Princess Sophie

Archaeos

Member
reinthal, I very much agree with you.

It's almost 19 years ago when I saw that episode "Die Abenteuer des jungen Indiana Jones (The Young Indiana Jones Chronicles) - Die Prinzessin auf dem Eis (Wien 1908)" in November 1993 on German TV station Sat.1 (so, virtually 85 years after the events on screen should have taken place).

It left a big impression on me, given that family history goes well into Austro-Hungarian Vienna - my paternal grandfather was 5 years younger than Young Indy then :D (y) :rolleyes: .

The academic parts of the episode also influenced me quite a lot, on a sort of "unconscious bias" level, if you want :sleep: .

Incidentally, yesterday last year (so... eh... one year ago :p ), I saw that episode for first time ever again, on the DVD Set of "The Adventures of Young Indiana Jones: Volume One ? The Early Years ? Perils of Cupid (Vienna + Florence 1908)" that I had just purchased. Had the same effect.
Funnily enough, I watched it with my partner, and she remembered that episode as well back from 1993, with similar sentiment. (y)

That the Sophie Fürstin von Hohenberg plotline was never picked up again is one of the really annoying aspects from the series for me, and the only loose end that I really would like to see tied up in some official way in the franchise.
The obvious oversight in what I guess is now known as "The Adventures of Young Indiana Jones: Volume Two ? The War Years ? Adventures in the Secret Service (Austria + Petrograd 1917) is all the more aggravating, because completely unnecessary/lazy.

I also find it sad that people who have never seen the Old Indy bookends will have no indication that Sophie played a further role in Indy's life - which is absolutely plausible. Just look at the influence Otto von Habsburg had on the remaining history of Europe in the second half of the 20th century. Given that Sophie outlived Otto's mother and her relative Zita Maria delle Grazie von Bourbon-Parma by just one year, there's is ripe opportunity to pair Indy and her... (the inevitable comment has to come now...)... maybe in Indy V.

I am sure this is well-known and documented here, but just in case: Sophie's second degree nephew is of course Friedrich von Thun (und Hohenstein), who played Albert Schweitzer (see "The Adventures of Young Indiana Jones: Volume Two ? The War Years ? Oganga, the Giver and Taker of Life (German East Africa 1916 + Congo 1917)". For any German speaker, von Thun's epic documentary series "Die Habsburger ? Eine europäische Familiengeschichte" is also well worth watching.
 

reinthal

New member
I can only imagine that Indy and Princess Sophie would've been shown meeting again in the unproduced third series of the YIJC if at all. I say this as throughout the series there's a strong indication that their relationship is important to the narrative (i.e. Indy is shown looking wistfully at her portrait in the locket on occasions, which reminds the audience of her) and we know it is a tale worth telling (i.e. from the "Old Indy" bookend).

I've had a look at the list of unproduced episodes and none of the ones listed seem a plausible meeting place for Indy and Princess Sophie: not Honduras December 1920, not Alaska June 1921, not Brazil December 1921.

All I know is that Indy doesn't wear the locket in Temple of Doom (1935) or indeed any of the films - the last we see him wearing it is in Hollywood Follies ... I'll leave you all wondering about what that little nugget of trivia means!:whip:
 

Stoo

Well-known member
reinthal said:
I always wanted to find out what ended up happening between Indy and Princess Sophie as it was pretty clear from watching the series that they would meet again (the locket and his whistful gazes at her portrait were prominent throughout the series) and this was verified when I caught Stoo's "Old Indy" bookend for this episode on YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrzsNMES6ds) (thanks Stoo!(y)). It was disappointing when I had gotten through the entire series on DVD without them meeting again.:(
No offense to you, Reinthal, but it would be great if this topic was merged with a sympatico thread. Perhaps (Violet or another moderator could do it?)

Princess Sophie

Anyway, GREAT question about the missed opportunity!:hat: Especially considering that those chapters were 2 of the earliest 15 (out of 44) episodes to be filmed. Which means they were both conceived & written around the same time. It's a wonder why no reference was made in the later episode. The running strings throughout the series are sewn together so well but, sadly, Sophie's sort of disappears...

You're welcome for the YouTube video, Reinthal, and I like the way you write. (Ex. "whistful gazes": Nice one!):)
Archaeos said:
I also find it sad that people who have never seen the Old Indy bookends will have no indication that Sophie played a further role in Indy's life - which is absolutely plausible.
Archy, great post as always, and I agree with this. It's one of those unfortunate bits of information that gets lost with the 'repackaged' format. Thanks for the heads-up on Friedrich von Thun's documentary series. I will definitely keep an eye out.

Please see the other thread because, surely, it will interest you.:hat:
 

Archaeos

Member
Stoo, thanks for the other Sophie thread reference. Looking forward to reading it later this week (still unpacking from Turkey and stuff). Meanwhile, I support merging the two as well.

I am unclear on the DVD status of von Thun's "Die Habsburger ? Eine europäische Familiengeschichte" series. I recall having seen a big DVD boxset during a trip to Vienna in 2007, produced by the ORF. Once I hit the web to buy it, I wasn't able to find it. Sometimes, it's better to just buy it now and then, and not ponder about luggage weight and retail pricing :( .

It's up on YouTube, but with 12 episodes, and each one sub-divided into 3 YouTube shares, it's not the easiest click-through watching experience, if you know what I mean. You can catch Episode 1/12 (1 of 3) HERE.

It starts in Habsburg, Switzerland, as it's supposed to. Incidentally, I grew up just 40m/70km away from there, so know the castle from week-end outings as a kid :cool: .
I am sure you have visited it too by now.
 

reinthal

New member
Stoo said:
No offense to you, Reinthal, but it would be great if this topic was merged with a sympatico thread. Perhaps (Violet or another moderator could do it?)

Princess Sophie

Sure Stoo. Merge away.

I did some searching before I started the thread but included Sophie and Sixtus and locket or something like that... :eek:
 

Stoo

Well-known member
Reinthal,
Let's hope a MOD merges them because both threads have good discussion/information and they definitely belong together. Doing a search with "Sophie" in the thread title, the only other one showing (besides yours) is this: Is Princess Sophie, Sophia Hapgood? Why didn't the other thread turn up?:confused:

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Archaeos,
Thanks a bunch for the link! I'm very interested in seeing it.:hat:

No, I haven't yet been to Habsburg but have been very, very close (in Baden). Where did you live? While driving to Aachen last December, I came across a German town called, Egg. It's within the 40m/70km radius of Habsburg. Any chance you grew up in Egg?:p
reinthal said:
I'll leave you all wondering about what that little nugget of trivia means!:whip:
Bestow thy nugget upon us, dude!:whip:
 

reinthal

New member
Stoo said:
Bestow thy nugget upon us, dude!:whip:

Ha. I wrote that in case there were those out there who like to play the game of trying to work out why Indy stopped wearing the locket.

Of course, we all know it's all because the Princess Sophie storyline belongs in the Young Indy canon which was developed well after the initial three movies. But for those who like to ponder such things, ponder on guys! :gun:

Perhaps Indy met her again in between Follies and Doom and she found that he kept on getting drunk and mentioning some "Marion" woman so she demanded it back!! Who knows?!?? :whip:
 

Stoo

Well-known member
reinthal said:
Perhaps Indy met her again in between Follies and Doom and she found that he kept on getting drunk and mentioning some "Marion" woman so she demanded it back!! Who knows?!??:whip:
Marion could have found the locket on Indy's chest in 1926, ripped the chain off his neck, swung it hard to smack him right across his face (in a rage of teenaged jealousy), and then threw the thing into the Chicago River!:eek::p

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Thanks for the merge, Mods!:hat:
 

reinthal

New member
Perhaps during one of Indy's earlier encounters with Belloq, his aristocratic French nemesis yanked it off from around Indy's neck, held it up and said "Look at this. It's worthless - ten dollars from a vendor in the street. But I take it, I bury it in the sand for a thousand years, it becomes priceless!" and promptly threw down into the depths of whatever archaeological site they were at at the time...

Oh boy, now were getting in to fan fiction territory... :rolleyes: ... not that there's anything wrong with that. ;)
 
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Cinemalens

New member
Late to the party, I know, but does anyone know anything about the locket itself? Like who made it, how big it is, etc? I'm looking for as close a replica as possible
 

TheAlmanac

New member
reinthal said:
Ha. I wrote that in case there were those out there who like to play the game of trying to work out why Indy stopped wearing the locket.

Of course, we all know it's all because the Princess Sophie storyline belongs in the Young Indy canon which was developed well after the initial three movies. But for those who like to ponder such things, ponder on guys! :gun:

Perhaps Indy met her again in between Follies and Doom and she found that he kept on getting drunk and mentioning some "Marion" woman so she demanded it back!! Who knows?!?? :whip:
Indeed, I've always assumed that the fate of the locket was somehow related to the "other story" about meeting Sophie again which Old Indy alluded to at the end of the bookends for "Vienna, November 1908."
 

Kai Hagen

New member
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Maybe he stopped carrying the locket after learning that Sophie married someone else?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Princess_Sophie_of_Hohenberg#Marriage_and_issue
Sophie married Count Friedrich von Nostitz-Rieneck (1891–1973) on 8 September 1920. They had four children:



IndyJr. said:
Here's the facts...

After the assassination, she and her brothers were taken in by Prince Jaroslav von Thun und Hohenstein (their father's close friend) to live in Czechoslovakia (it actually became it's own separate nation in 1918) until 1918 when their property was confiscated. At that point the children moved to Vienna once again. There they stayed until 1938 when they were arrested by the Nazis and placed in a Bavarian Concentration Camp where they stayed for another 7 years until 1945. After that, I don't know.
Very interesting point:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Princess_Sophie_of_Hohenberg#Later_life
In 1938, following the Anschluss (the union of Austria and Germany under Adolf Hitler), her brothers Maximilian and Ernst were arrested by the Gestapo as a result of making anti-Nazi statements and deported to Dachau concentration camp. Their properties in Austria were confiscated by Nazi authorities.[6] They both survived their imprisonment in Dachau.
Maybe Indy's anger at the Nazis started from here?
 

Raiders90

Well-known member
The simplest answer is he probably lost it during an adventure between 1920 and 1935. Or maybe he keeps it tucked away in his house somewhere. Just because he isn't wearing it in 1935 doesn't mean it isn't in a box of mementos somewhere.
 

Kai Hagen

New member
Stoo said:
Two years after the events in "Raiders"? :confused: Think about it.
He didn't say this in Raiders of the Lost Ark. The level of anger is very different.

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