Spielberg hasn't lost it; he surrendered to Lucas

Grizzlor

Grizzlor

Well-known member
First, I really don't think Darabount/Spielberg's script would have been all that different from KOTCS. In fact, while I love Karen Allen, having her as the main co-star instead of Shia would not have been better. My issue with Lucas is that his unwillingness to compromise 10 years ago took away a real second life for Indy. We should have had Indy IV come out before The Phantom Menace, with an Indy V early this decade, and we could be talking about Indy VI right now. That if any is the grudge I hold on Lucas. I don't really blame him for the issues in the last couple years.

Should Lucas retire? Well, I am eagerly awaiting his Star Wars TV Series, to see if the magic is still there. As for the prequels, I was initially angry, but have since mellowed. I still can barely watch either Episode II or III because Hayden Christensen is such a horrible actor it pains me to watch.
 
J

Jones_Happens

New member
Grizzlor said:
First, I really don't think Darabount/Spielberg's script would have been all that different from KOTCS. In fact, while I love Karen Allen, having her as the main co-star instead of Shia would not have been better. My issue with Lucas is that his unwillingness to compromise 10 years ago took away a real second life for Indy. We should have had Indy IV come out before The Phantom Menace, with an Indy V early this decade, and we could be talking about Indy VI right now. That if any is the grudge I hold on Lucas. I don't really blame him for the issues in the last couple years.

Should Lucas retire? Well, I am eagerly awaiting his Star Wars TV Series, to see if the magic is still there. As for the prequels, I was initially angry, but have since mellowed. I still can barely watch either Episode II or III because Hayden Christensen is such a horrible actor it pains me to watch.
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Yeah, how is this guy still working in Hollywood! He is atrocious!
 
P

Peacock's-Eye

New member
I liked Hayden in "Shattered Glass", "Revenge of the Sith", "Factory Girl" and "J*mper". I think he has alot of untapped potential - but he's young.
 
The Man

The Man

Well-known member
Peacock's-Eye said:
I liked Hayden in "Shattered Glass", "Revenge of the Sith", "Factory Girl" and "J*mper". I think he has alot of untapped potential - but he's young.
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Agreed. He took such flak for Attack Of The Clones, a performance Lucas wanted, yet redeemed himself with a more adult, sympathetic Anakin in Revenge Of The Sith.
 
Crusade>Raiders

Crusade>Raiders

New member
LOL @ Hayden acting.

Hayden: Notice how I'm furrowing my brow, that means I'm acting right?

Ewan: Actually, I'm pretty sure me and Ian are the only decent acting around here; even Samuel L. Jackson sounded wooden with George Lucas' plot.

Hayden: Listen, I just went from being a powerful knight of justice to a douchebag who kills little children in 30 seconds, I'm under a lot of stress right now!

Padme: Ani, hold me like you did by the lake on Naboo.

Hayden: I love you more than love itself. Also love.

Padme: *dies*

Hayden: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
 
Vance

Vance

New member
Dovchenko said:
A question for the Lucas-Haters out there. Do you really wish he would give up and retire?
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I don't hate Lucas.. but, yes, I do wish he would retire and never make another movie or IP again.
 
A

AnImaginaryBoy

Active member
I don't hate George Lucas, although he has made a lot of decisions about the Indiana Jones and the Star Wars films I don't necessairily agree with. While I like Kingdom of the Crystal Skull and I think there's a lot of good stuff in it, I do feel that Steven's heart wasn't as into the script as some of his other films. Whether it's because he only liked David Koepp's screenplay rather loved it like he did with Frank Darabont, I guess we'll never know, but one of the things that I think is so fustrating with Kingdom of the Crystal Skull is that it's constantly hinting at untapped brilliance, but for whatever reason, it never goes to it, which is sort of rather sad, really. Still, I did like the film lots, so I suppose I'm an idiot.
 
DarthMickey

DarthMickey

New member
what they should have done was go back and ask(beg) Laurence Kasadan. He wrote Raiders of the lost ark and the Empire strikes back. And many more.Geez do you need anymore info than that. :gun:
 
MaxPhactor23

MaxPhactor23

New member
DarthMickey said:
what they should have done was go back and ask(beg) Laurence Kasadan. He wrote Raiders of the lost ark and the Empire strikes back. And many more.Geez do you need anymore info than that. :gun:
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You know, I was thinking this just the other day. The man is brilliant. I'd kill to have him back. He'd make everything George has written in the last decade look like grade school material.
 
T

Timmythekid

New member
CasualJeff said:
Lucas can't win. KotCS comes out, and people say "this movie sucks because A, B, and C! I bet the Darabont script never had that kind of crap! Lucas never should have rejected the Darabont script!"

And then the Darabont script is leaked and found to have some of the same goofy stuff as KotCS, and suddenly it's "Lucas sucks! The only reason Darabont's script sucked is because Lucas forced him to include A, B, and C!"
QUOTE]

QFT. This hand-wringing about Lucas having lost his mind and beating the rest of the creative team into submission with his giant neck fat until they finally, reluctantly caved has seriously got to stop sometime, doesn't it? Please? We've had close to 10 years of this crap now, give it a ****ing rest already. Yes, we know, you all hated the Star Wars prequels, and lets face it, whatever *****ing at George Childhood-Molester Lucas you're doing now is either because you felt Lucas betrayed you there, or, more likely, you've heard other people say they felt that way, and now as per the rules of teh interwebs, you have to scream "ME TOO!!!!!!!". The man simply hasn't made enough films outside of those to have earned that kind of ire in any other way. Steven Speilberg is a big boy, and doesn't need you trying to make up reasons that whatever faults you thought the film had, weren't at least equally of his doing. If you didn't like the film, fine, say so, but don't pretend that one of the most powerful directors modern cinema has seen was strongarmed into family-geared silliness, when the man himself has said it was part of his goal.
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Kingsley

Kingsley

Member
I just saw War of the Worlds for the second time, and I remembered it as one of the weakest Spielberg's recent films. But after rewatching it now... it's not that bad. In fact, it's better than Indy 4 :(

Kotcs lacks the playfulness Spielberg puts in all his movies, even the weak ones. Those little precious details, that flowing visual narrative, a distinctive rythm combining fast pace with meaningful pauses.
In Kotcs, Spielbergs work seems unfocused, tied, rushed. I don't know if I can blame Lucas. Spielberg is a grown man and has proved a long time ago that he knows what he does. But friendship is surely a place where you must let go your own wishes sometimes.
 
G

Gustav

New member
foreignerfred said:
I've read many threads here saying that Spielberg has lost that 80's action movie magic, and I don't think so. I think Darabont's script is what Spielberg intended to shoot, and it's not watered down, and no, it's not perfect.

People are getting offed constantly throughout, and most of it feels very adult. I think Spielberg's PASSION for Indy IV went into the creation of "City of the Gods"...I mean, he spent a year writing it with Darabont! When Lucas flatly said no to the script, he said no to Spielberg too, and Harrison for that matter (because he liked it as well).

I think at that moment, Steven realized it wouldn't pay to be passionate at this point in Lucas' career. You can tell everyone hates him, but they like some of his ideas. So, Steven knew that the only way they were actually going to get to FILM something was if it was what Lucas ALONE wanted, and so Harrison and Steven surrendered, compromised, and got to do Indy again.

"City of the Gods" is Lucas' plot points through Steven's (and Darabont's) eyes. What you see on the screen in KOTCS is more of Steven's ideas Lucas-i-fied.

Just my opinion.

and yes, I like KOTCS!
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I concur with most of what you say. But I think the decision to put in so much CG was made after the film began production. Hell, I bet Spielberg didn't even know about the CG prairie dog at the beginning until the premiere. And then one night Lucas was editing and after Indy gets out of the refrigerator, Lucas sees the perfect oppotunity to make it look like he is reacting to another CG prairie dog. WHY? Jesus christ, there were so many CG prairie dogs. I'm not fond of the idea, but it's almost like George Lucas intentionally tried to sabotage the film because he knows he ****ed up Star Wars.

And the monkeys.
 
G

Gustav

New member
Kingsley said:
I just saw War of the Worlds for the second time, and I remembered it as one of the weakest Spielberg's recent films. But after rewatching it now... it's not that bad. In fact, it's better than Indy 4 :(

Kotcs lacks the playfulness Spielberg puts in all his movies, even the weak ones. Those little precious details, that flowing visual narrative, a distinctive rythm combining fast pace with meaningful pauses.
In Kotcs, Spielbergs work seems unfocused, tied, rushed. I don't know if I can blame Lucas. Spielberg is a grown man and has proved a long time ago that he knows what he does. But friendship is surely a place where you must let go your own wishes sometimes.
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I liked War of the Worlds. I swear I think the reason people hated it so much was because Tom Cruise was getting manhandled by the tabloids at the time. Whenever I ask people what they didn't like about it, their biggest complaint is that the aliens were killed by bacteria and not humans. Maybe they don't realize that they have been manipulated by yellow journalism.
 
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