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Old 07-20-2004, 07:48 AM   #51
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Some interesting information on Gypsys I found:

http://www.vurdon.it/english.htm#cus...d%20traditions
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Old 07-20-2004, 01:49 PM   #52
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Fascinating web page Indyologist.

The Gypsies and their history are truly very unique and interesting.
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Old 07-21-2004, 08:44 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally posted by monkey
Fascinating web page Indyologist.

The Gypsies and their history are truly very unique and interesting.


I know this is OT, but I'm Hungarian so probably some of my ancestors were gypsies.
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Old 07-21-2004, 08:51 AM   #54
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Indyologist... how well you know the origins of Hungarians?

Honestly, I'm not fooling you here, but if you have Hungarian blood, you're probably more closely related to Finns than the gypsies. Wanna know more?
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Old 07-21-2004, 12:47 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally posted by Finn
Indyologist... how well you know the origins of Hungarians?

Honestly, I'm not fooling you here, but if you have Hungarian blood, you're probably more closely related to Finns than the gypsies. Wanna know more?



Sure, you can tell me more, Finn. If you want to PM me so we don't get OT, that's fine.

Well, I've got a Hungarian double-whammy on my dad's side. Both his mom and dad were Hungarian (Feher). I've been told by people that I look kind of Slavic. My brother has narrow eyes like the Slavs do. I have the dark hair and eyes, and I tan pretty easily.

My mom's dad was Irish (Sheridan) and her mom was Polish (Grabowski). My aunt visited my relatives in Hungary in 1950 or so. They were farmers, pretty much. I guess Hungarian gypsies are probably a stereotype. I wonder though, because I had an old, old aunt (my dad's sister-in-law) who could predict the future of her loved ones down to a "T." If that doesn't sound like gypsy stuff, then I don't know what is!
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Old 07-21-2004, 02:18 PM   #56
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Well, this is a lengthy explanation, but I guess a little history lesson hurts no one, since this is actually civilizing, and could be counted under "topic progression".

About the origins of the Hungarians, the only thing known with certainty is that they are related to the Finns, and their language belongs to the so-called Fenno-Ugrian language family, together with that of the Vogul and Ostyak peoples of the northern Urals and the Fenno-Baltic people living around the Eastern parts of the Baltic Sea. With the distant Finns as their only cousins, the Hungarians have no linguistic ties with their neighbours.

When it comes to actual blood relation, about 50% of their original genes the Hungarians are being the same stuff with Finns. It is assumed that somewhere deep East, there where the river Volga flows lived a bunch of people speaking language that would form itself into both Finnish and Hungarian. They started to head west, in some point separating so that the part of them went more northwards while the rest of them bent their route south. Respectively, they ended up on those quarters where you nowadays can find Finland and Hungary on the map. The genes of both people have heavily mixed though. As I said, they share 50% of the same blood relation. With the Hungarians, the other half comes mostly from the people living in Slavic areas and Balkan, while those of the core people who headed north eventually mixed up with the Scandinavian and Western European blood - and thus became Finns. Story told.

So, to simplify a bit:
Code:
Ugrian ancestors I I I I headed: south north I I I I mixed blood: Slavics Scandinavians I I I I to become: Hungarians Finns

So as proven here, the Hungarians and the Finns share de facto more blood relation than the Hungarians and the gypsies. Actually the amount of gypsy blood is not that great with Hungarians at all since as we know, they originated from near India and didn't actually arrive Europe before the "Ugrian people from East" (still haven't figured out a better callname for them) had gained some genes from the Slavics to establish the base Hungarian gene pool.

And of course, when I talk about "moving west", don't think about a bunch of people packing up their things and possibly taking a month or two to find a new place to dwell, it took centuries, maybe millennias. Actually, the Hungarians most likely first set their dwellings near the south end of the Ural mountains, where they were driven away by the ancestors of the Russians estimately sometime in the early Christian era.

Of course, there are other theories about the origin of the Hungarian people, but I told you the most commonly supported one. None of these different theories, however, deny the blood bond shared by the Hungarians and the Finns.

Interesting, huh?
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Old 07-21-2004, 06:21 PM   #57
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Dark Women!

"I have the dark hair and eyes, and I tan pretty easily."

GRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!

Sounds like you're my kind of girl Indyologist!!

Hey Finn,
Very interesting history lesson, and it's definitely not OT. Very much topic progression. I found it to be fascinating. I had actually heard some vague details of the connection of the Finns and their language with that of some of the Eastern European peoples, but nothing specific like you talk about. I know that the Finnish language is quite different from the other Scandinavian languages.
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Old 07-21-2004, 06:24 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally posted by Indyologist
I have the dark hair and eyes, and I tan pretty easily.

The previous post was supposed to be a "quote", but something messes up every time I try to do a quote.

Sorry
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Old 07-21-2004, 07:17 PM   #59
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Re: Dark Women!

Quote:
Originally posted by monkey
"I have the dark hair and eyes, and I tan pretty easily."

GRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!

Sounds like you're my kind of girl Indyologist!!


Hey, Monkey!

I've got dark hair and dark eyes too!
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Old 07-22-2004, 06:07 AM   #60
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.............Canyon, not only do you have pretty dark eyes and lovely, wavy dark hair, but you also have a beautiful complexion to match.

You and Indyologist are both my kind of girls!!!...........................

(Monkey slips into a naughty daydream......) ; )
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Old 07-22-2004, 08:01 AM   #61
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Re: Dark Women!

Quote:
Originally posted by monkey
Hey Finn,
Very interesting history lesson, and it's definitely not OT. Very much topic progression. I found it to be fascinating. I had actually heard some vague details of the connection of the Finns and their language with that of some of the Eastern European peoples, but nothing specific like you talk about. I know that the Finnish language is quite different from the other Scandinavian languages.
To expand the lesson a bit, let's talk a little longer about the origins of the Finnish language. First of all, Finnish is actually not a Scandinavian language. Swedish, Danish, Norwegian and Icelandic are. Finnish is a Fenno-Baltic language, bonding the closest relation to Estonian. And when you spoke about Finnish bearing relation to some eastern European languages... well, the only one is Hungarian. Rest of the languages behind the former Iron curtain are almost all members of the Slavic language group.

The bit up there with the Hungarians pretty much clears out the birthstory of Finnish language, but only the spoken part of it. As we know, there are usually two aspects, spoken and written language. This may sound odd, but the origins of spoken and written Finnish are different stories of their own. For a language that is still very much alive, Finnish bears an odd detail tied to it; it did not have a written form before the 15th century. And it did not just become to use, it was actually "invented" by one man (Mikael Agricola, a renowned scholar, plus the Bishop of Finland of his time). So written Finnish is de facto an artificial addition to the language. And what makes it even more odd is not that as one might think, it was not formed after languages with most cultural impact on the Finns, make that Swedish or Russian. Written Finnish was based on Latin. The spelling is exactly the same.

Explains why the Finns don't vocal their letters (and thus why it's a language so damn hard to learn) the same way than the rest of the Western world, doesn't it?

Last edited by Finn : 07-22-2004 at 08:03 AM.
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Old 07-22-2004, 01:08 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally posted by monkey
.............Canyon, not only do you have pretty dark eyes and lovely, wavy dark hair, but you also have a beautiful complexion to match.

You and Indyologist are both my kind of girls!!!...........................

(Monkey slips into a naughty daydream......) ; )



Awww, Monkey, you old smoothie you!

You are a sweetie!
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Old 07-22-2004, 03:24 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally posted by Finn
Well, this is a lengthy explanation, but I guess a little history lesson hurts no one, since this is actually civilizing, and could be counted under "topic progression".....

(Didn't want to re-quote the whole thing)

Of course, there are other theories about the origin of the Hungarian people, but I told you the most commonly supported one. None of these different theories, however, deny the blood bond shared by the Hungarians and the Finns.

Interesting, huh?


That was very interesting indeed, Finn! So I may be related to Finnish people, huh? Curious thought. You seem to be pretty up on your history. Maybe I'll print this out for reference. I'm interested in family history. This is turning out to be an interesting thread!

Quoted by Monkey: "I have the dark hair and eyes, and I tan pretty easily."

GRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!

Sounds like you're my kind of girl Indyologist!!


Gee, I've never gotten a compliment from a monkey before... what a sweet thing to say! I'm tan right now, although I'm peeling a bit. Ewwwww!
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Old 07-23-2004, 08:54 AM   #64
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Quote:
Originally posted by Indyologist
That was very interesting indeed, Finn! So I may be related to Finnish people, huh?
If we go few thousand years back. But that's not exactly the way I'd put it, because after all, if we go back far enough, every people on this rock are related to each other (no matter if your take is the Good Book or Darwin - this is still a fact)...

But let's say that you very probably carry a great amount of same genes than the Finns do.
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Old 07-23-2004, 10:29 AM   #65
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Quote:
Originally posted by Finn
If we go few thousand years back. But that's not exactly the way I'd put it, because after all, if we go back far enough, every people on this rock are related to each other (no matter if your take is the Good Book or Darwin - this is still a fact)...

But let's say that you very probably carry a great amount of same genes than the Finns do.


To quote Indy in F of A: "Wow-- how awe-inspiring!"

Yes, I agree that deep down we all came from the same original family. I personally agree with what the Bible says, in spite of some of the naughty stuff I post here at Raven. It's too bad that even though we're all fundamentally related at our deepest mitochondrial roots, that we can't get along with other each.
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Old 08-04-2004, 12:09 AM   #66
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Just for the record, I just finished Gypsy's Kiss. It was real good.
Also, on the Indiana Quote Game, I quoted it, so check it out.

Good work, Monkey.
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Old 08-04-2004, 07:58 PM   #67
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Thanks TR.
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Old 08-10-2004, 02:19 PM   #68
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It was amazing. Monkey, write another one. Lucas Books should really give you copyright to start new Indy books!
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Old 08-10-2004, 06:20 PM   #69
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you should get it in print
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Old 08-11-2004, 06:26 AM   #70
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The rule of Internet fan fiction:
Write anything lengthy enough (more than fifteen A4 pages), use rather good grammar and people will find you god. Applies in this case too.

If GK was ever published between covers as it is now, I wouldn't pay a dime for it. If you plead for an explanation, see few pages up.

GK was an excellent fanfic, but far from being actual novel material.
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Old 08-11-2004, 07:45 PM   #71
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You know Finn, I'm a little tired of your insults to tell you the truth. I've been rather tolerant of them through out this thread and have bit my tongue, but not anymore.

That last post was uncalled for and insulting.

I know it's not the greatest work of fiction ever. I never claimed it to be, I never promoted it, I just wrote it and put it out there. People read it and some of them liked it.

When people wish to compliment me, why do you feel compelled to jump in and insult it.

I'm glad you think it sucks! You've made your point! You don't need to keep repeating it.

Later.
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Old 08-11-2004, 07:55 PM   #72
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Lord Ex and IJ, thank you very much for your nice comments. I'm sorry for that last post but I had to get it off my chest.

If you want to know why I'm tired of his insults just read back in this thread.

I'm glad you liked Gypsy's Kiss. Some people wouldn't pay a dime for it, but some liked it. I'm glad you guys liked it.

thanks again,
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Old 08-12-2004, 01:24 AM   #73
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Just read gypsy's kiss and thought it was fab. It's great how some people post their stories for free.
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Old 08-12-2004, 05:04 AM   #74
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I make no apologies for this post.

Finn, I've really had enough of your attitude. No sooner are you a moderator again, it seems that you feel that you have some god given right to keep coming out with really sarcastic comments.

I too, have gotten fed up of your critizism of Monkey's story.

I have held back for too long because you are a moderator, but now I feel that enough is enough. I also feel that your last comment was insulting and I think Monkey deserves better than that. He is not only a great writer, but a wonderful person as well.

Finn, I really hope you're proud of yourself in upsetting one of my closest online friends.


Monkey, I was absolutely stunned by your latest story. You posssess a gift which so few have. I can read your stories, and I can picture everything in my head in perfect detail, even Indy himself.

I am not just saying this, but I consider you to be one of the greatest writers of Indy fan fiction, and indeed fan fiction that I have ever come across, and I'm not just saying this because of that very nice e-mail that you sent me. I also consider you to be up there with Max McCoy in the writing stakes (I hope you'll consider this a compliment as I consider McCoy's Indy books to be the best Indy stories that I have EVER read!)

You're the best, Monkey!
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Old 08-12-2004, 06:29 AM   #75
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Ouch. I'm sorry, Monkey man. I didn't mean to trash GK... I liked it, really (and now I'm ashamed for letting people understand I hated it). It was a great piece, I'm certain you gave it lot of time and devotion (and I sincerely admire that), I was just trying to comment those opinions who say it should be printed... because I can clearly see it's not that far yet (though most of the problems standing on the way are structural, in fact). Most of the people on this are way skilless writers than what you are.

And I guess one of the things that ticks me off is that half of the "feedback" given in the Internet is overly positive (while it should be just "positive") out of sheer politeness. I'm just trying to tell what I think (but obviously failed in that this time, badly).

I'll bend over now so you can kick me.
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