foreignerfred
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I wonder if Darabont's script is different enough from KOTCS to be reworked and used as a basis for Indy 5. It's hard not to be at least a LITTLE curious about a script that garnered such praise from Steven Spielberg.
jasperjones said:Still I thought a lot of the dialogue was great and up there with the other movies and I'm sorry, but you completely lost me at WE ARE GOING TO DIE.
That's one of my fave Indy lines and I love Ford's delivery. Guess there's no accounting for taste.
|ZiR| said:You beat me to it. Thank you.
One of the most memorable lines in TOD. How can you not like that?
Crusade>Raiders said:Next problem: The Dialog. I honestly can't recall the last time I saw a movie with so many examples of completely unnatural and out-of-character dialog. I completely agree with the people who say that Harrison Ford really showed up for this movie, ready to play Indy again. The problem is that when he showed up he was handed a script by someone who didn't know how to write Indy ... or Marion ... or meaningful dialog for anyone else really.
Almost more than anything else, this weakness pulled me right out of the movie several times. When speaking to Jim Broadbent at his home, Indy says, "I never should have doubted you my friend". The addition of "my friend" on the end of that statement just screamed "I'm reading a line". Take off those two words and it would have been fine. Leave them in and you're suddenly forced to remember that you're watching a movie of people saying stuff that was written for them beforehand.
Another example. When Indy first finds the crystal skull in the tomb of the conquistador he looks at it and says, "un...believable". You can almost hear "wait for it" in the pregnant space that is unnaturally inserted into the word. It slapped me in the face and took me out of the movie again.
But the thing is, there is another problematic line just seconds earlier when he he looks in the body wrapping bag, discovers it's the conquistador and says, "It's him. It's (insert name I forget) himself." The inclusion of "himself" seems unnecessary and incredibly unnatural. Now, it's difficult to say if this is entirely the script's fault or Ford's reading of the line as well, but it is certainly Spielberg's fault for not getting another take. Ultimately, I suspect all three are at fault.
Another problem is with the pacing of the dialog. There is more than once that someone unnaturally pauses their dialog to allow for some visual cue to catch up with them.
Two examples off the top of my head are very close together in the Restaurant Exposition scene which leads into the Motorcycle Chase scene. First Indy points out some Russian agents to Mutt in the Restaurant, the agents come over, say something threatening, Mutt pulls his switchblade, and Indy says, "Nice try kid, but I think you just brought a knife to a gun fight". There's nothing wrong with the line itself. The problem is that it actually goes, "Nice try kid, but I think you just brought a knife ...." (Indy looks up at agents, camera switches to agents with hands under coats, agents show guns) "... to a gun fight." The pause is so forced and unnecessary that it's hard to believe it got past Spielberg during the initial shooting, much less during the editing process.
Then, just a few minutes later, the same type of thing happens again. When the motorcycle chase goes through the library and Mutt and Indy fall and slide along the floor, a student asks Indy a question as he's climbing back onto the bike. He answers and then says, "If you want to be a good archaeologist, you need to get out of the library." Except it actually goes, "If you want to be a good archaeologist ...." (Indy a Mutt ride out of camera, camera angle changes, Mutt and Indy ride into camera as the drive away) ".... you need to get out of the library." It's ridiculous. Nobody does that. Having people interrupt their lines between camera setups just screams "fake" and your suspension-of-disbelief is shattered.
torao said:Let's remember that this is a thread about Frank Darabont's draft for IndyIV and not primarily about the weak spots of Koepp's writing or other problems the film seems to have.
Agent Z said:At the end of the jungle chase, Mutt falls back in the duck with Indy and says "Whoah!", catching his breath. Indy, amused by Mutt's reaction, affectionately, like a father admiring his son's enthusiasm, responds back with a "Whoah!" of his own.
Now, go watch Darabont's The Mist. The exact same "Whoah!" exchange takes place in that film between the father and the son.
Mutt didn't come from the Darabont draft. It had the Skull, the ants, and the waterfall, though. Similar kind of ending, if memory serves, with the Aliens, but Jones says he's made his choice, and that he's gotten the greatest fortune and glory in getting Marion's hand back from her husband, who - in the least surprising development in the screenplay - is a Belloq. I haven't read the thing in so long that it's not really fair, but IIRC there's no wedding, but it's implied. The big thing missing is the biplane sequence, which would have killed, though would have been hella chromakeyed up. And Darabont's snake bit (Indy was over his fear, until later in the film - and this is justified by the skull making all the animal and insect life bigger - a giant snake swallows him whole and Indy cuts his way out) is way better, and his cold open plays stronger, and I don't think it has the atomic village stuff, it does have him riding out in a refridgerator. The Mac character is there, but he's actually Russian, and he doesn't get chumped by being too stupid to stand up and walk out.
torao said:lol
Nothing on this one but a few other alleged ingredients of Darabont's script via one of Dellamorte's (writes for collider.com/occasionally for chud) posts in an IndyIV related thread over at chud:
'...but Jones says he's made his choice, and that he's gotten the greatest fortune and glory in getting Marion's hand back from her husband, who - in the least surprising development in the screenplay - is a Belloq.
sandiegojones said:Why does everyone think this script is going to be so great? I mean, Shawshank and Green Mile were good, but they were adapted from good Stephen King stories.
The only thing he came up with on his own I think was THE MAJESTIC and is was so so at best. Who's to say the good parts of his script weren't from the the 10 prior writers? Everyone is down on Koepp and praising Darabont with nothing to base it on. Plus, in all of the prior discussions about it I saw most agreed that neo-Nazi's would have been silly. (I could actually see them as a foil for Mutt since He's a neo-Indy).
The film was shot and edited the way Spielberg and Co. wanted. If you believe the acting or directing was flat (which I do not) then why would a different script change things?
While in no way am I a Frank Darabont flag-waver, I will say that all of my favourite episodes of Young Indy were written by him.sandiegojones said:Why does everyone think this script is going to be so great? I mean, Shawshank and Green Mile were good, but they were adapted from good Stephen King stories.
The only thing he came up with on his own I think was THE MAJESTIC and is was so so at best. Who's to say the good parts of his script weren't from the the 10 prior writers? Everyone is down on Koepp and praising Darabont with nothing to base it on.
For those looking for Darabont's draft to be some kind of lost gem, it doesn't sound all that much different. In fact, it sounds just as over-the-top.Dellamorte of CHUD/Collider said:Mutt didn't come from the Darabont draft. It had the Skull, the ants, and the waterfall, though. Similar kind of ending, if memory serves, with the Aliens, but Jones says he's made his choice, and that he's gotten the greatest fortune and glory in getting Marion's hand back from her husband, who - in the least surprising development in the screenplay - is a Belloq. I haven't read the thing in so long that it's not really fair, but IIRC there's no wedding, but it's implied. The big thing missing is the biplane sequence, which would have killed, though would have been hella chromakeyed up. And Darabont's snake bit (Indy was over his fear, until later in the film - and this is justified by the skull making all the animal and insect life bigger - a giant snake swallows him whole and Indy cuts his way out) is way better, and his cold open plays stronger, and I don't think it has the atomic village stuff, it does have him riding out in a refridgerator. The Mac character is there, but he's actually Russian, and he doesn't get chumped by being too stupid to stand up and walk out.