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Old 11-03-2008, 08:14 PM   #26
sandiegojones
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Originally Posted by IndyJr.
Clint Eastwood ... American Archeological Rival (Villain)

I totally had the same idea! He'd be an American rival which Indy hasn't had yet.
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Old 11-03-2008, 09:30 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Moedred
If it's halfway decent and the beards announce it's the end of the saga, it would do as well as KotCS or better. Star Wars 3 and Lord of the Rings 3 showed that people turn up for a final installment. The Harry Potter 7 double dip anticipates this phenomenon, the appeal to completionists.

Very good point.

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Originally Posted by deckard24
  • Fantastic Marketing/Great Storyline/Dynamic Villain/Excellent Word of Mouth
    $325-350 million Domestic $800-900 million Worldwide

  • So-So Marketing/Okay Storyline/Mediocre Villain/So-So Word of Mouth
    $230-260 million Domestic $600-700 million Worldwide

$785 million worldwide, actually...should read $700-800 million. Which is damn good, no matter how you slice it. By the end of this year I'm sure DVD sales will push that profit number well over a billion. Any movie that grosses that much usually warrants a sequel (at least by the studio heads). Its a financial success, and a definitive one. Its budget was 185 million, it made 785 million, ie 600 million profit, minues whatever other additional costs = still a hell of a lot of money and a notable financial success in the eyes of the studio heads. If George, Steven, and Harrison are all in, the studios definitely will be too. In fact, the studios may even ask for another, before George even pitches it. Thats all I'm saying.

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Caats, you're right it was a different kind of beast altogether! The viral campaign + Ledger's death created a buzz that was almost impossible to ignore! In my opinion if Indy V is to top KOTCS, a viral campaign or at least better marketing will be a big step in the right direction!

But that spits in the face of what Indy is all about. Indy is one of the last franchises that needs an online viral campaign or something. Indy needs a great script turned into a great adventure movie advertised by several different great trailers and various other advertising techniques. I can't say their advertising was perfect for Crystal Skull, but most people probably knew it was coming out leading up to it...I saw constant commercials, coverage on entertainment media, posters at the movie theater, etc. I don't think they did much wrong, really.

Quote:
Originally Posted by James
I think the low-key marketing owed more to the fact that Indy 4 was such a long awaited project. Audiences didn't really need to be sold on the idea of going to see another Indiana Jones film, and everyone involved knew it.

But while I don't expect Indy to ever be "the" must-see film of the summer again, it's also in a category that most franchises would love to inhabit: The "Of Course I'll See" film.

Much like Star Wars, audiences will probably continue to go see Indy films as long as they are being made. Many fans were absolutely gutted by The Phantom Menace, but it didn't stop them from going to see Attack of the Clones or Revenge of the Sith. None of those were really "the" must-see film either- even TPM was upstaged by The Matrix- but it didn't exactly hurt them at the box office.

Excellent points!
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Old 11-03-2008, 11:13 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by DIrishB
But that spits in the face of what Indy is all about. Indy is one of the last franchises that needs an online viral campaign or something. Indy needs a great script turned into a great adventure movie advertised by several different great trailers and various other advertising techniques. I can't say their advertising was perfect for Crystal Skull, but most people probably knew it was coming out leading up to it...I saw constant commercials, coverage on entertainment media, posters at the movie theater, etc. I don't think they did much wrong, really.
I agree a viral campaign may not suit Indy, but better marketing like I said is paramount to big box office numbers! Once the ball got rolling on the marketing it was pretty decent, but the long wait for just the teaser trailer alone was baffling! If Indy V gets a little darker in tone, ups the action, adds a more hardcore villain or villains, and really looks to deliver on all the elements that made the original series and parts of KOTCS successful, the beards might have an even bigger hit on their hands then KOTCS!

The one way I thought they could possibly utilize a viral campaign for Indy V would be to have in the months prior to its release, little teases of the McGuffin and its power! They could do this through teaser trailers, using audio clips that describe its supernatural qualities, sort of like when Marcus talked about the power of the Ark and Grail to Indy. These clips could play, as flashes of the McGuffin appear on screen with an eerie music accompaniment by Williams(just think of The Call of the Crystal)! Along with these trailers, could be posters appearing in magazines and theaters months before its release to build up some mystery and intrigue. Of course for all this to be successful you'd need one hell of a McGuffin, and an ominous one like the Ark.
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Old 11-04-2008, 05:55 PM   #29
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Before Crystal Skull's release, I saw Indy everywhere. On TV, online, on store shelves (toys, DVDs, etc), on soda, on cereal, on just about everything. It wasn't on the same level as the Star Wars prequels, but there was plenty of Indy in the months leading up to Crystal Skull's release. Again, I don't think they did much wrong.

I do like deckard24's ideas.
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Old 01-18-2012, 06:22 PM   #30
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Here's a site where you can predict North American box office through a film's first 4 weekends. They've got Indy 5, Red Tails, Star Wars 1, Lincoln, Robopocalypse, etc. Naturally the further out the film, the less heavily traded and less accurate.
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Old 01-19-2012, 11:00 AM   #31
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Ooh, I'd say at least 1.75, if the wind is in the right direction.
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Old 01-20-2012, 10:03 AM   #32
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Indy 4 was the highest grossing movie outside US in 2008 even though it did not even open in China (due to Spielberg's olympic boycott) so that would have added another $40-50m or so. KOTCS made $469.5M vs Dark Knight's $468.5M only $1M more but still proves how massive the Indiana Jones franchise is.

Indy 5 will do at least $350-400M US & around $550-650M outside US as its Indy's last movie which always adds a lot to box office plus you have emerging markets like Russia, China, India where box office is growing. Most Indy movies have made at least 60% or more from outside US so expect at least the same or more.

$1B is almost a lock at this stage its all down to how good the movie is if its closer in tone to Indy 3 expect it to soar over $1B
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Old 01-20-2012, 11:04 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by IndyForever
Indy 4 was the highest grossing movie outside US in 2008 even though it did not even open in China (due to Spielberg's olympic boycott) so that would have added another $40-50m or so. KOTCS made $469.5M vs Dark Knight's $468.5M only $1M more but still proves how massive the Indiana Jones franchise is.

Indy 5 will do at least $350-400M US & around $550-650M outside US as its Indy's last movie which always adds a lot to box office plus you have emerging markets like Russia, China, India where box office is growing. Most Indy movies have made at least 60% or more from outside US so expect at least the same or more.

$1B is almost a lock at this stage its all down to how good the movie is if its closer in tone to Indy 3 expect it to soar over $1B

Yeah, well, your username is a little biased mate.

I couldnt give a monkeys how much money it would make. If they do it, they'll do it for the money for sure, but to do it well, thats the only thing that matters to me.
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Old 01-20-2012, 11:06 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by replican't
I couldnt give a monkeys how much money it would make. If they do it, they'll do it for the money for sure, but to do it well, thats the only thing that matters to me.



Lucas isn't capable of doing it well. And Spielberg is too sycophantic to help.
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Old 01-21-2012, 10:00 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by replican't
Yeah, well, your username is a little biased mate.
Now THAT's FUNNY...



...coming from someone with the name replican't!

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Originally Posted by replican't
to do it well, thats the only thing that matters to me.
I'm with you on this...starting with a script.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Montana Smith
...Spielberg is too sycophantic to help.
Seems he put up close to a twenty year fight.

But LucasFilm really should be renamed Sycophant Films.



It'll make money, without a doubt.

It will depend on good word of mouth to make the big bucks though.

I would love to see a script from Christopher Nolan. I'm a betting man and I think he could do Indiana Jones real justice. Bring the project a positive buzz.

Indiana Jones needs to be reclaimed from Tim Burtonville.

Last edited by Rocket Surgeon : 01-21-2012 at 10:06 AM.
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Old 01-21-2012, 10:07 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Rocket Surgeon
I would love to see a script from Christopher Nolan. I'm a betting man and I think he could do Indiana Jones real justice. Bring the project a positive buzz.

He'd be the man to rescue Indy's balls from the fire. Just imagine Nolan taking Indy back to his roots.
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Old 01-22-2012, 01:01 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Montana Smith
He'd be the man to rescue Indy's balls from the fire. Just imagine Nolan taking Indy back to his roots.

Nolan would make Indy into a clinically depressed, tortured soul and the movie would be a pretentious, ultra realistic, urban gritty piece of trash. It'd have grit but no sense of fun. I know it's 2012 and all, but you can still have fun at the cinema without it being KOTCS.

Del Toro would do a good job, I think.
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Old 01-22-2012, 01:06 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by Raiders112390
Nolan would make Indy into a clinically depressed, tortured soul and the movie would be a pretentious, ultra realistic, urban gritty piece of trash. It'd have grit but no sense of fun. I know it's 2012 and all, but you can still have fun at the cinema without it being KOTCS.

Del Toro would do a good job, I think.

I can't speak to Del Toro, but I'm certainly inclined to agree with you regarding Nolan. I generally appreciate his Batman movies, but has there ever been a heist movie less fun than Inception?
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Old 01-22-2012, 01:16 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by Raiders112390
Nolan would make Indy into a clinically depressed, tortured soul and the movie would be a pretentious, ultra realistic, urban gritty piece of trash. It'd have grit but no sense of fun. I know it's 2012 and all, but you can still have fun at the cinema without it being KOTCS.

Maybe, but Nolan would be the antidote to present-day Lucas.

Dark and gritty is fun, compared to the lame humour of KOTCS. BB and TDK were deliberately melodramatic, because that's the style of the comics that the characters were drawn from. But think of the stunts and the sequences from those movies, and how Indy could have been placed within that world.

The script and sentiments displayed in ROTLA were more of the Nolan kind. All that discussion of shadowy reflections could well be a discussion of white knights, dark knights and vigilante tomb robbers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiders112390
Del Toro would do a good job, I think.

He'd be good, too. He knew what to do with Hellboy.

Though he can also be very grim as well - as in Pan's Labyrinth.
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Old 01-22-2012, 06:34 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by Montana Smith
Maybe, but Nolan would be the antidote to present-day Lucas.

Dark and gritty is fun, compared to the lame humour of KOTCS. BB and TDK were deliberately melodramatic, because that's the style of the comics that the characters were drawn from. But think of the stunts and the sequences from those movies, and how Indy could have been placed within that world.

The script and sentiments displayed in ROTLA were more of the Nolan kind. All that discussion of shadowy reflections could well be a discussion of white knights, dark knights and vigilante tomb robbers.



He'd be good, too. He knew what to do with Hellboy.

Though he can also be very grim as well - as in Pan's Labyrinth.

No, it's just going to the extreme opposite direction. Just because Lucas went superlight and over the top in KOTCS, doesn't mean a next Indy has to be ultra-dark, totally realistic and pretentious. As to the melodrama of BB and TDK, that's I'd say more Nolan's style. Melodrama of that sort doesn't fit in Indy's world just as much as nuclear fridges don't.

I don't see dark and gritty as fun. Gritty can be fun. Dark can be fun. But both combined just leads to a grim picture. Not something fun. ROTLA has serious moments, yes, but let's not act like it was anything like TDK in tone. It was a fun adventure with some depth. TDK feels like overwrought fan fiction; ponderous, pretentious garbage.

The team which made Mask of Zorro (the screenwriters were also responsible for Pirates of the Carribean) might do a good job with Indy, particularly if we're dealing with Harrison Ford still as an older Indy. Note that in that film, Hopkins' Zorro is a teacher, yes, but he is also very much in the action himself.
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Old 01-22-2012, 06:52 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by Raiders112390
No, it's just going to the extreme opposite direction. Just because Lucas went superlight and over the top in KOTCS, doesn't mean a next Indy has to be ultra-dark, totally realistic and pretentious. As to the melodrama of BB and TDK, that's I'd say more Nolan's style. Melodrama of that sort doesn't fit in Indy's world just as much as nuclear fridges don't.

Since Harrison's Indy is effectively, over we're either looking to something completely different for #5, or a reboot without him. It would be better to start again, and put him back into the '30s where he belongs.

The old formula won't work any more with the current actors.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiders112390
The team which made Mask of Zorro (the screenwriters were also responsible for Pirates of the Carribean) might do a good job with Indy, particularly if we're dealing with Harrison Ford still as an older Indy. Note that in that film, Hopkins' Zorro is a teacher, yes, but he is also very much in the action himself.

I found the The Mask of Zorro to be abysmal tripe of the KOTCS variety. Indy 5 would end up being yet more self-referential parody that doesn't even attempt to ask to be taken seriously.
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Old 01-22-2012, 09:27 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by Montana Smith
Since Harrison's Indy is effectively, over we're either looking to something completely different for #5, or a reboot without him. It would be better to start again, and put him back into the '30s where he belongs.

The old formula won't work any more with the current actors.



I found the The Mask of Zorro to be abysmal tripe of the KOTCS variety. Indy 5 would end up being yet more self-referential parody that doesn't even attempt to ask to be taken seriously.

Could you tell me why you thought The Mask of Zorro was abysmal tripe? I thought it handled the idea of an aged hero very well. It presented the hero at his peak in the beginning, his fall, and his grooming of an heir. All the while, Hopkins never faded into the background; He still fought and was a presence in the film (unlike in KOTCS where Indy becomes a mere observer in the Jungle Chase). We're always showed in Mask that the original hero may be aged, but he still has it, and Hopkins' Zorro doesn't have to climb out of a nuked fridge to prove that. I mean he easily bests Banderas' in swordplay twice, for example. He's shown to be older, but not utterly aged, but it's handled with respect. In KOTCS the theme of "INDY'S STILL GOT IT" is sort of punched in our face repeatedly from the the Hanger scene to Doom town to the Waterfalls, etc. In Mask, Hopkins' Zorro basically teaches Bandera's character everything he knows: How to fight, how to be a gentleman, essentially how to become a hero; Banderas' character would not have succeeded without him. The original hero is not taught anything by his successor, whereas we see Indy's Grave Robber side be sort of emasculated by Mutt when Mutt guilts Indy into putting the dagger back.

You have to also remember too that Zorro was always a lighter character than Indy, and Mask did add a level of depth to the character that wasn't there before.
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Old 01-22-2012, 09:50 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by Raiders112390
Could you tell me why you thought The Mask of Zorro was abysmal tripe? I thought it handled the idea of an aged hero very well. It presented the hero at his peak in the beginning, his fall, and his grooming of an heir. All the while, Hopkins never faded into the background; He still fought and was a presence in the film (unlike in KOTCS where Indy becomes a mere observer in the Jungle Chase). We're always showed in Mask that the original hero may be aged, but he still has it, and Hopkins' Zorro doesn't have to climb out of a nuked fridge to prove that. I mean he easily bests Banderas' in swordplay twice, for example. He's shown to be older, but not utterly aged, but it's handled with respect. In KOTCS the theme of "INDY'S STILL GOT IT" is sort of punched in our face repeatedly from the the Hanger scene to Doom town to the Waterfalls, etc. In Mask, Hopkins' Zorro basically teaches Bandera's character everything he knows: How to fight, how to be a gentleman, essentially how to become a hero; Banderas' character would not have succeeded without him. The original hero is not taught anything by his successor, whereas we see Indy's Grave Robber side be sort of emasculated by Mutt when Mutt guilts Indy into putting the dagger back.

You have to also remember too that Zorro was always a lighter character than Indy, and Mask did add a level of depth to the character that wasn't there before.

I found it mind-numbingly dull. Apart from that scene with Catherine Zeta-Jones.

It lacked the spark of other Banderas movies, such as El Mariachi, Desperado and Once Upon a Time in Mexico.

I place Mask of Zorro in the same category as Rocketeer. They feel like movies that don't matter. I know there was more fun to be had watching Zorro Rides Again and Zorro's Fighting Legion. I want to track down the two Douglas Fairbank Zorro films from 1920 and 1925. There's something more appealing with going back to a more original vision.

Indy was fine as a trilogy, but KOTCS robbed the bank of novelty. It was a laborious parody of an homage. So, if there's a will to take Harrison's Indy forward into another movie, there has to be a major shift of direction. And, as I've argued, since that won't be what's expected by those familiar with the character, it would be like making a cult movie.
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Old 01-22-2012, 11:07 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by Montana Smith
I found it mind-numbingly dull. Apart from that scene with Catherine Zeta-Jones.

It lacked the spark of other Banderas movies, such as El Mariachi, Desperado and Once Upon a Time in Mexico.
Banderas must be the Chuck Norris of the 90s if he was able to bring a spark into a movie he was nowhere to be seen.

Though I can understand this particular mental relapse, your vision was obviously all steamed up from that scene with Salma Hayek.
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Old 01-22-2012, 11:20 AM   #45
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Banderas must be the Chuck Norris of the 90s if he was able to bring a spark into a movie he was nowhere to be seen.

Though I can understand this particular mental relapse, your vision was obviously all steamed up from that scene with Salma Hayek.



One too many Mariachi players!

I think it was Robert Rodriguez who brought the spark. While Salma just created the sparks.
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Old 01-22-2012, 04:19 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by Attila the Professor
I can't speak to Del Toro, but I'm certainly inclined to agree with you regarding Nolan. I generally appreciate his Batman movies, but has there ever been a heist movie less fun than Inception?

It wasn't really meant to be a fun film in any sense. It was supposed to be a character drama with some thriller elements and a subtle sci-fi bent. As it was, it worked incredibly.

Yes, I'm one of THOSE people...

But I think Nolan would have done KOTCS like Unforgiven, and that could have been unforgettabl great. As for del Toro, I stand by my opinion that The Golden Army had a similar concept and basic plot structure to an Indy film (a villain wants to find a long-lost artifact/treasure/weapon/whatever, and a plucky band of heroes have to reach it before him). So he's got my vote too.

And I'm quite sad that Smiffy hated Mask of Zorro. I thought that was a delightful adventure.
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Old 01-22-2012, 10:23 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by kongisking
It wasn't really meant to be a fun film in any sense. It was supposed to be a character drama with some thriller elements and a subtle sci-fi bent. As it was, it worked incredibly.

Yes, I'm one of THOSE people...

Me, too. I don't care what anybody says against BB & TDK, because, for me, they work they way I'd want them to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kongisking
And I'm quite sad that Smiffy hated Mask of Zorro. I thought that was a delightful adventure.

Movies are like Indy's career. Win some. Lose some.

But I'm still a fan of Jackson's King Kong. Another film that worked the way I wanted it to.

Originally I didn't want anything from KOTCS, because I wasn't interested in the idea of it. Having seen it, it wasn't what I would have wanted if I'd put any thought into it beforehand!

And back on the track of a potential box office haul for #5, it would be a film that will fill many with trepidation, based on their experiences of KOTCS.

For those that loved KOTCS they might fear the next will be too different.

For those that hated KOTCS they might fear it will be too similar.

For everyone else, it will be Indy, Lucas and curiosity that will encourage them to pay up. Curiosity alone will earn it more than replican't's £1.75 prediction.

I'll wait for a secondhand DVD and expect to pay less than £1.75.
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Old 03-28-2014, 01:37 PM   #48
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Looking again at HSX, of future films with fixed release dates, here's what the big ones are expected to collect domestically in their first 4 weeks of wide release. Mostly Pixar and sequels. Personally I don't see what's so intimidating about the fearsome summer of '15 or any other stretch.

2015
Fifty Shades of Grey $100.26
Insurgent $113.35
Penguins of Madagascar $87.32
Fast & Furious 7 $246.67
----
Avengers: Age of Ultron $388.08
Tomorrowland $114.07
San Andreas $84.91
Jurassic World $158.01
Fantastic Four $128.22
Inside Out $138.81
Ted 2 $118.02
Terminator: Genesis $97.94
Minions $168.22
Peter Pan $115.67
Ant-Man $126.21
----
James Bond 24 $190.21
Hunger Games: Mockingjay 2 $321.04
The Good Dinosaur $116.27
Star Wars: Episode VII $299.75
Kung Fu Panda 3 $125.22
Mission: Impossible 5 $120.45

2016
Batman vs. Superman $257.03
Alice in Wonderland 2 $132.52
X-Men: Apocalypse $169.10
Amazing Spider-Man 3 $187.29
How to Train Your Dragon 3 $127.20
Finding Dory $190.87
Independence Day 2 $118.16
Ice Age 5 $100.49
Avatar 2 $297.10

2017
Wolverine 3 $88.43
Avatar 3 $240.60
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