You guys are starting to look an awful lot like the rest of the internet with your alternately bizarre and childish treatment of homosexuality here. Move on from it.
Good work Agent Horse. You're the white knight this city needs in its defence against the encroaching evil of the internet.
If it weren't for your tireless duty this whole borough would also be awash with pictures of funny cats.
Never fear, whereever there is trouble I'll be there.
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I'll be all around in the dark - I'll be everywhere. Wherever you can look - wherever there's a fight, so hungry people can eat, I'll be there. Wherever there's a cop beatin' up a guy, I'll be there. I'll be in the way guys yell when they're mad. I'll be in the way kids laugh when they're hungry and they know supper's ready, and when the people are eatin' the stuff they raise and livin' in the houses they build - I'll be there, too. - The Grapes of Wrath
And staying in that period, but not really on topic, in 1943 Batman took on the agents of Hirohito to prevent Japan from acquiring a superweapon.
In 1936 Indiana Jones took on the agents of Hitler to prevent Germany from acquiring a superweapon.
This was a period when their paths were more in alignment.
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.Jonesy
I grew up loving Indiana Jones and Batman. But I do not understand your hate for 'The Dark Knight'! I can get that you'd get annoyed at the 'overwhelming' love for it, because the love for such films like TDK or The Avengers is overwhelming to the point of ridiculousness at times. But to be ridiculing it is going a bit extreme. Dislike it all you want but don't get on the Raveners here for loving it.
You'll have to excuse me because I'm venting out of frustration. I don't understand why modern, superhero movies get so much attention from Ravenheads rather than adventure films from the '30-'50s (Indy's era). For example: More than a week ago, in the "Cliffhangers" thread, Montana Smiffy posted his reviews of the 2 Batman serials. Guess how many of the self-professed Batman fans commented? NONE!
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Originally Posted by Montana Smith
They all emerged from the printed word and developed into film.
That's an over-simplification. Novels from the 1880s and comic books from the late 1930s aren't the same thing.
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Originally Posted by Montana Smith
Not all 'super-heroes' are super-powered. The only difference between Indy and Zorro, The Spider or The Batman is that he doesn't wear a mask. But he does wear an identifiable uniform which the audience recognizes as 'adventure gear'.
When he's not on adventure he's leading an almost respectable existence as a bespectacled, awkward college professor.
There are several more differences than just a mask. I already addressed this in posts #70 and #90 but will do it again...just for you, Smiffy!
When Indiana Jones wears his 'adventure gear':
- People still call him, Dr. Jones. They don't call him, Whipman.
- He doesn't hide his face like many superheroes do.
- He doesn't have a secret lair.
- He doesn't have a logo on his chest.
- He wears normal clothes. He doesn't dress up in colourful, full-bodied underwear & prance around in Peter Pan boots.
- He doesn't speak with a different voice like the Dork Knight does (nor talk to people who know his 'secret' with the dumb, alternate voice like the Dork Knight does).
Zorro is a superhero? Anyway, Smiff, since you mentioned him (like Raiders112390 did):
- Unlike Dr. Jones, Zorro hides his identity with a mask.
- Unlike Dr. Jones, Zorro uses a completely different name.
- Unlike Dr. Jones, Zorro changes his voice (and his accent) in the '30s serials.
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Originally Posted by Montana Smith
I'm a big fan of the Bat and his many incarnations, but he's a different creature to Indiana Jones.
I don't understand why modern, superhero movies get so much attention from Ravenheads rather than adventure films from the '30-'50s (Indy's era).
Can't speak for everyone, but I bet at least for the younger Ravenheads it's because they have no particular attachment to actual '30s-'50s adventure films, just Indy. A lot of people are on here because they were introduced to Indy as kids and have been fans ever since, not because they are fans of the films Spielberg & Lucas drew inspiration from. I, for example, have never seen any Republic adventure serials, Gunga Din, etc.
Superheroes are just another thing that people may have developed a strong attachment to as young kids. They've been able to stick with it thanks largely to comic books "growing up" alongside their fanbase around the 80s or so.
I like Indy because he's a larger-than-life hero who you can root for as he beats up bad guys. I like Batman because he's a larger-than-life hero who you can root for as he beats up bad guys. Batman may be significantly less realistic than Indy (or more "dorky"), so if it's not your cup of tea, it's not your cup of tea. Requires a bigger imagination, perhaps.
But people loooove superheroes - box office numbers for Avengers and stuff are proof. So why are you surprised that Raveners love them too? It's kind of a universal thing.
There are several more differences than just a mask. I already addressed this in posts #70 and #90 but will do it again...just for you, Smiffy!
When Indiana Jones wears his 'adventure gear':
- People still call him, Dr. Jones. They don't call him, Whipman.
- He doesn't hide his face like many superheroes do.
- He doesn't have a secret lair.
- He doesn't have a logo on his chest.
- He wears normal clothes. He doesn't dress up in colourful, full-bodied underwear & prance around in Peter Pan boots.
- He doesn't speak with a different voice like the Dork Knight does (nor talk to people who know his 'secret' with the dumb, alternate voice like the Dork Knight does).
Zorro is a superhero? Anyway, Smiff, since you mentioned him (like Raiders112390 did):
- Unlike Dr. Jones, Zorro hides his identity with a mask.
- Unlike Dr. Jones, Zorro uses a completely different name.
- Unlike Dr. Jones, Zorro changes his voice (and his accent) in the '30s serials.
Indeed!
Neither Batman nor Zorro were super-powered, so technically neither of them were superheroes. They're much closer to Indiana Jones than good fairies like Superman.
Zorro, Batman and Indy all dressed up to take on the bad guys. Indy's uniform was based on the same pattern for at least 22 years. He just happened to be a little less conspicuous than Spy Smasher, and he didn't care if people knew who he was.
Indy is at once both costumed crime fighter and costumed thief.
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
Can't speak for everyone, but I bet at least for the younger Ravenheads it's because they have no particular attachment to actual '30s-'50s adventure films, just Indy. A lot of people are on here because they were introduced to Indy as kids and have been fans ever since, not because they are fans of the films Spielberg & Lucas drew inspiration from. I, for example, have never seen any Republic adventure serials, Gunga Din, etc.
Superheroes are just another thing that people may have developed a strong attachment to as young kids. They've been able to stick with it thanks largely to comic books "growing up" alongside their fanbase around the 80s or so.
Mattzilla, you don’t post often but when you do, it is usually a voice of commendable reason. However…
I, too, “grew up” with superheroes (watching the TV shows & cartoons, buying the comic books) but my interest in the genre diminished when “Raiders” came along in 1981. It was Indiana Jones who inspired me to watch & appreciate ‘30s-‘50s adventure films. By the time I reached my mid-to-late teens, superheroes were out of the picture. (After high school, I went to art college and the few guys who were still into superheroes at that age were the BIGGEST NERDS on campus!)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
I like Indy because he's a larger-than-life hero who you can root for as he beats up bad guys. I like Batman because he's a larger-than-life hero who you can root for as he beats up bad guys. Batman may be significantly less realistic than Indy (or more "dorky"), so if it's not your cup of tea, it's not your cup of tea.
Indy isn't really a "larger-than-life hero". HE GETS BEATEN UP like a regular man and wins (largely) by sheer luck!
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Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
Requires a bigger imagination, perhaps.
My imagination is endless...
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
But people loooove superheroes - box office numbers for Avengers and stuff are proof. So why are you surprised that Raveners love them too? It's kind of a universal thing.
One would THINK that Indy fans should have more interest in the ‘adventure genre’ than the ‘superhero genre’.
Note: Before “Crystal Skull” and “Dork Night” were released in 2008, there wasn’t much superhero talk here at The Raven.
P.S. It’s sad that you haven’t seen “Gunga Din”. One of the best adventure films ever made!
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montana Smith
Neither Batman nor Zorro were super-powered, so technically neither of them were superheroes. They're much closer to Indiana Jones than good fairies like Superman.
Zorro, Batman and Indy all dressed up to take on the bad guys. Indy's uniform was based on the same pattern for at least 22 years. He just happened to be a little less conspicuous than Spy Smasher,...
Smiff, bearing in mind that we're buddies: This is the biggest bunch of bollocks you have ever bothered to bestow upon The Raven!
1) Who ever said that Zorro is a superhero? Why is he even being mentioned?
2) Indy is NOT a vigilante! He doesn’t actively seek out bad behaviour in a personal fight for justice. Trouble finds Indy, not vice-versa.
3) Batman may not have super-powers but he does have an array of super-science-fiction gadgets & vehicles. Indy doesn’t use any ‘high-tech’ equipment.
4) You’re blowing this “dress up to take on the bad guys” thing way out of proportion. Indy doesn’t intentionally “dress up” for the specific purpose of fighting bad guys. (Heck, he gets into scrapes no matter what he wears…Shanghai, Venice, etc.) Indy’s outfit is an ensemble of normal articles of clothing. He doesn’t skip/prance around in a cape, full-bodied leotards, faerie boots and a hood with pointed ears.
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Originally Posted by Montana Smith
...he didn't care if people knew who he was.
The fact that Indy doesn’t disguise himself is THE big difference.
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Originally Posted by Montana Smith
Indy is at once both costumed crime fighter and costumed thief.
1) Who ever said that Zorro is a superhero? Why is he even being mentioned?
Zorro was a proto-Batman. Had his own Zorrocave and all.
Indy's 'Adventure Gear' is a recognizable costume. There are enough cosplayers here to attest to that.
Nobody else in his world dresses like Indy, apart from Fedora, his inspiration.
He's a costumed mercenary, thief, vandal and occasional do-gooder.
His bullwhip was unique enough for Willie to refer to him as "a lion tamer". (The whip also being a nod to Zorro).
In Raiders he's a character with a split personality. Stuttering bespectacled professor and daredevil tomb raider.
Indy is now far more of a super-powered character than Batman. Whoever heard of a mere mortal not only surviving an atomic blast in a refrigerator, but also surviving such a hard landing?
It's a costume. Get over it.
Furthermore, Indy now currently resides in a tongue-in-cheek world which has far more similarity to Adam West's Batman. Only it doesn't suit Indy.
Oh, and Mutt is his Robin. Holy phony Jonesy, Batman.
Mattzilla, you don’t post often but when you do, it is usually a voice of commendable reason.
Thanks Stoo. I appreciate your ability to generate discussions that I find genuinely interesting. My post count would be even less if not for your magic bag of intriguing discussion topics...
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Originally Posted by Stoo
I, too, “grew up” with superheroes (watching the TV shows & cartoons, buying the comic books) but my interest in the genre diminished when “Raiders” came along in 1981. It was Indiana Jones who inspired me to watch & appreciate ‘30s-‘50s adventure films. By the time I reached my mid-to-late teens, superheroes were out of the picture. (After high school, I went to art college and the few guys who were still into superheroes at that age were the BIGGEST NERDS on campus!)
I'd say you just barely missed out on where in really started getting interesting then. I think a benchmark for making the genre more serious came in the form of Frank Miller's 1986 "The Dark Knight Returns" (not to be confused with Chris Nolan's upcoming The Dark Knight Rises, of course). Someone may need to fact-check me, but I believe this was one of the first superhero stories not aimed at children. In fact, it's outright inappropriate for kids.
Anyway, I was born in '92, so I was growing up when superheroes were really starting to become popular among the general public and not a thing restricted to nerds. I mean, obviously I'm a nerd because I get way more into it than most people. But nowadays that's basically considered "cool", what with events like Comic-Con at absolute heights of popularity even among folks who aren't hardcore comic book fans. And as I pointed out before, as a film genre superheroes have been extremely popular among the general public, especially for the past 10 years.
Basically they've gone a lot more mainstream and certainly a lot more "adult" (for better or for worse) since you gave them up. Batman logo t-shirts are rather fashionable on college campuses these days.
And besides, you can't really call out superhero fans for being nerds when you're posting on an Indiana Jones fan board.
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Originally Posted by Stoo
Indy isn't really a "larger-than-life hero". HE GETS BEATEN UP like a regular man and wins (largely) by sheer luck!
And don't be silly Stoo, Indiana Jones is just as L.T.L.™ as Batman. Let me put it this way: if someone in real life tried to do the things that either of these characters do, they'd be dead before the day was out. Every scrap Indy gets into would kill a real person, yet he gets into several of these situations and escapes them through pure luck. At least Batman has a bunch of impossibly high-tech gadgets, which in my opinion are just as unrealistic as a ridiculous streak of luck.
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Originally Posted by Stoo
My imagination is endless...
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Originally Posted by Stoo
One would THINK that Indy fans should have more interest in the ‘adventure genre’ than the ‘superhero genre’.
Hrm... I still don't think you've entirely convinced me of this. The similarities are there. But then again they probably weren't circa 1981, so I can understand your frustration.
But I don't think things like "The Further Adventures" would've happened if there wasn't a common audience somewhere between the two. Remove all the trappings and you still have two heroes who we root for as they beat up the bad guys. I don't think you need anything more to justify an interest in both.
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Originally Posted by Stoo
Note: Before “Crystal Skull” and “Dork Night” were released in 2008, there wasn’t much superhero talk here at The Raven.
It's "Dark Knight" actually.
Well, maybe 'cause too many darn kids like me are joining up. I dunno. The Dark Knight was a phenomenon that obliterated all superhero movie records that came before it and gave the genre new levels of popularity among the general populace. And it was already popular thanks to things like Raimi's Spider-Man movies.
2008 was the first time in 19 years that an Indiana Jones movie and a Batman movie were released in the same summer. Kind of a big deal and I'm not surprised it prompted discussion, especially since Dark Knight was so well-received and Indy fell flat for a lot of people.
For the record, I never once thought to compare the two. And no, I don't think at all that the "Batman fans" were responsible for a lot of the hate. I saw both twice in theaters and I loved both (well, maybe I was a tad disappointed in Crystal Skull). But anyways...
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Originally Posted by Stoo
P.S. It’s sad that you haven’t seen “Gunga Din”. One of the best adventure films ever made!
It's somewhere on my 16-page Word doc of movies I need to see.
There, page 5, I checked. I'll be getting it from Netflix in no time.
(After high school, I went to art college and the few guys who were still into superheroes at that age were the BIGGEST NERDS on campus!)
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Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
And don't be silly Stoo, Indiana Jones is just as L.T.L.™ as Batman.
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Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
And besides, you can't really call out superhero fans for being nerds when you're posting on an Indiana Jones fan board.
Yeah, come on, Stoo. You can't seriously separate Indy nerds from superhero nerds, or any other kind of nerds. Nerds are nerds, and to say otherwise it just being nerdist.
You can't kid yourself that Indiana Jones is less silly or less larger than life than Batman or his superpowered associates.
Ghosts, aliens; death-dealing golden boxes; life giving cups; people missing vital organs continuing to live; atomic escape pods disguised as white goods; 800-year-old knights with a perfect grasp of modern English.
I don't leave my bunker often, but last time I checked real life wasn't that crazy.
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,950
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Originally Posted by Nurhachi1991
I thought TDK was boring.... I liked the 1989 Batman better
"The Dark Night" is a snooze-fest and perfect for making someone fall asleep. Like Mutt said, "It's better than a glass of warm milk". The '89 film is also garbage. After that piece of sh!te, I didn't watch another Batman movie until my nephew prodded me to watch the boring CLOWN movie, "Dork Night".
Mattzilla and Montana, I will reply to you both. Just hang on.
Mattzilla and Montana, I will reply to you both. Just hang on.
Ooh, I like cliffhangers!
(And yes the '89 was not a good film. Apart from Nicholson, but he was only a Joker impersonator cos he died.
To quote myself from somewhere else, Batman would have been looking down at the splattered Joker thinking, "Well, that was short lived. I expected more.")
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
Thanks Stoo. I appreciate your ability to generate discussions that I find genuinely interesting. My post count would be even less if not for your magic bag of intriguing discussion topics...
Ha! The “magic bag”! That bag is as deep & endless as my imagination.
I do remember Frank Miller’s renaissance because someone wanted me to check them out and lent me his issues. After about 2 months, I returned them, UNREAD. I never even took them out of the bags!
Re. Batman T-shirts: A great shirt because of the pop-art symbol. Wearing it out of Bat-fandom = dork. Wearing it because it’s great logo = cool (though the general public may not understand that and automatically assume the wearer is a Batfan). Keith Moon used to wear one c.1966.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
Remove all the trappings and you still have two heroes who we root for as they beat up the bad guys. I don't think you need anything more to justify an interest in both.
The thing is, beatin’ up bad guys is not Indy’s sole ‘raison d'être’. It’s a secondary aspect next to the main one: Treasure seeking. Whereas, unlike Dr. Jones, stopping bad guys is Batman’s primary (and possibly, only) function.
There are plenty of heroes who go around beating up bad guys. Above all others, why is Batman the most popular amongst The Raven crowd? The answer eludes me. The 2 “Dork Night” threads rank #3 & #4 of the most viewed threads in the Raven’s Films section. (#1 is “Crushes on celebrities” and #2 is, oddly, “Alice in Wonderland”! Go figure…) WHY?
People can like anything they want to but I just don’t understand why many Ravenheads seem to have an attraction towards superheroes (Ex. Batman) rather than adventure heroes (Ex. Allan Quatermain).
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
For the record, I never once thought to compare the two. And no, I don't think at all that the "Batman fans" were responsible for a lot of the hate.
It’s certainly clear that not all Batman fans are “Skull” haters but it’s worth pointing out that the most vitriolic bashers at The Raven in 2008/2009 were champions of “The Dark Knight”, in the most extreme sense. (I could name them but won't.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
It's somewhere on my 16-page Word doc of movies I need to see.
There, page 5, I checked. I'll be getting it from Netflix in no time.
Splendid! Mattzilla, after you watch it, please post your opinion in one of these threads:
"The Dark Night" is a snooze-fest and perfect for making someone fall asleep. Like Mutt said, "It's better than a glass of warm milk".
Well, for you maybe. For what it's worth (and it may be worth nothing at all) I saw it with my 51-year-old dad and he was just as riveted as I was. We found it edge-of-the-seat exciting as a matter of fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
The '89 film is also garbage. After that piece of sh!te, I didn't watch another Batman movie until my nephew prodded me to watch the boring CLOWN movie, "Dork Night".
A childhood favorite, but the more I give it repeat viewings, the more its faults become apparent. The script is all over the place. But still, I would never call it garbage. The production design alone is outstanding and it showed the "serious Batman" to non-comic book readers for the first time. Gotta give it credit for that at least.
If I may, allow me to prod you to give Batman Begins a try. You'll probably hate it (Batman still talks in the Batman voice to people who know his identity ) but it does a superb job of presenting the character's origin and motivations. It lays the groundwork for The Dark Knight (its sequel) very well and I think you're missing out on a lot if you see the second without having seen the first.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
I do remember Frank Miller’s renaissance because someone wanted me to check them out and lent me his issues. After about 2 months, I returned them, UNREAD. I never even took them out of the bags!
Never gave it a chance, eh? Sounds like you have some deep hatred for Batman that clouds your judgment of every new Bat-related thing. Maybe you hated The Dark Knight because you went into it wanting to hate it...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
Re. Batman T-shirts: A great shirt because of the pop-art symbol. Wearing it out of Bat-fandom = dork. Wearing it because it’s great logo = cool (though the general public may not understand that and automatically assume the wearer is a Batfan). Keith Moon used to wear one c.1966.
Okay, I'm a dork then. But even if they aren't "fans", I bet t-shirt wearers at least like the character. Most people at least like Batman. Not on a devotional fan level, but they can at least appreciate his pop culture importance and casually enjoy the movies. I have a bunch of friends who aren't dorks in the slightest, but 99% of them liked The Dark Knight.
And just how do you know Moon wasn't a Batfan? Maybe this cover was his idea:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
The thing is, beatin’ up bad guys is not Indy’s sole ‘raison d'être’. It’s a secondary aspect next to the main one: Treasure seeking. Whereas, unlike Dr. Jones, stopping bad guys is Batman’s primary (and possibly, only) function.
I'd argue that more people like Indy for the action hero aspect than the treasure hunting aspect. Can't prove it at all though; just the vibe I get.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
There are plenty of heroes who go around beating up bad guys. Above all others, why is Batman the most popular amongst The Raven crowd? The answer eludes me. The 2 “Dork Night” threads rank #3 & #4 of the most viewed threads in the Raven’s Films section. (#1 is “Crushes on celebrities” and #2 is, oddly, “Alice in Wonderland”! Go figure…) WHY?
Because his last movie was astoundingly popular and critically well-received, and the Films section is for discussion of all kinds of films, so naturally there would be a lot of discussion about a recent film that was very popular and held in high regard? I don't see why this is so difficult to grasp.
And as far as superheroes go, Batman generally seems to be the most popular.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
People can like anything they want to but I just don’t understand why many Ravenheads seem to have an attraction towards superheroes (Ex. Batman) rather than adventure heroes (Ex. Allan Quatermain).
Because I don't think the two are as far apart as you want them to be. Superheroes are a type of adventure hero. They just have different sorts of adventures.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
It’s certainly clear that not all Batman fans are “Skull” haters but it’s worth pointing out that the most vitriolic bashers at The Raven in 2008/2009 were champions of “The Dark Knight”, in the most extreme sense. (I could name them but won't.)
That's unfortunate. Were they making direct comparisons? Like, Crystal Skull should have been more like The Dark Knight in some sense or another? Because if so, that's quite stupid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
Splendid! Mattzilla, after you watch it, please post your opinion in one of these threads:
so again i find myself alone in what I like...As far as Batman movies go I LIKE the 89 movie better than any thats been made since..I thought it was well done, I liked the actors and the over all feel of it.
Keep in mind that I DONT LIKE Batman..Just not a fan. Wasnt as a kid that much either.
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
If I may, allow me to prod you to give Batman Begins a try. You'll probably hate it (Batman still talks in the Batman voice to people who know his identity ) but it does a superb job of presenting the character's origin and motivations. It lays the groundwork for The Dark Knight (its sequel) very well and I think you're missing out on a lot if you see the second without having seen the first.
By telling me that Batman talks to people who know his identity with the stupid Batman voice in "Batman Begins", you've just significantly decreased the chances of me ever bothering to watch it. You shouldn't have done that, Matt!
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
Never gave it a chance, eh? Sounds like you have some deep hatred for Batman that clouds your judgment of every new Bat-related thing. Maybe you hated The Dark Knight because you went into it wanting to hate it...
I don't have a deep hatred for Batman. I just wasn't into wasting my free time on superhero sh*t at that age. (Fast forward to 2008 & onwards, and my dislike is due to something else far more complex...)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
And just how do you know Moon wasn't a Batfan? Maybe this cover was his idea:
Please, don't get the wrong impression; Moon was indeed a Batfan and so was the bassist, John Entwistle. It was their idea (mostly Keith's) to cover the theme tune. (I even have very, RARE footage of them in the back of a car listening to a Batman radio show with different theme music!)
Keep in mind that this was in 1966 while the non-serious TV show was airing, when, among other things, Bruce Wayne had the same voice while in disguise!
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
I'd argue that more people like Indy for the action hero aspect than the treasure hunting aspect. Can't prove it at all though; just the vibe I get.
If there isn't a thread on that already, then you should start one, Matt, and make it a poll! (There are loads of "action heroes" but how many of them are "treasure hunters"?)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
Because his last movie was astoundingly popular and critically well-received, and the Films section is for discussion of all kinds of films, so naturally there would be a lot of discussion about a recent film that was very popular and held in high regard? I don't see why this is so difficult to grasp.
And as far as superheroes go, Batman generally seems to be the most popular.
Since the release of "Crystal Skull", Batman has permeated The Raven way beyond the Films section and it might continue further when the new "Dork Knight" movie comes out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
Because I don't think the two are as far apart as you want them to be. Superheroes are a type of adventure hero. They just have different sorts of adventures.
Nah. Superheroes are "crime-fighters" whose sole aims are to fight evil. Batman actively pursues wrong-doings as a personal mission. In the Harrison Ford films, this is NOT the "modus operandi" of Indiana Jones. (The two characters are MUCH farther apart than you want them to be.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattzilla2010
That's unfortunate. Were they making direct comparisons? Like, Crystal Skull should have been more like The Dark Knight in some sense or another? Because if so, that's quite stupid.
Yes, they were making direct comparisons. Of the most vitriolic three, 2 of them were banned forever and 1 doesn't visit anymore (thankfully). The rest simply joined up, made a couple of posts & then disappeared. (There is a new one now...and his name is...)
Out of curiosity: Are there any threads on Dork Knight forums called, "Are/were the Indy fans responsible for a lot of the Dark Knight hate?"
Location: Skull Island (the spiders get in everything!).
Posts: 2,111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
By telling me that Batman talks to people who know his identity with the stupid Batman voice in "Batman Begins", you've just significantly decreased the chances of me ever bothering to watch it. You shouldn't have done that, Matt!
I don't have a deep hatred for Batman. I just wasn't into wasting my free time on superhero sh*t at that age. (Fast forward to 2008 & onwards, and my dislike is due to something else far more complex...)
Please, don't get the wrong impression; Moon was indeed a Batfan and so was the bassist, John Entwistle. It was their idea (mostly Keith's) to cover the theme tune. (I even have very, RARE footage of them in the back of a car listening to a Batman radio show with different theme music!)
Keep in mind that this was in 1966 while the non-serious TV show was airing, when, among other things, Bruce Wayne had the same voice while in disguise!
If there isn't a thread on that already, then you should start one, Matt, and make it a poll! (There are loads of "action heroes" but how many of them are "treasure hunters"?)
Since the release of "Crystal Skull", Batman has permeated The Raven way beyond the Films section and it might continue further when the new "Dork Knight" movie comes out.
Nah. Superheroes are "crime-fighters" whose sole aims are to fight evil. Batman actively pursues wrong-doings as a personal mission. In the Harrison Ford films, this is NOT the "modus operandi" of Indiana Jones. (The two characters are MUCH farther apart than you want them to be.)
Yes, they were making direct comparisons. Of the most vitriolic three, 2 of them were banned forever and 1 doesn't visit anymore (thankfully). The rest simply joined up, made a couple of posts & then disappeared. (There is a new one now...and his name is...)
Out of curiosity: Are there any threads on Dork Knight forums called, "Are/were the Indy fans responsible for a lot of the Dark Knight hate?"
Stoo, buddy, you REALLY need to stop sounding so f'ing pissed off about this issue. Really, it's not that huge of a deal. Some Indy fans happen to love Batman too. Accept it. There's nothing wrong with it. You're delusional if you think Indy fans aren't allowed to have any other passions. Again, I say, accept it.
Go home and rethink your life.
Oh, and if all Indy fans were like you, I'm sure there WOULD be threads like that on Batman forums, because guys like you wouldn't stop hating on, ugh, "The Dork Knight," as you call it. Would you like it if I started constantly calling Crystal Skull KOCS, just to insult the lovers (like some already do)? Because that's frankly what you're doing to Batman fans by using nicknames like that. It's a big whopping, "Batman fans are inbred, stupid homosexuals who like scat porn and love boy bands," to them. That was the most offensive sentence I could come up with, but seriously, you sound like you want nothing more than to post that sentence yourself.
And yeah, if I sound a little agressive here, it's because I am starting to genuinely lose patience with you and your own aggressive attitude, man...fight fire with fire, and all that.
Speaking of which, THE FIRE RISES!
Last edited by kongisking : 06-25-2012 at 05:59 PM.
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by kongisking
You're delusional if you think Indy fans aren't allowed to have any other passions. Again, I say, accept it.
People can have any other passion they feel like. (I have other passions, too.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kongisking
Oh, and if all Indy fans were like you, I'm sure there WOULD be threads like that on Batman forums, because guys like you wouldn't stop hating on, ugh, "The Dork Knight," as you call it.
No, not at all. That is entirely incorrect, Kongisking. If all Indy fans were like me they WOULDN'T EVEN BOTHER LOOKING at a Batman forum!
Quote:
Originally Posted by kongisking
Would you like it if I started constantly calling Crystal Skull KOCS, just to insult the lovers (like some already do)? Because that's frankly what you're doing to Batman fans by using nicknames like that. It's a big whopping, "Batman fans are inbred, stupid homosexuals who like scat porn and love boy bands," to them. That was the most offensive sentence I could come up with, but seriously, you sound like you want nothing more than to post that sentence yourself.
Call Indy 4, "KOCKS", as many times as you wish. It won't bother me because this is an Indiana Jones website and that moniker has never upset me before. If I went around on Batman forums saying, "Dork Knight", all the time then you'd have someting to compare with...but I don't do that. (Nor have I have ever posted in the 2 "Dork Knight"-dedicated threads here at The Raven.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kongisking
And yeah, if I sound a little agressive here, it's because I am starting to genuinely lose patience with you and your own aggressive attitude, man...fight fire with fire, and all that.
Please, Kong, don't let this issue get between us, eh?.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikieson
im just gonna have to say....this is the dumbest f^&*( thread ive ever seen. Especially from a bunch of adults.
By telling me that Batman talks to people who know his identity with the stupid Batman voice in "Batman Begins", you've just significantly decreased the chances of me ever bothering to watch it. You shouldn't have done that, Matt!
Do it for me? Pwetty please? It'll help me sleep better at night.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
I don't have a deep hatred for Batman. I just wasn't into wasting my free time on superhero sh*t at that age. (Fast forward to 2008 & onwards, and my dislike is due to something else far more complex...)
Well I am indeed very sorry that overly vocal, immature Batfans have left such a sour taste in your mouth. You strike me as the kind of guy who never changes his mind once he decides he doesn't like something, so I'll leave you alone about it (after you see Batman Begins of course ). Allow me to just request that you stop verbally assaulting the character and its fans? Be the bigger man if the Batdorks start ragging on Indy. This petty squabbling is below you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
Please, don't get the wrong impression; Moon was indeed a Batfan and so was the bassist, John Entwistle. It was their idea (mostly Keith's) to cover the theme tune. (I even have very, RARE footage of them in the back of a car listening to a Batman radio show with different theme music!)
I'd love to see that if you have a way of getting it on youtube or something! (I am a big Who fan myself as a matter of fact)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
Keep in mind that this was in 1966 while the non-serious TV show was airing, when, among other things, Bruce Wayne had the same voice while in disguise!
That show was my introduction to the character; it's fantastic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
If there isn't a thread on that already, then you should start one, Matt, and make it a poll! (There are loads of "action heroes" but how many of them are "treasure hunters"?)
Good idea!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
Since the release of "Crystal Skull", Batman has permeated The Raven way beyond the Films section and it might continue further when the new "Dork Knight" movie comes out.
Not sure what else I can say. Lots of people love Batman.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
Nah. Superheroes are "crime-fighters" whose sole aims are to fight evil. Batman actively pursues wrong-doings as a personal mission. In the Harrison Ford films, this is NOT the "modus operandi" of Indiana Jones. (The two characters are MUCH farther apart than you want them to be.)
See, I always saw the archaeology/treasure hunting as... I don't think "excuse" is the right word, but just as a reason to set up the action sequences. Indy's personal mission is recovering valuable artifacts of course, but I think when he encounters Nazis or Thuggees or Commies the mission becomes more than that. His mission is to protect the artifact from those evil folks that would use it for their dastardly plans.
If the Nazis obtained the Ark, for example, they would certainly become invincible, take over the world, etc. as Marcus points out. So the addition of "villains" to the Indy plots makes his personal mission more about stopping them. He's beating up the bad guys to save the world, much like a superhero. Even if we're led to believe he's not doing this all the time, it's still what the main plots of all 4 movies focus on.
So you're right in that he doesn't seek evildoers out, but when he encounters them he goes into world-saving "superhero" mode.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
Yes, they were making direct comparisons. Of the most vitriolic three, 2 of them were banned forever and 1 doesn't visit anymore (thankfully). The rest simply joined up, made a couple of posts & then disappeared. (There is a new one now...and his name is...)
What? WHAT IS IT?!?! WHAAAAT ISSSS IIITTTT?!?!?!?!?!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
Out of curiosity: Are there any threads on Dork Knight forums called, "Are/were the Indy fans responsible for a lot of the Dark Knight hate?"
Haha, can't say as there are. Probably because the ratio of "Skull" haters to "Knight" haters is like 10000:1.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikieson
im just gonna have to say....this is the dumbest f^&*( thread ive ever seen. Especially from a bunch of adults.
Last edited by mattzilla2010 : 06-25-2012 at 08:25 PM.
See, I always saw the archaeology/treasure hunting as... I don't think "excuse" is the right word, but just as a reason to set up the action sequences. Indy's personal mission is recovering valuable artifacts of course, but I think when he encounters Nazis or Thuggees or Commies the mission becomes more than that. His mission is to protect the artifact from those evil folks that would use it for their dastardly plans.
If the Nazis obtained the Ark, for example, they would certainly become invincible, take over the world, etc. as Marcus points out. So the addition of "villains" to the Indy plots makes his personal mission more about stopping them. He's beating up the bad guys to save the world, much like a superhero. Even if we're led to believe he's not doing this all the time, it's still what the main plots of all 4 movies focus on.
So you're right in that he doesn't seek evildoers out, but when he encounters them he goes into world-saving "superhero" mode.
Indeed:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smiffy
...in 1943 Batman took on the agents of Hirohito to prevent Japan from acquiring a superweapon.
In 1936 Indiana Jones took on the agents of Hitler to prevent Germany from acquiring a superweapon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikieson
im just gonna have to say....this is the dumbest f^&*( thread ive ever seen. Especially from a bunch of adults.
You funny.
You just described virtually every Raven thread and its participants.
Nay, you just described virtually every internet message board devoted to a fictional character!
People can have any other passion they feel like. (I have other passions, too.)
No, not at all. That is entirely incorrect, Kongisking. If all Indy fans were like me they WOULDN'T EVEN BOTHER LOOKING at a Batman forum!
Call Indy 4, "KOCKS", as many times as you wish. It won't bother me because this is an Indiana Jones website and that moniker has never upset me before. If I went around on Batman forums saying, "Dork Knight", all the time then you'd have someting to compare with...but I don't do that. (Nor have I have ever posted in the 2 "Dork Knight"-dedicated threads here at The Raven.)
Please, Kong, don't let this issue get between us, eh?.
is that why youve f^&* posted in it 10 times?
Yea..i guess it is..because im floored that grown a^& men are arguing over some fictional f^&! characters like 10 year olds..seriously..Ive just never seen a group of people...OR even heard of people arguing over something like this until I stumbled upon this thread. I never knew anything like this existed..
Yea..i guess it is..because im floored that grown a^& men are arguing over some fictional f^&! characters like 10 year olds..seriously..Ive just never seen a group of people...OR even heard of people arguing over something like this until I stumbled upon this thread. I never knew anything like this existed..
Such a sheltered life.
And that's me saying that from my bunker.
I could recommend a trip over to Sideshow Freaks for a really eye-opening experience.
The Joker's socks are a constant hot topic of contention. Seriously.
I don't understand why modern, superhero movies get so much attention from Ravenheads rather than adventure films from the '30-'50s (Indy's era). For example: More than a week ago, in the "
Anyway, Smiff, since you mentioned him (like Raiders112390 did):
However…
)
I think a benchmark for making the genre more serious came in the form of Frank Miller's 1986 "The Dark Knight Returns" (not to be confused with Chris Nolan's upcoming The Dark Knight Rises, of course). Someone may need to fact-check me, but I believe this was one of the first superhero stories not aimed at children. In fact, it's outright inappropriate for kids.
Batman logo t-shirts are rather fashionable on college campuses these days.
(I could name them but won't.)
