartly (as I'd hope Spielberg would do), the film can have Indy pull off some cool stuff, but balance that with moments where Jones really has to push more than he ever had to before. It would add a new dimension to the story. Honestly, Indy ought to still be pretty good with firearms if nothing else.

If they've gotta have a younger sidekick with him, I'd love for there to be moments where Jones manages to outdo the new blood with his sheer experience, and I don't just mean in archeological knowledge. Like he manages to take out a tough dude by simply knowing where to hit the guy once, afterword saying "you could tell he had a glass jaw/his form was weak/he was scared," or something along those lines.

KOTCS was the first film back. We wanted to emulate the good old days. I don't think a fifth film (especially another sequel made in this more advanced movie era) need be as concerned about recapturing the glory days. I don't want Indy to be a wheezing cripple who can't hang, but I am perfectly happy with him being out of step and having to rely even more on his wits. Have him trade decent punches with lackeys, but for the big Pat Roach-type dude? He's gotta out-think him this time.

But hey, that's if the film even happens at this point.
 

Z dweller

Well-known member
Indy Jones said:
If the story was about how Indy was pulled into one last adventure (like TOD, where he's in the middle of something and can't not get involved) at a point in his life when he's stopped adventuring--thus leading to a lot of tense/sobering bits about how he just can't do it like he used to--but manages to save the day one more time?

Sounds good to me. But at this point, I don't think you can really get away with glossing over it like KOTCS did. If they're making the film smartly (as I'd hope Spielberg would do), the film can have Indy pull off some cool stuff, but balance that with moments where Jones really has to push more than he ever had to before. It would add a new dimension to the story. Honestly, Indy ought to still be pretty good with firearms if nothing else.

If they've gotta have a younger sidekick with him, I'd love for there to be moments where Jones manages to outdo the new blood with his sheer experience, and I don't just mean in archeological knowledge. Like he manages to take out a tough dude by simply knowing where to hit the guy once, afterword saying "you could tell he had a glass jaw/his form was weak/he was scared," or something along those lines.

KOTCS was the first film back. We wanted to emulate the good old days. I don't think a fifth film (especially another sequel made in this more advanced movie era) need be as concerned about recapturing the glory days. I don't want Indy to be a wheezing cripple who can't hang, but I am perfectly happy with him being out of step and having to rely even more on his wits. Have him trade decent punches with lackeys, but for the big Pat Roach-type dude? He's gotta out-think him this time.

But hey, that's if the film even happens at this point.
This was suggested before, but how do you frame the tone of this type of movie?

I don't think constantly bouncing between cynical realism and comedy would work.
You gotta pick one, at least in the main.

So, mainly tense/sobering with a dash of comedy here and there?
Or the reverse?

I don't know, I just don't see it for an Indy adventure - not for one I'd want to watch anyway.
 

Indy Jones

Active member
Z dweller said:
This was suggested before, but how do you frame the tone of this type of movie?

I don't think constantly bouncing between cynical realism and comedy would work.
You gotta pick one, at least in the main.

So, mainly tense/sobering with a dash of comedy here and there?
Or the reverse?

I don't know, I just don't see it for an Indy adventure - not for one I'd want to watch anyway.

Something like a lighter version of Logan? That film still had humor in it but wasn't a comedy.

Actually, I feel like the tone of ROTLA is pretty much right. There were absurd, Saturday-matinee aspects to ROTLA but our characters grounded it. It wasn't as overtly silly as the sequels have been. If they could return to something in-line with Raiders then we'd be pitch perfect.
 

IndyForever

Active member
TheFirebird1 said:
I wanted to talk about this for a little bit before I addressed anything else. First off, most of 2049's footage was filmed in 2016--mind you, only a brief period after the accident--so it's no surprise that anybody, young or old, would still probably be in excruciating pain. But besides that, even on 2049's set, Harrison was functioning perfectly. Hell, according to Ryan Gosling he was doing backflips and other gymnastic moves exquisitely for fun on set, and apparently still packs a punch. So as for physicality, I strenuously disagree with you here.
Do not take what Gosling says as fact he is a known joker with the media! and has a very droll sense of humour.

I get it. Harrison Ford is almost eighty years old. But here's another thing. I really don't care. Especially when it's brought up every two posts. His age does not bother me at all either but he is clearly getting to the very end of a credible Indy portrayal on the big screen. The thing is the people who fund the movie @ Disney do care very much and that is the problem & most likely why Koepps script was dumped late in the day to rework with some major elements which appeal to younger audiences. Koepp is directing his own movie now is why he is probably not involved in the rewrite or new concept.
Time management is against them as well Spielberg is making yet another movie next summer so he is tied up with that for at least 12 months now then will he jump right onto Indy 5 or take another project.

It just seems that Spielberg is not that committed anymore to getting this done. In his mind its no big deal but filming Ford in a credible way is a massive big deal when movie cameras are showing way more detail than ever before (BR2049 UHD made Ford look a LOT older than he looks outside a movie set for instance due to poor set lighting choices) they cannot easily hide physical issues and Harrison does have a limp still its obvious when he walks if you look close enough.

KOTCS was showing Ford's age quite a bit as well (fading voice due to smoking) and that was 11 years ago now. Indy 5 has a lot less chance of ever getting made with Harrison as the time factor is really against them & Disney will without a doubt insist on a much younger sidekick or sidekicks which will further dilute the focus from Harrison into something they can market globally as a blockbuster :hat:
 

Z dweller

Well-known member
Indy Jones said:
If they could return to something in-line with Raiders then we'd be pitch perfect.
That, my friend, is one tall order.

It would take an absolute miracle to even get in the same g̶a̶l̶a̶x̶y̶ ballpark.

Ain't gonna happen, I'm afraid. :(
 

Indy Jones

Active member
Z dweller said:
That, my friend, is one tall order.

It would take an absolute miracle to even get in the same g̶a̶l̶a̶x̶y̶ ballpark.

Ain't gonna happen, I'm afraid. :(

I mean in terms of tone. Quality is subjective.
 

Z dweller

Well-known member
Indy Jones said:
I mean in terms of tone. Quality is subjective.
I understand, but it's still impossibly difficult to do, and unlikely that the existing crew would go for it.

Now, if they gave it to Nolan*...



*Yes, I'm looking at you Raiders112390. :p
 

TheFirebird1

Active member
Z dweller said:
We know, but that is completely immaterial.
Then so is your opinion on Ford's age. You've got to be careful with statements like that, or we get back into the whole endless debate cycle again.
Z dweller said:
The fact is, Ford's age makes it objectively very difficult to come up with a good story for Indy 5, particularly if they are not willing to do parallel stories.
In all honesty, it really shouldn't, especially in the hands of a competent screenwriter.
Z dweller said:
I guess they could play the cynical old Indy angle (think Eastwood in "Gran Torino"), but I can't see Ford/Spielberg or indeed the Mouse execs going for that.
Really, who'd want to watch that movie, apart from a handful of hard core fans?
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That is all.
Z dweller said:
Oh, and shame on you for quoting Ramsey, I can't stand the arrogant p....k. :gun:
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In all honesty, I don't mind the guy. He's portraying a character wherever he goes, and making millions from it. More power to him.
Indy Jones said:
Something like a lighter version of Logan? That film still had humor in it but wasn't a comedy.

Actually, I feel like the tone of ROTLA is pretty much right. There were absurd, Saturday-matinee aspects to ROTLA but our characters grounded it. It wasn't as overtly silly as the sequels have been. If they could return to something in-line with Raiders then we'd be pitch perfect.
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This is a genuinely fantastic statement. If I could (I swear, I'm not being facetious here), I'd hang it on my wall immediately. Maybe by some stroke of luck Marshall and Kasdan stumble upon this and take notes. This is what Indy 5 should be.
And nothing else.
IndyForever said:
Do not take what Gosling says as fact he is a known joker with the media! and has a very droll sense of humour.
I understand that Gosling is a very dry, pithy man. But this is a story which has been backed up by many if I remember correctly.
IndyForever said:
Koepps script was dumped late in the day to rework with some major elements which appeal to younger audiences.
We don't know that at all yet. It's too early to begin making assumptions with this thing.
IndyForever said:
Time management is against them as well Spielberg is making yet another movie next summer so he is tied up with that for at least 12 months now then will he jump right onto Indy 5 or take another project...It just seems that Spielberg is not that committed anymore to getting this done.
In this I can sympathize with you. Time is of the essence, and obviously that time is running out. I don't know what Spielberg's interest in the project is right now, but it would be better if he could pull himself away from things like West Side Story and focus on Indy.
Z dweller said:
Now, if they gave it to Nolan*...
That would be fantastic! Imagine Indy on 70mm film and Dunkirk-style surround sound? It would easily sweep the Oscars.
(Alright, I'm being sarcastic here, but Nolan is a good director, no matter what some others at the board may think.)
*Yes, I'm looking at you Raiders112390.
Rumor is that if you mention both Nolan and racial diversity in the same sentence you can conjure him up. (y) (y).
Pale Horse said:
This. As someone who gets called out as an ageist, it has nothing to do with age. For me, the story has to be compelling. And well acted.
My sentiments exactly.
 

Z dweller

Well-known member
TheFirebird1 said:
1200x630bb.jpg

That is all.
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Jackman was 48 years old when that movie was shot.
Forty-eight.

Only one year older than Ford in Crusade.
TheFirebird1 said:
Rumor is that if you mention both Nolan and racial diversity in the same sentence you can conjure him up. (y) (y).
You jest, but he hasn't been around in a while...
Are you still with us, dude? :eek:
 

Indy Jones

Active member
Z dweller said:
Jackman was 48 years old when that movie was shot.
Forty-eight.

Only one year older than Ford in Crusade.

...honestly, I'm so sick of seeing this mentality. Ford's age is (technically) irrelevant to what can (or can't) be featured in the fifth film. In this modern world of CGI, they can technically make Ford look like he's doing anything. Body double with his face on it/full CGI character/puppet him with strings and just CG erase the strings/whatever.

Now should they? Oh God, no. But people claiming "he's too old so Indy can only sit around in the movie" is such a lazy argument.

And also, as I've been elaborating on before... just because it's an Indiana Jones film doesn't mean that they can't construct a satisfying movie that works within the limitations set by Ford's age. Let Indy have a limp, if Ford really does have one. Who cares?

If someone is so particular in the sacredness of their memories that seeing Indy as a old man ruins things for them... just don't see the movie. I love Star Wars, but I have no interest in a show about some random Mandalorian.... so I won't see it. Its existence does not harm me.

I'm all-for discussing an idea's merits, but when absolutely no idea seems good enough for someone (not talking about anyone in particular here, just in general), then why bother joining in the discussion?

Now back to the tone--I would hope that without George involved, they'd be willing to branch out again in terms of style/content. I think it should still feel like an Indiana Jones film. I wouldn't want it to suddenly feel like Inception or anything. But I think you can bend and stretch the conventions of the character/style to get a different feel. Clearly, Ford won't be in another one after 5 (assuming it actually happens), so I think it's necessary to give the film a little bit of a somber feeling, lend it an edge of finality.

The tone of ROTLA is so necessary on this one not only because it would bookend the series in terms of tonality, but also because it's the right canvas to mix-in some melancholy. ROTLA was mostly moody with serious characters and a palpable sense of threat. TOD had vast portions that retained this, but by then we added comedy sidekicks. This is different than ROTLA (and KOTCS too, technically), because comedy with sidekicks is different than "comedy sidekicks." Short Round and Willie generally were used expressly for comedy. Willie's entire character was predicated on it. LC had turned Sallah and Marcus into comedy sidekicks, and Henry Sr. was both A source of humor and used to make Indy sometimes bumbling. The tone of the second and third films are drastically changed by these facts.

KOTCS goes back to having sidekicks that have quirks, but are generally played straight. Where KOTCS veers off from matching the tone from ROTLA is in the situations--because of CG they were usually much broader and thereby more outlandish--whether these were good or bad is up for debate, but it still prevents the original tone from shining through. Don't forget that ROTLA was nominated for Best Picture. Despite the comic book nature of the ideas on screen, it played ominous and moody with a dash of intrigue and suspense without losing a sense of fun.

Lightning in a bottle, boy yes--but I don't get the feeling that they ever actually tried to recapture that exact spirit. For Indy 5 to fly, I think it's time they zeroed in on that target one last time.
 
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Z dweller

Well-known member
Indy Jones said:
...honestly, I'm so sick of seeing this mentality. Ford's age is (technically) irrelevant to what can (or can't) be featured in the fifth film.
Really?

So, would you be open minded towards further Indy movies with Ford in his 80s and 90s, provided Disney/Spielberg/Ford were willing to make them?

Is there an age limit at all? 100 still good for you, potentially?

After all, according to you it's technically irrelevant.
 

Indy Jones

Active member
Z dweller said:
Really?

So, would you be open minded towards further Indy movies with Ford in his 80s and 90s, provided Disney/Spielberg/Ford were willing to make them?

Is there an age limit at all? 100 still good for you, potentially?

After all, according to you it's technically irrelevant.

Yeah, you're being a smart ass, but provided there was an interesting story... Yes.

And I said technically irrelevent. Read the rest of my post to find out why.
 

Z dweller

Well-known member
Indy Jones said:
Yeah, you're being a smart ass, but provided there was an interesting story... Yes.

And I said technically irrelevent. Read the rest of my post to find out why.
Touch a nerve, did I? :whip:

You couldn't have replied differently - or else your logic falls apart, and you know it.

You would be happy to watch an Indiana Jones movie with a 100 year old Harrison Ford - provided it were good.
Ok, sure, dude...

I rest my case.
 
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