Cliffhangers - Republic Pictures & Other Saturday Matinee Serials

Stoo

Well-known member
Montana Smith said:
My list has been duly amended. Was Spy Smasher the serial that originally had the flying wing and zeppellin? And if Zorro's Black Whip and Ghost of Zorro are shots in the dark, are there two other firm recommendations to replace them with?
I can't remember if "Spy Smasher" has a zeppelin but it definitely has a flying wing (and a submarine). The only thing that bugs me about it is that Spy Smasher wears a cape.

Another good one is, "Secret Service in Darkest Africa" a.k.a. "Manhunt in the African Jungle" (though its setting NEVER even closely resembles Africa in anyway whatsoever). I think this one has been pegged as having the most fist fights in any serial. There are about 2 or 3 every chapter.

WARNING: "Tiger Woman" uses footage from "Jungle Girl".
AndyLGR said:
Great thread.
Thanks for chipping in, Andy, and it would be even greater if other people joined the conversation. I find it rather disappointing that most Indy fans aren't interested in the old cliffhangers. Tales filled with traps, rope swings, vine swings, caves, secret passages, fist fights, horse chases, car chases, motorboat chases, amphibious planes, submarines, men in fedoras, etc.
AndyLGR said:
You should be commission for his ebay sales Montana as some of my choices have been inspried by you.
Hey, man, a chunk of Smiffy's commission belongs in MY pocket!:p
 

AndyLGR

Active member
Montana Smith said:
I can't vouch for that seller, but his feedback does look excellent. I think I'll go ahead and order my six.

This thread could become the pulp cliffhanger version of a book club - watch them and share your views!

:hat:
I figured that they were worth a go at £15 for 6. As long as they are watchable and not too dark or washed out then they should be ok.

And yes this thread would be perfect for reviews of them too.

Stoo said:
Thanks for chipping in, Andy, and it would be even greater if other people joined the conversation. I find it rather disappointing that most Indy fans aren't interested in the old cliffhangers. Tales filled with traps, rope swings, vine swings, caves, secret passages, fist fights, horse chases, car chases, motorboat chases, amphibious planes, submarines, men in fedoras, etc.

Throw in old dark mansions, creepy island settings, some fog and I’m a happy camper. The sets may be cheap and cheerful but theres something very atmospheric about the confines of the old studio sets they used for many of the b&w serials and movies.

Stoo said:
Hey, man, a chunk of Smiffy's commission belongs in MY pocket!:p
Sorry, I thought Montana posted the list :hat:
 

Stoo

Well-known member
AndyLGR said:
Sorry, I thought Montana posted the list :hat:
Montana did post the UK seller's list but his inspiration stems from my creation of this thread.:p:)

In regards to that list: The seller could have organized it a little better, either by genre or, at least, alphabetically! What is surprising is that it lists the 1914 version of "Perils of Pauline". I was under the impression that prints for several chapters were lost for all time and that the complete series didn't exist anymore. Intriguing...
 

Montana Smith

Active member
Stoo said:
Montana did post the UK seller's list but his inspiration stems from my creation of this thread.:p:)

You're definitely the inspiration, Stewie! :hat:

Stoo said:
In regards to that list: The seller could have organized it a little better, either by genre or, at least, alphabetically! What is surprising is that it lists the 1914 version of "Perils of Pauline". I was under the impression that prints for several chapters were lost for all time and that the complete series didn't exist anymore. Intriguing...

The seller has that listed separately, with a photo of the DVD cover:

PerilsofPauline1914.jpg
 

Stoo

Well-known member
Montana Smith said:
This thread could become the pulp cliffhanger version of a book club - watch them and share your views!
That was part of this thread's intent!;)
Montana Smiffy said:
The seller has that listed separately, with a photo of the DVD cover:
Hmm, the DVD box says 20 chapters when everything I've ever read about the original "Perils of Pauline" says that only 9 chapters survived. Is this a case of false advertising or does the UK seller have something that no known film archive has?:confused:
 

Montana Smith

Active member
Stoo said:
Hmm, the DVD box says 20 chapters when everything I've ever read about the original "Perils of Pauline" says that only 9 chapters survived. Is this a case of false advertising or does the UK seller have something that no known film archive has?:confused:

I looked at every entry in his feedback for sales of the 1914 version, and all the buyers were happy. I just sent him an email asking for clarification.
 

Stoo

Well-known member
Me said:
Hmm, the DVD box says 20 chapters when everything I've ever read about the original "Perils of Pauline" says that only 9 chapters survived. Is this a case of false advertising or does the UK seller have something that no known film archive has?:confused:
Another fishy clue is that the DVD case reads:

""Pauline (played by Pearl White) is rich and her guardian is in control of her fortune. Once he passes away, villain Koerner (Paul Panzer) takes over the fortune until Pauline marries the willing Harry (Crane Wilbur). Koerner comes up with the scheme to bump off Pauline in order to control the fortune indefinitely, and, Pauline must survive a soaring air-balloon and a house fire in just the first of twenty chapters! Keep an eye out for Sidney Blackmer in one of his earliest roles. This silent matinee serial is the original - make no mistake."

Raymond Owen was the villain's name in the original, 20-chapter version. The name was changed to Koerner when the series was edited down to 9 chapters in 1916.

Smells like false advertising to me. *If* the seller has the full serial, then he/they have a long-sought-after piece of film history!:eek:

P.S. Just saw your post, Smiffy. Anxious to hear the seller's reply!
 

Montana Smith

Active member
Stoo said:
Another fishy clue is that the DVD case reads:

""Pauline (played by Pearl White) is rich and her guardian is in control of her fortune. Once he passes away, villain Koerner (Paul Panzer) takes over the fortune until Pauline marries the willing Harry (Crane Wilbur). Koerner comes up with the scheme to bump off Pauline in order to control the fortune indefinitely, and, Pauline must survive a soaring air-balloon and a house fire in just the first of twenty chapters! Keep an eye out for Sidney Blackmer in one of his earliest roles. This silent matinee serial is the original - make no mistake."

Raymond Owen was the villain's name in the original, 20-chapter version. The name was changed to Koerner when the series was edited down to 9 chapters in 1916.

Smells like false advertising to me. *If* the seller has the full serial, then he/they have a long-sought-after piece of film history!:eek:

P.S. Just saw your post, Smiffy. Anxious to hear the seller's reply!

Curiouser and curiouser. Especially since the buyers were paying £4.99 for this one, presumably expecting 20 chapters, yet leaving very positive feedback. Maybe this is the holy grail? :confused:

There's no reply yet.
 

Stoo

Well-known member
Montana Smith said:
Maybe this is the holy grail? :confused:
Either way, it's something that fits with Moedred's thread: Lost films and footage.

One of the chapters of "Perils of Pauline" featured her being chased down the slope of a mountain by a rolling boulder and I want to know if this guy has it.

As an interesting side note, in one of the Rob MacGregor novels, Indy is watching this serial at the cinema.(y) ("Genesis Deluge", perhaps? I can't remember.)
 

Stephen Jared

New member
http://www.theraider.net/features/articles/saturday_serials.php

I wrote an article on the serials for TheRaider back in '06 -- can't believe 5 years have gone by! Anyway, if anyone hasn't read it, you might check it out.

I'd offer new comments here but everything I can say about serials is in the article. Except! at the time I hadn't seen Buck Rogers. I like Flash Gordon. Buck Rogers is nowhere near as good as Flash Gordon, so if you don't like Flash Gordon, you'll hate Buck Rogers. Wish it wasn't the case. And of course, that's just my opinion.

I'm glad they're being discussed. Thanks, Stoo!
 

Montana Smith

Active member
Stoo said:
One of the chapters of "Perils of Pauline" featured her being chased down the slope of a mountain by a rolling boulder and I want to know if this guy has it.

As an interesting side note, in one of the Rob MacGregor novels, Indy is watching this serial at the cinema.(y) ("Genesis Deluge", perhaps? I can't remember.)

There's no reply yet from the seller, but the DVDs have turned up. Checked each one briefly to make sure they were all present and correct.

Looking forward to working my way through them, but in the meantime I got stuck into The Clone Wars series, which incidentally has each episode begin with a Pathé news style of narration.

Stephen Jared said:
I wrote an article on the serials for TheRaider back in '06 -- can't believe 5 years have gone by! Anyway, if anyone hasn't read it, you might check it out.

That was a good read. Don't go too far away, Stephen, I'm sure your experitise is going to be needed sooner or later!

:hat:
 

AndyLGR

Active member
Montana Smith said:
There's no reply yet from the seller, but the DVDs have turned up. Checked each one briefly to make sure they were all present and correct.

Mine arrived this morning, really looking forward to watching them.

Montana Smith said:
The Clone Wars series, which incidentally has each episode begin with a Pathé news style of narration.
That narration always puts me in mind of the news reels on Starship Troopers.
 

Stoo

Well-known member
Stephen Jared said:
I'd offer new comments here but everything I can say about serials is in the article. Except! at the time I hadn't seen Buck Rogers. I like Flash Gordon. Buck Rogers is nowhere near as good as Flash Gordon, so if you don't like Flash Gordon, you'll hate Buck Rogers. Wish it wasn't the case. And of course, that's just my opinion.

I'm glad they're being discussed. Thanks, Stoo!
Hello, Stephen, my friend. I had read your article before but it was wise to post a link in this thread. After reading it again, I noticed that you mention the rolling boulder in "Perils of Pauline". You've seen that chapter?

This comment is also a very good observation:
"Fans were left with the impression that the absolute worst could happen and yet the fight would go on. The hero would return. Death was not really death but instead a beginning. It would seem unlikely to be just coincidence that movie serials were at their peek of popularity when millions of children were losing their fathers to war."

Like Montana said, please don't disappear from this conversation!:hat:
Montana Smiff said:
There's no reply yet from the seller, but the DVDs have turned up. Checked each one briefly to make sure they were all present and correct.

Looking forward to working my way through them, but in the meantime I got stuck into The Clone Wars series, which incidentally has each episode begin with a Pathé news style of narration.
I'm looking forward to you working your way through them as well. Wait until you see the ending of "Jungle Girl" #1! Also, two of the most creative solutions to a cliffhanger can be found in "Spy Smasher" and in one of the Zorro serials. Creative because they aren't the typical explanations of escaping danger.

As for the Pathé news reel-type openings for "Clone Wars", I know.;)

AndyLGR said:
Mine arrived this morning, really looking forward to watching them.
Great news, Andy! Looking forward to your reviews.
 

Montana Smith

Active member
Stoo said:
Hello, Stephen, my friend. I had read your article before but it was wise to post a link in this thread. After reading it again, I noticed that you mention the rolling boulder in "Perils of Pauline". You've seen that chapter?

This comment is also a very good observation:
"Fans were left with the impression that the absolute worst could happen and yet the fight would go on. The hero would return. Death was not really death but instead a beginning. It would seem unlikely to be just coincidence that movie serials were at their peek of popularity when millions of children were losing their fathers to war."

That is quite a profound thought, that the serial hero was a propaganda tool.

Stoo said:
I'm looking forward to you working your way through them as well. Wait until you see the ending of "Jungle Girl" #1! Also, two of the most creative solutions to a cliffhanger can be found in "Spy Smasher" and in one of the Zorro serials. Creative because they aren't the typical explanations of escaping danger.

Zorro Rides Again (1937)

The Wild West down Mexico way in 1937. It’s a strange mix, the kind of anachronism that didn’t seem to matter, because the creators wanted the best of both worlds. I thought this worked best when Zorro was interacting with ‘30s technology – aeroplanes, trucks, and the scenes in the city. When things reverted to the older western genre it became a little repetitive with the bad guys galloping back and forth to the next trap setting.

At the beginning of the first episode the characters are shown to the audience, and it’s the first shot of Zorro in his ‘adventure’ gear. I found that quite a magical moment, since it took me back to the first time I must have seen that image when these serials were playing on television. And being a Bat-fan I couldn’t help thinking that the masked and whip-swinging Zorro was a direct prototype for Bruce Wayne’s alter-ego, who would appear a couple of years later.

Detective_Comics_27.jpg


The 'Fox' even has his own ‘batcave’ accessed from a secret door behind the painting of his grandfather in the living room, and from which he exits through a cave on his equine batmobile, El Rey! The difference in their character motivations is that James Vega was a vigilante dedicated to protecting his own business, the California-Yucatan Railroad. When that task is complete he willingly unmasks and the serial is ended.

I noticed that on a few occasions he had to leave his bullwhip behind, as it was either wrapped around the object he’d swung on, or around a bad guy’s legs. For this Zorro the whip was a tool to be used maybe only once, not to be reclaimed as Indy would later do. This is symbolic of the ‘for the moment’ sensation that this serial has: it’s all about the set-up and the action, and it’s no good thinking too deeply about coincidences (such as turning on the radio at the exact moment that the arch-villain is speaking to El Lobo).

Some of the cliffhangers were also re-edited or reshot for the beginning of the following epsiode, such as Zorro’s escape from being hit by the locomotive, or from being shot in the face before Diego comes to his rescue. The original sequences leave you seeing no possibility of escape, whereas the second retelling either plays with time or even removes the gunshot that would have killed him. It was a cheat, but audiences must have been happy with the ruse.

There was a scene that I found reminiscent of TLC, when Young Indy is confronted by the Sheriff and Fedora, and forced to hand over the Cross. Zorro is confronted by El Lobo and a (bogus) policeman, and forced to hand over a document.

And, of course, I was looking forward to the leap from the horse onto the truck!
 
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Attila the Professor

Moderator
Staff member
Montana Smith said:
That is quite a profound thought, that the serial hero was a propaganda tool.

I interpreted the statement differently, that the fact of the war and the grave sense of doubt it instilled accounts for why the serials struck a chord.
 

Montana Smith

Active member
Attila the Professor said:
I interpreted the statement differently, that the fact of the war and the grave sense of doubt it instilled accounts for why the serials struck a chord.

Quite possibly. It made me think of those 'Keep calm and carry on' posters during the war. The idea of never giving up, no matter how bad things might look. I was thinking in terms of the serial hero as the model for a character such as Captain America, who (literally) took the fight to Hitler.


It seemed right to continue with the Zorro theme, so I've begun watching Zorro's Fighting Legion (1939).

First impressions:

I’ve only watched two and bit episodes, but there might be a lot to say about this one, as there appears to be more in it than Zorro Rides Again.

Where James Vega may have been a counterfeit in ZRA, Diego Vega is the real McCoy in Zorro’s Fighting Legion. There’s much better whip work, and being set in 1824 gives the added dimension of swordfights.

The choreography is fantastic, with fast and intricate fight scenes, with Zorro battling simultaneously with sword and bullwhip – even whipping a gun from another bad guy’s hand during a fight (very Raiders of the Lost Ark!)

One of the reviews of ZRA commented on the awkwardness of James Vega wearing his pistols butt-forward, and drawing them with a twisted wrist action (right hand, right pistol, left hand, left pistol). In the later serial the reasoning behind it becomes apparent.

Zorro is a horseman, and it’s tradition for a right-handed, sword-wielding cavalryman to wear his sword on the left and his pistol on the right. The stronger right hand draws the sword from the left, and the weaker left hand draws the pistol from a rear-facing holster on the right hip. In Zorro’s Fighting Legion he still wears twin holsters, but favours his left hand to draw the pistol from the right holster, even when his sword isn’t drawn. Without a sword, James Vega of ZRA doesn’t have a need for the tradition, and neglects to cross-draw.

With the mention of “The Golden Idol of the Yaqui” in the first episode I was thinking in terms of the Golden Idol of Raiders, and didn’t expect the “God of Gold”, Don Del Oro, to be a mysterious man in armour residing in a Temple of Doom style cavern, complete with a flame-pit for disposing of prisoners! But like the 1930s technology of ZRA, this adds a hook that turns the story into something more than just a western.

The shadows, cast by the torchlight, of the hat-wearing men on the back wall of “the meeting place” (The Mission) reminded me of the times when Indy appears as an iconic fedora-wearing shadow. And like Indy, Zorro is much more practical concerning the use of the whip. When he’s able to retrieve it, he does so.

Finally, the horse jumping the canyon looked like a real stunt. A death-defying stunt at that!
 

Montana Smith

Active member
Zorro's Fighting Legion continued...

Chapter 4: The Bridge of Peril is an earlier rendition of the rope bridge in Temple of Doom. Zorro's on the bridge when it's cut, and he all but slams into the rock face clinging to the bridge.

The standout scene so far, however, is another version of the 'Stagecoach stunt' by Yakima Canutt, which he'd also performed for John Ford that same year.

I made a series of screen grabs to show the stunt in action.

Zorro jumps from a horse onto the lead horses, drops down and is dragged along under the shaft. There's a cut here and it looks like Canutt is replaced by a dummy, before he's seen sliding under the coach and then climbing up the back of it. As in Raiders the driver is overpowered and thrown out, but in the serial the stun continues as Zorro loses the reins and is forced to jump onto the horse to control them before the coach crashes.

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Stephen Jared

New member
Thanks for the compliments on the article!

Stoo, I am having a hard time recalling whether or not I read of the rolling boulder bit in Perils of Pauline or actually watched it. I did a lot of research on that article and watched a lot of serials. I must give a hat tip to Eddie Brandt's Saturday Matinee video store in North Hollywood as they carried many serials, some of which were not officially released.

My mention of the war having an effect on the popularity of serials was meant to address the serious fears on the part of boys and girls who had fathers, uncles, older brothers serving in the war. I didn't mean that the serial hero had been a propaganda tool. However, that doesn't mean Montana is wrong. I didn't really consider the motivations of the studios beyond their desire to cash in on a popular trend. Maybe they were thinking of them as good propaganda. I really don't know.

One side note as to this issue you might find interesting if you're not already aware: the studios/moguls (although maybe not all of them) were at first reluctant to make any sort of propaganda films. American politicians at the time were asking if Hollywood could help their efforts by demonizing their enemies in movies. The moguls didn't want to do it even though they were aware of some of the atrocities being committed. They were afraid of the loss in profits from those countries. I'm sure they felt they were simple businessmen who had shareholders holding them accountable. The war wasn't their business, blah, blah, blah .. Plus, the Hollywood community had a huge percentage of European immigrants, much more so than today. Many of these immigrants I'd imagine were angry with what was going on overseas but didn't want their own countrymen demonized. So it was a tough decision for them to add propagandist elements to Hollywood films -- until they tried it. Big money came rolling in from American moviegoers and only then did they feel much more comfortable adding propagandist elements to films.

Those screenshots are amazing. Thanks for posting those!

Since there's a lot of talk of Zorro, let me encourage anyone who hasn't seen them to check out Douglas Fairbanks' two Zorro silent films. They're amazing. Also, Isabelle Allende wrote a really good novel on Zorro's early life. Might check that out.
 

Stoo

Well-known member
Montana Smith said:
When things reverted to the older western genre it became a little repetitive with the bad guys galloping back and forth to the next trap setting.
Some aspects do indeed become repetitive when watching all the chapters of any serial in a row. (Such is definitely the case with "Perils of Nyoka".) I'm enjoying your reviews so keep them coming!:)
Montana Smith said:
Some of the cliffhangers were also re-edited or reshot for the beginning of the following epsiode, such as Zorro’s escape from being hit by the locomotive, or from being shot in the face before Diego comes to his rescue. The original sequences leave you seeing no possibility of escape, whereas the second retelling either plays with time or even removes the gunshot that would have killed him. It was a cheat, but audiences must have been happy with the ruse.
Those types of cheats are the standard solutions and watching them back-to-back on VHS or DVD makes them all the more glaringly obvious. It's possible that some audience members who saw the chapters a week apart might not have recalled, shot-for-shot, exactly how the previous part ended.

That said, one of the Zorro cliffhangers has a brilliant solution that involves no action at all. It's pure genius. Did you know which one I'm referring to, Smiffy?
Attila the Professor said:
I interpreted the statement differently, that the fact of the war and the grave sense of doubt it instilled accounts for why the serials struck a chord.
That's sort of my intepretation as well. The fact that the hero always returned could have given young kids hope that their fathers would survive the war and come home safely.

P.S. @Stephen: I just saw your lastest post. Re: Eddie Brant's video store, I remember we talked about it in the "Secret of the Incas" thread. That's where you got a copy of the Cooper/Schoedsack version of "The Four Feathers"! (I'm still jealous!:p)
 
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Montana Smith

Active member
Stephen Jared said:
One side note as to this issue you might find interesting if you're not already aware: the studios/moguls (although maybe not all of them) were at first reluctant to make any sort of propaganda films. American politicians at the time were asking if Hollywood could help their efforts by demonizing their enemies in movies. The moguls didn't want to do it even though they were aware of some of the atrocities being committed. They were afraid of the loss in profits from those countries. I'm sure they felt they were simple businessmen who had shareholders holding them accountable. The war wasn't their business, blah, blah, blah .. Plus, the Hollywood community had a huge percentage of European immigrants, much more so than today. Many of these immigrants I'd imagine were angry with what was going on overseas but didn't want their own countrymen demonized. So it was a tough decision for them to add propagandist elements to Hollywood films -- until they tried it. Big money came rolling in from American moviegoers and only then did they feel much more comfortable adding propagandist elements to films.

Interesting points, Stephen.

I think Walt Disney was at one time keeping close to the Nazi Party, before making his anti-Nazi cartoons.

Stephen Jared said:
Those screenshots are amazing. Thanks for posting those!

I couldn't find the pictures I wanted on the net, so I did them myself. It was fun to do, breaking down the action into stills. Since Stoo did his amazing ROTLA opening made from clips from the serials, I was thinking it would be interesting to do the same with stills: comparing an image from an Indy movie with the possible original source.

Stephen Jared said:
Since there's a lot of talk of Zorro, let me encourage anyone who hasn't seen them to check out Douglas Fairbanks' two Zorro silent films. They're amazing. Also, Isabelle Allende wrote a really good novel on Zorro's early life. Might check that out.

The films do look like they're well worth checking out. I was reading about them earlier while finding out the history of the character.

Did Douglas Fairbanks wear a gunbelt in those movies? I couldn't see that he did from any stills. The next Zorro-inspired film appears to be The Bold Caballero (1936), before the Zorro Rides Again serial in 1937, with the butt-forward pistols.

Wikipedia shows this,

Capistrano2.jpg


as the first appearance of the character in print, in 1919.

Stoo said:
Some aspects do indeed become repetitive when watching all the chapters of any serial in a row. (Such is definitely the case with "Perils of Nyoka".) I'm enjoying your reviews so keep them coming!:)

I watched the first episode of Jungle Girl, so that one'll be next. (Spotted one glaring mistake and one obvious Indyism!)

Stoo said:
Those types of cheats are the standard solutions and watching them back-to-back on VHS or DVD makes them all the more glaringly obvious. It's possible that some audience members who saw the chapters a week apart might not have recalled, shot-for-shot, exactly how the previous part ended.

That said, one of the Zorro cliffhangers has a brilliant solution that involves no action at all. It's pure genius. Did you know which one I'm referring to, Smiffy?

Would that be the mirror in Fighting Legion? That was pretty nifty!
 
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