Hardly. His crime was that he took sole credit for Star Wars, Empire, etc., ignored the contributions of his staffers, actively screwed his franchising partners, alienated most of the people who have ever worked with him, and directly and repeatedly insulted his fans (starting way back with criticisms of Jedi) and was basically an all-around hypocritical douche for the past 20 years.
Now, with all of that aside, if he had continued to make great movies, that would be one thing. But he put out an embarassing 'prequel' trilogy and a very weak sequel for Indiana Jones. In the meantime he has repeatedly added stupid edits to his true hits in order to fufill his 'vision', or to require double-or-triple-dipping on purchases of his movies, etc.
The man thinks of himself as a king, and treats everyone else accordingly. I'm very glad he retired, since maybe someone who's still talented and hungry for success can put out some decent product.
Exactly.
He fooled us all into believing that his worlds were dependable. As children we embraced them. And as adults he took them away.
We didn't realize that he was only making home movies for his own fickle amusement.
Quote:
Uncle George: "I didn't mean to hurt you."
The audience: "I was a child!"
Uncle George: "Look, I did what I did. I'm not happy about it, I can't explain it. And I don't expect you to be happy about it, either."
The Audience: "It was wrong, Uncle George. And you knew it was wrong."
1. We Get To See More Indiana Jones, For Crying Out Loud!Crystal Skull was a fun film- get over yourselves, it was just a big, fun film- sure, it was nowhere near as great as the original trilogy, but films like that, Cowboys and Aliens, The A-Team… they serve to entertain, they are not high art. I would be up for watching Indiana Jones 5 for a ‘rollercoaster ride’ (don’t you hate when film critics say that in reviews) to while away a few hours. I liked Indy escaping a nuclear blast in a fridge because it was ridiculous and implausible- it’s a movie! And even if it doesn’t feel as good to you as the first film, it will be better than any other summer entertainment released in the year it comes out. Nobody does it better than old Jonesy.
I remember just how excited I was for Crystal Skull, waiting months and months, and grinning ear to ear once I sat down in my local for the first time I watched it. The second we hear John Williams’ score, and saw the figure being thrown out of the car, and the silhouette dusting off his fedora… It was good old-fashioned movie magic. I want that again. I wasn’t bored or disappointed at any point, and on repeat viewings I still haven’t been. If a fifth film can capture that magic again, then I will be the last to criticise it. For me, it was worth the wait, and I’ll happily wait for another film if it is as entertaining as Crystal Skull
2. Shia LaBeouf is Improving As An Actor
Oh boy, this is going to be the hardest sell of all. Mr. LaBeouf divides everyone, Indy fan or no. Personally, I was a big fan of him in Even Stevens and Holes, a charming and funny presence, reminding one of a young Woody Allen (By that I mean the edgy, neurotic characters he plays in his films, not as a writer/director, calm down…). It seemed like he was Spielberg’s new golden boy for a while, hence his presence in Crystal Skull and Transformers (whilst that franchise represents everything I stand against as a filmmaker, I must confess to actually quite enjoying the first one, and LaBeouf was one of the reasons I enjoyed it. In the sequels, not so much…)
Even in Eagle Eye and Disturbia he was rather good. His immediate future looks very promising as well- for a start, he’s now part of the Redford gang and has discredited 3D, he was excellent in Lawless (again, a matter of opinion, I know…), and his extreme auditioning for Von Trier’s Nymphomaniac makes me think he’s not a lost cause.
And the point of all this? It means he could bring something interesting to a potential sequel. I guarantee you there will be no ‘passing of the torch’- the franchise will end as it started, with Harrison Ford at the fore. LaBeouf will understand, and will likely be contracted to do the sequel, so not matter how much he is changing as an actor, he will be roped in.
But that doesn’t mean he has to phone it in- I imagine the film would go the way of Last Crusade, perhaps keeping the roles as they were, LaBoeuf playing the Connery role, playing equal banana to Ford and allowing for an interesting examination of the father/son relationship. Henry Jones, Sr. was distant, but ‘Junior’ was absent from Mutt’s life. Chuck in some comedy Russians and a legendary macguffin, and you have something that could actually trump Crystal Skull, and maybe even Temple of Doom (again, never understood why this isn’t that popular…).
3. Potential For Something New, Different and Interesting
If indeed it gets off the ground, Film Five cannot be a rehash, or it might as well have ended. There’s no reason for there to even be a fifth film, so get a damn good writer on board and give the film a reason to exist. Make the public understand there is a point to this film, and that it is not just some cynical cashgrab. Although it certainly is, for me a great example of a similar film that became more than that is Tron Legacy. Again, like Crystal Skull, I’m sure most of you hate it, and there was no reason for it to exist. But it gave us one of the best movie scores in years, some stunning visuals and an exciting and fun movie (and it had Michael Sheen, which improves any film, even Twilight by a little bit).
You can explore different sides to an older Indy- for me, the appeal of Crystal Skull was that we saw a gruff, world-weary side to character who like everyone has lost most of those he loved (Marcus, his dad), and is saddened by how the world is changing (McCarthyism, Nuclear War).
It was more interesting than a fourth film that came out a few years after Last Crusade, where young Indy got up to the same stuff he did in the previous films in the same condition- for me, that would have been cynical. I’m the first one to say “But they’re old and fat, it’s not the same, why bother revisiting a classic?” when it comes to films and ‘reunion special’ TV episodes like this, but by changing the time period, we saw a new world, and rather than a loving pastiche of 30’s adventure serials, we got a loving pastiche of 50’s sci-fi movies that inspired a young Spielberg.
And in this changing world Indy now lives in, we could explore more exotic locations, like Australiafor example. I’d definitely be up for Indy travelling to Australia, with West Australian cowboys, heavy drinking, aborigine legends, a white people still sore of their convict ancestors, perhaps even an Australian equivalent to Indy, a villainous equal in the vein of Belloq…this rather than another bloody jungle or ancient temple, we could see something new, and different, and worth making. And I feel we would get just that with another Indy film if it does indeed come to fruition
4. It Gives Dr. Jones To A New Generation
You can moan and grumble as much as you like, but the fact the fourth film came about at all shows Indiana Jones is not some relic, and seeing an older Indy was not an embarrassment. The fact is, most blockbusters are utter tripe these days- extended toy adverts like Transformers and Battleship are not inspiring to the next generation of filmmaker or audience, and children can’t look up to figures like… whoever the hell Taylor Kitsch played, or Sam Witwicky. They’ve got Batman and James Bond, and that’s kind of it. Give them Dr. Jones.
Sure, they’ll think of that cool old guy with the bullwhip, rather than ‘the cool guy with the bullwhip’, but that’s the changing nature of the franchise. You can show them the original trilogy on DVD as much as you like, but the fact is they will feel like they are watching your favourite film with your childhood hero. Like every generation has their own Bond or, as it seems to be the case now, Batman, so it seems a new generation has Indiana Jones to call their own, proudly.
Unlike the friggin’ Star Wars prequels, which ashamed both cast, crew, and audiences young and old (I really don’t like Star Wars, but fans don’t exaggerate when they go on about what abominations Episode I-III are…)
5. Nobody Does It Better Than Spielberg
In addition to one of the great cinematic heroes inspiring another generation, Spielberg is one of the masters, with even his flops being incredibly interesting and worth repeat viewings. One of the my favourite films from last year was The Adventures of Tintin, because it was Spielberg at his best- whilst he is an incredibly mature director with significant and important fare like Schindler’s List, Amistad, Munich, Empire of The Sun and The Colour Purple, for me his greatest works will be his big, bombastic blockbusters like Raiders of The Lost Ark and Jurassic Park because of how well they are done.
And as a kid you aren’t inspired by serious, deep films, but by sheer exciting spectacle you act out on the playground. Anyone else could do Indiana Jones 5 and it would be appalling. He might seem reluctant to do it, but he felt like this working on films two and three, and yet he gave them his all, resulting in two films to stand shoulder-to-shoulder with the original.
Even Spielberg on auto-pilot is greater than, say, Brett Ratner obsessively slaving over his Magnum Opus, whatever the hell that would turn out to be. So, any excuse for another Spielberg movie is a great one!
Re: the above post, I don't know if I'd like to see Shia/Mutt back for a 5th film. At least not in a lead role. I think Shia did the best he could with his material, but I think he wasn't a really good fit for playing Indiana Jones' son.
I wish Indy could have another heir, or heiress. I wish he had a daughter with Willie Scott, a really spit-fire female with traits of Indy and Willie, maybe a beautiful blonde.
Or a son with Willie would be cool. In any case, I want a stronger character than Mutt for Indy's offspring.
Not sure if anyone has read or mentioned this yet...
Karen Allen on her thoughts of Indy 5:
Allen: [Marion and Indy] have got a lot of catching up to do. They have to get to know each other all over again. George and Steven tried to bring into the film, that even though they haven’t seen each other for twenty years, it’s like a blip on the radar screen and it just goes back to right where they left off. I was left with a feeling that they were going to try to go off and have a real life together. They make the decision to get married and they have this young son -- I see them going into domestic bliss like that. I see them creating a life together, going off and having adventures together.
When I try to picture what the next film will be about, I think they’ll bring it into the sixties, when they left us in the fifties. We’re left with that sense that Indy has sown all of his wild oats out and he is ready to settle down at seventy. I think everybody loves the idea of there being one last adventure. So we’ll see, we’re waiting for George. George has to come up with the idea, and it’s all in his big, capable hands.
Location: Skull Island (the spiders get in everything!).
Posts: 2,110
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rivers
Not sure if anyone has read or mentioned this yet...
Karen Allen on her thoughts of Indy 5:
Allen: [Marion and Indy] have got a lot of catching up to do. They have to get to know each other all over again. George and Steven tried to bring into the film, that even though they haven’t seen each other for twenty years, it’s like a blip on the radar screen and it just goes back to right where they left off. I was left with a feeling that they were going to try to go off and have a real life together. They make the decision to get married and they have this young son -- I see them going into domestic bliss like that. I see them creating a life together, going off and having adventures together.
When I try to picture what the next film will be about, I think they’ll bring it into the sixties, when they left us in the fifties. We’re left with that sense that Indy has sown all of his wild oats out and he is ready to settle down at seventy. I think everybody loves the idea of there being one last adventure. So we’ll see, we’re waiting for George. George has to come up with the idea, and it’s all in his big, capable hands.
...
When I try to picture what the next film will be about, I think they’ll bring it into the sixties, when they left us in the fifties. We’re left with that sense that Indy has sown all of his wild oats out and he is ready to settle down at seventy. I think everybody loves the idea of there being one last adventure. So we’ll see, we’re waiting for George. George has to come up with the idea, and it’s all in his big, capable hands.
You've juxtaposed a Disney-fied version of Coolidge's dog poker paintings against Dr. Gonzo's sombre photograph of a soldiers' cemetary.
Pardon my stupidity, Pale Horse, but I don't see the connection. Please, enligthen me...
What does this have to do with Indy 5 "rumours & possibilites"?
No, you're not stupid. The connection is rather loose. It's just that Lucasfilm and Pixar are related cousins and so are Disney and Pixar, so therefore Disney is Indy...and Pixar is Indy, and Indy V is actually a Pixar Adventure film (with a very old man ... or TWO!?! ... an unlikely 'son', a jungle, a treasure, and and and....)
No, you're not stupid. The connection is rather loose. It's just that Lucasfilm and Pixar are related cousins and so are Disney and Pixar, so therefore Disney is Indy...and Pixar is Indy, and Indy V is actually a Pixar Adventure film (with a very old man ... or TWO!?! ... an unlikely 'son', a jungle, a treasure, and and and....)
...Short Round who, remarkably, hasn't aged a day, but has put on some weight due to all that western junk food.
Location: Skull Island (the spiders get in everything!).
Posts: 2,110
In all seriousness, Up really is what Indy 5 should be inspired by, as far as story and themes go.
And Smiffy, that was ingenious. Good work, sir. I know I give you a lot of crap, but when you give us a truly classic zinger, I'll give you credit for it.
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,947
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Gonzo
Was trying to say with that picture, rumor has it, Indiana Jones 5 is dead.
Dr. Gonzo, your picture was properly understood, by me. Pale Horse's post was the perplexing puzzler.
Nice graphic juxtaposition on the quote, though! High 5, Gonzo!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pale Horse
No, you're not stupid. The connection is rather loose. It's just that Lucasfilm and Pixar are related cousins and so are Disney and Pixar, so therefore Disney is Indy...and Pixar is Indy, and Indy V is actually a Pixar Adventure film (with a very old man ... or TWO!?! ... an unlikely 'son', a jungle, a treasure, and and and....)
Yeesh. While I admire all parties involved, I pray & pray that it doesn't go down that collaborative path.
God, it's driving me nuts. It's christmas 2012 and still no news on a new Indiana Jones movie. I can't believe George is doing it all over again. Wasting too much time while Harrison is getting older and older. What's hindering him all the time? Jeez!
God, it's driving me nuts. It's christmas 2012 and still no news on a new Indiana Jones movie. I can't believe George is doing it all over again. Wasting too much time while Harrison is getting older and older. What's hindering him all the time? Jeez!
He's given up the burden. Harrison is Mickey's problem now.
Well, not entirely. Afaik Paramount still has some say in the matter. Also, I guess Lucas has some kind of priority in puzzling out the story.
Do they have production rights or just distribution? I was never entirely clear on that since there aren't any 'production names' from Paramount's side on the films... Just having distribution rights would make the negotiations for any future properties a lot easier.
Please, enligthen me...
Pale Horse's post was the perplexing puzzler.
While I admire all parties involved, I pray & pray that it doesn't go down that collaborative path.
