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Old 03-06-2009, 09:00 PM   #1
Indy's brother
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Idea for a snow bound Indy 5

It occurred to me a moment ago that, along with conflicting opinions on how far back the history of civilization goes, we also know very little about Antarctica. My first search led me to this:

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Lots of surprises may be hidden under the Antarctic ice and are waiting to be discovered by humans

The existence of the prehistoric civilization in Antarctica started drawing attention of professional historians after the World War II. The hypothesis can be proved by the medieval maps and research of the Western paleogeologists and glaciologists.

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the head of the Istanbul National Museum Halil Edhem found an old map while revising the library of Byzantine emperors in the old sultans palace. The author of the map depicted the Western coast of Africa, the Southern coast of South America and the Northern coast of Antarctica. Halil was astonished. The ice edge of the Queen Maud Land south of 70th parallel was free of ice. The author mapped a mountain chain at this point. The name of the cartographer was well known to Edhem. It was the admiral of Ottoman Empire Fleet Piri Reis, who lived in the first half of the 16th century.

In 1949 the joint British-Swedish expedition conducted a thorough seismic exploration of the southernmost continent through the thick ice. The results coincided with the map of Reis. However, it was a mystery how the map data were to agree with the level of science of 1513.

Piri Reis himself explained on the margins of the map that the map was based on a lot of previous sources, some of which belonged to his contemporaries, while others could be dated with as early as the 4th century B.C. One of thу sources, for instance, belonged to Alexander the Great.

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Medieval maps show Antarctica without ice cover or partly covered with ice. The accuracy of maps of the 16th century is incredible. In terms of the technical means their data can be compared with those of the end of the 18th century and sometimes with those of the 20th century.

A picture of Piri Reis' actual map, drawn on Gazzelle hide:



The site that this photo comes from has a massive amount of imformation which corroborates it's legitimacy.

Of course, the obvious writing choice would be Atlantis. I think that the legendary Hall of Records would be a neat thing to be hidden under the ice of Antarctica.

Your thoughts?
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Old 03-06-2009, 11:28 PM   #2
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One of the things that I liked about the novel Indiana Jones and the Hollow Earth was the fact that we saw Indy head to the Arctic. It was a new situation for him and it had a very different feeling from the the others and I certainly wouldn't mind seeing this atmosphere represented in one of the films.
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Old 03-07-2009, 02:52 AM   #3
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I certainly like the idea of a snowy locale, and also a quest for Atlantis is an obvious choice (now KOTCS has taken us away from the more routine quest for religious artifacts).

The only thing I'd say is that I wouldn't want to see an Indy movie where the main locale was just snow and ice... simply because it gets quite bland, and fast. Perhaps 20/30 minutes in the snow/tundra would do before moving to a warmer climate.
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Old 03-07-2009, 04:15 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Vile
The only thing I'd say is that I wouldn't want to see an Indy movie where the main locale was just snow and ice... simply because it gets quite bland, and fast. Perhaps 20/30 minutes in the snow/tundra would do before moving to a warmer climate.

I like this idea quite a bit. Plus, we won't see much of the fedora and whip if Indy spends the whole film in sub-zero temperatures.
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Old 03-07-2009, 04:57 PM   #5
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While Lucas liked different enviroments in Star Wars he seems to like Indy where it's hot. In all 4 films so far.

It would be interesting if he were to move Indy in colder climate. But, it would have to be for a good reason. Which I can't come up with one just yet.
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Old 03-08-2009, 12:02 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by arkfinder
... he seems to like Indy where it's hot.

So, he likes Indy in the same room with my wife?
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Old 03-08-2009, 06:04 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Vile
The only thing I'd say is that I wouldn't want to see an Indy movie where the main locale was just snow and ice... simply because it gets quite bland, and fast. Perhaps 20/30 minutes in the snow/tundra would do before moving to a warmer climate.
How about the LAST 30 mins.? Anyway, surprising to hear you say that, Darth.

Obviously, it’s a matter of preference but I think a snow environment holds enough potential to sustain the majority of the film (equal to the Egyptian and island portion of “Raiders”). Whether it “gets quite bland” or not all depends on how it’s handled. Apart from colour, or lack thereof, it isn’t that much different from a desert. Both are bleak but photographing either of them well can yield some stunning visuals.

As for perilous situations to be found with ice'n'snow, there are plenty of those so a cold locale could work well for a large chunk of a story. Of course, jungles & deserts are the mainstays of Indyland but a wintery climate would make a welcome, refreshing twist and is perhaps the most logical direction for the series should take to avoid retreading old ground.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morning Bell
Plus, we won't see much of the fedora and whip if Indy spends the whole film in sub-zero temperatures.
There are plenty of places where he could have his hat and use his whip. Don't forget Nepal!
It wouldn’t necessarily have to always be 100% arctic conditions. Ex. Wyoming:



We've seen Ford as Indy in the white stuff 3 times (and higher in the "expanded universe", most recently in “Tomb of the Gods” comic) but I’d definitely like to see more if there ever is a 5th. There have been a few discussions on snow adventures in the recent past and I've been wanting to start a thread called "Indy in the Snow" for a long time but this seems to be the perfect thread for any & all frosty-related-Indy-items.
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Old 03-08-2009, 09:51 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Stoo
How about the LAST 30 mins.? Anyway, surprising to hear you say that, Darth.

Obviously, it’s a matter of preference but I think a snow environment holds enough potential to sustain the majority of the film (equal to the Egyptian and island portion of “Raiders”). Whether it “gets quite bland” or not all depends on how it’s handled. Apart from colour, or lack thereof, it isn’t that much different from a desert. Both are bleak but photographing either of them well can yield some stunning visuals.

Don't get me wrong... I think it's crucial that they try and work in as many varied locales and terrains as possible (if they do an Indy V that is)... and a snow bound one is certainly worthy of consideration (and one I'd like to see purely for the sake of being different).

Again, I’m thinking more of the practicalities/feasibility side of things rather than whether that environment would work on screen…
1) Would Spielberg/Lucas really consider going on location (for anything more than 2nd unit type stuff) to an environment that risked an unpleasant experience for the crew? I doubt it (no matter how good it could be on screen).
2) Would having a snow type environment mean that they’d potentially have to look to CGI to fully realize it? Is that something we’d be comfortable with on screen?
3) Could you actually stage something akin to the truck/tank and jungle chase on location in artic conditions? Is it practical to do?

So the practical side of me thinks that whilst you could get away with some 2nd unit shooting in a snowy/icy locale, principle on location shooting would be highly problematical... if you wanted on location set pieces akin to truck/tank/jungle chase that is (as opposed to sound stage).
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Old 03-09-2009, 11:19 AM   #9
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1) To be honest, I hadn't even considered that angle. Not being inside the filmakers' heads makes it hard to speculate how far their comfort zones would stretch but I agree that it's not likely (if the choice of shooting locations for "Skull" is any indicator).

2) Unboutedly. Even the original chase in "Raiders" had effects (even if only for 1 shot) so I have no problem with FX or CGI in Indy-action scenes. It's almost a requirement.

3) In our hypothetical film, Vic Armstrong should get back on board the team. He was 2nd unit director & stunt co-oridnator for a '79 film, "Bear Island". Have you ever seen this one? There is great, LONG scene with fan-powered sled boats in an arctic setting all done with practical stunts. As for the trickiness of using soundstages, it really boils down to what the story is. Remember, "Doom" is mainly interior sets with only a few scenes actually on location. I think it could be done.

Not the right time period for Indy 5 but I'd love to see him face-off against something like this:

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Old 03-09-2009, 12:41 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
2) Unboutedly. Even the original chase in "Raiders" had effects (even if only for 1 shot) so I have no problem with FX or CGI in Indy-action scenes. It's almost a requirement.

I don't really have an issue with effects in Indy movies (as long as there is some modicum of taste)... just seems that many didn't like the overuse of visual effects in KOTCS.

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Originally Posted by Stoo
3) In our hypothetical film, Vic Armstrong should get back on board the team. He was 2nd unit director & stunt co-oridnator for a '79 film, "Bear Island". Have you ever seen this one? There is great, LONG scene with fan-powered sled boats in an arctic setting all done with practical stunts. As for the trickiness of using soundstages, it really boils down to what the story is. Remember, "Doom" is mainly interior sets with only a few scenes actually on location. I think it could be done.

Yep - seen 'Bear Island' and I know the bit you mean (and Vic Armstrong would have been great). Again, it's not that it couldn't be done for Indy V... but rather would they want to do it?

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Originally Posted by Stoo
Not the right time period for Indy 5 but I'd love to see him face-off against something like this:


With you there... Something like that would be great.
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Old 03-09-2009, 10:59 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Vile
With you there... Something like that would be great.

Google the words "nazi" and "Antarctica"... Myth and fact blend seamlessly everywhere! A subterranean nazi base, a haven for nazi subs, a British monitoring station, nazi ufo testing, and a secret nazi mission to the moon!
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Old 03-10-2009, 12:19 AM   #12
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It's been done Wyoming 1950
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Old 03-10-2009, 12:11 PM   #13
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Having a temple or some lost city under the ice or inside a mountain could be pretty interesting and I think there's plenty of potential to have Indy in the snow part-time in a film.
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Old 03-10-2009, 07:21 PM   #14
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Oh heck yes... Siberian aero-sled chase!

Many more here.
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Old 03-10-2009, 09:08 PM   #15
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Seriously, Moedred...GREAT find. This one looks like a scene from an Indy flick by the way they set up the "shot":



Frickin' Awesome!!!
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Old 03-10-2009, 09:51 PM   #16
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I really love "Mystery of the Blues". To be honest, I wish they did make a snow-themed Indy movie as Indy 4 instead and had made KOTCS Indy 5.

Looking back, the biggest flaw of KOTCS wasn't anything about the movie itself, but rather the fact they waited too long. A lot of missed opportunities through the 90's-early 00's. They can obviously still do Indy 5, but you can't deny Ford is getting up there in age.

A damn shame they didn't make Indy movies more often and make Indy more Bond-like in the sense he's well-known to every generation and wasn't considered just a piece of 1980's nostalgia.

Last edited by Forbidden Eye : 03-10-2009 at 09:56 PM.
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Old 03-11-2009, 12:27 PM   #17
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Of course the bars which prevent riders from leaning back into the propeller may have to go.
So many possibilities with that axe...
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Old 03-11-2009, 01:17 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moedred
Of course the bars which prevent riders from leaning back into the propeller may have to go.
So many possibilities with that axe...

We are on the same wavelength with that. I was thinking the same thing!
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Old 03-11-2009, 03:11 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Indy's brother
Seriously, Moedred...GREAT find. This one looks like a scene from an Indy flick by the way they set up the "shot":

Frickin' Awesome!!!
WOW! Great images and, yes, thanks for the link, Moedred! That is a super webpage.
For those who haven't seen "Bear Island", here's some vintage TV ads & a clip of the beginning.
They don't really show the best of Vic Armstrong's fanboat chase (there is a cool shot in #2)
but should give you an idea. He's the man for the job. Bring him back for Indy 5!

Bear Island 1980 TV Trailer #1
Bear Island 1980 TV Trailer #2
Bear Island (1979)

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Originally Posted by Moedred
Of course the bars which prevent riders from leaning back into the propeller may have to go.
I'm seeing red on white.

This portion of a fan-made trailer for "Fate of Atlantis" trailer has always fired my imagination:

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Old 03-11-2009, 03:46 PM   #20
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I agree. Something in the snow would be great for Indy. Bond has been in the snow several times so why not Indy?

And that is a great find Moedred! I'd love to see a movie, even if it's not Indy, with those in it.

Someone needs to send those images to Lucasfilm.
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Old 03-17-2009, 04:35 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Forbidden Eye
I really love "Mystery of the Blues". To be honest, I wish they did make a snow-themed Indy movie as Indy 4 instead and had made KOTCS Indy 5.

Looking back, the biggest flaw of KOTCS wasn't anything about the movie itself, but rather the fact they waited too long. A lot of missed opportunities through the 90's-early 00's. They can obviously still do Indy 5, but you can't deny Ford is getting up there in age.

I think a prequel could still be considered as a possibility. If the fifth film was set in 1954, for example, Indy wouldn't need to look any younger than what he actually looked in "Kingdom".

But if that was the case, Lucas would better hurry up the things 'cause Harrison is now nearing his 70s!! And the more time will pass, the more difficult will be for him to be convincing in the role of a fifty-something year old adventure hero...

Anyway, I would really love to see a snowy location, as long as it is impervious and spectacular!! But I also agree with Darth Vile, the film shouldn't be too centered on it. Just 20/30 minutes, at the beginning or climax of the movie.

On a side note, those snow-mobiles look REALLY intriguing...
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Old 03-17-2009, 04:49 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by The Stranger
I think a prequel could still be considered as a possibility. If the fifth film was set in 1954, for example, Indy wouldn't need to look any younger than what he actually looked in "Kingdom".

It would be cool to see a repeat of the original trilogy's pattern: A darker sequel set in 1956, followed by a swansong set in 1959.
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Old 03-17-2009, 05:05 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by James
It would be cool to see a repeat of the original trilogy's pattern: A darker sequel set in 1956, followed by a swansong set in 1959.

I hear you!! It would be great!!!
And it would also turn up being a sort of tribute to the original saga!!

Shame is, possibilities of other TWO films being developed are sadly close to zero.
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Old 03-17-2009, 09:25 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Stranger
I hear you!! It would be great!!!
And it would also turn up being a sort of tribute to the original saga!!

Shame is, possibilities of other TWO films being developed are sadly close to zero.

Although it breaks with tradition... What about 2 movies shot back to back i.e. 2 movies, 1 story (with a cliffhanger after the first part)?
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Old 03-17-2009, 11:10 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James
It would be cool to see a repeat of the original trilogy's pattern: A darker sequel set in 1956, followed by a swansong set in 1959.

+1!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Vile
it breaks with tradition... What about 2 movies shot back to back i.e. 2 movies, 1 story (with a cliffhanger after the first part)?

Back the Future 2+3, Kill Bill 1+2? No thanks. If there is an example you can think of that didn't fall flat on it's face somewhere in the second flick, I could be persuaded, though.

GL and SP are such creatures of habit with the IJ franchise that I doubt they would shake up the format of one of these movies that much anyway. These movies are made in such a certain way, and each one is so obviously self-contained, that I don't think they'd stray from their formula this far into the series.
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