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Old 04-20-2011, 11:24 AM   #126
Stoo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharkey
yup, memories can be fake. Just not yours. The doubters are open to the idea they are wrong but you guys aren't.

Evidence. Yeah evidence would be great. Let's see some.
Sharkmeister, before you snap your jaws, provide evidence that it was NEVER filmed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indy's brother
Just because it was a called a blooper reel by one person doesn't mean that it doesn't have other stuff.
Fair enough because it does have other stuff besides bloopers (the Streisand whipping clip + Harrison/Spielberg acting out the 'nocturnal activities' scene in "Doom"). That said (as far as I'm aware), other stuff in the Amblin blooper/gag reel also includes NON-Indy stuff. The thing isn't exclusively related to Indy. (See this thread: Blooper reels.)
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Originally Posted by Indy's brother
Also it may be relevant because those guys saw that reel in 2004, not back in the 80's.
True. Who knows what Eric & Chris were shown privately. You should ask them, Indy's bro'! Good luck!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Exulted Unicorn
I've been re-reading my Complete Making of Indiana Jones again. I'm afraid to say that the scene in question was never filmed, just storyboarded.
There is *1* production sketch in the book. Where are the storyboards? (Storyboards & production sketches are different things.) You say that the egg scene was never filmed. How do you know for sure?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Exulted Unicorn
The reason given was that the Rube Goldberg-esque method was too difficult to film in one take.
Unicorn, where did you read this? Please specify the page #.
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Originally Posted by Exulted Unicorn
Though for some reason, there's shots of the pilot handing the co-pilot the pistol,...
Part of the proof, dude...
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:21 PM   #127
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Proof positive.

What does J.W. Rinzler say?

Quote:
Glimpses of scenes that never were from The Temple of Doom.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JuniorJones
Photobucket Pictures, Images and Photos
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:38 PM   #128
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This is fun. I like it. Time to stir the pot!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt deMille
That hasn't changed, Stoo. I'd still like proof. But proof is more than a Google search. Proof requires due-diligence, time, corroboration and confirmation. I was willing to give that time. Others weren't.

My accepting of the quick-answer from the con-side wouldn't be any more reasonable than you accepting the pro-UFO take from a few internet links. You clearly won't accept that. Why should I settle for anything less?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt deMille
That is indeed a better way to say it. "Absence of evidence is not proof of absence". I like that much better. Agreed.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt deMille
Will do. But that may take a long time. After all, we're talking about looking through a lot of accounts. I don't want to just take the top Google searches and be done with it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt deMille
For Stoo . . . Bottom line: Years of counseling with a dozen doctors only ended with the same, unanimous conclusion: This isn't a fantasy, I'm not making it up, my story comes from memory, the emotional responses to the trauma are real, and certainly the exploding lights and computers are real too.


Now...the periscope scene, the ToD whipping*, the ellusive egg, the artifacts pulled from the Peruvian Temple...

Someone get us screenshots.

ToD whipping is somewhere here and I'm too lazy to link it, so consider that 1 outta 4. Get cracking treasure hunters.
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:50 PM   #129
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Thumbs down Loser!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharkey
What does J.W. Rinzler say?

Quote:
Glimpses of scenes that never were from The Temple of Doom.
Sharkey, you are behaving like a loser. (You must be egging me on to post the proof. Don't worry, you'll get it...in good time...)

The Rube-Goldberg-type scene was never in "Doom" but that doesn't discount people seeing the egg drop into Indy's hand.

Rinzler says a hell of a lot more than that. Can you read? PLEASE, TRY AGAIN!
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Old 04-20-2011, 01:15 PM   #130
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I'm totally egging you on to post proof Mr deMille!

Your talent for coloring and names doesn't make you right.

If I have to assume anything its that Rinzler would have mentioned any scene involving an egg when he put together the making of book and these promo articles.

He made mention of Sallah's execution, Belloq not getting away with the idol but nothing about an egg. What you see is what you get and if you have anything showing the opposite I suggest you hatch it before it spoils.

But you don't do you?
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Old 04-20-2011, 01:17 PM   #131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stoo
Maybe it's because people saw it? What purpose would it serve for people to invent this memory (at different times on different forums)? Like JuniorJones said above in this thread, "These people have real memories, how can they not be true."

I feel there maybe a subtext you missed to my post...
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Old 04-20-2011, 01:58 PM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pale Horse
This is fun. I like it. Time to stir the pot!

I like the fact that you're egging them on.

From sitting on the fence on this one, I'm actually falling for the jaw-jaw of Sharkey. While Stewie has a high reputation for Indy accuracy and intuition, this may be one claim too far. That giant chicken may have messed with quite a few memories over the years.

Knowledge of the egg reality may be hard to come by, so this will probably have to reside in the pile marked, 'Possible due to lack of hard evidence to the contrary'. And I don't think we can trust the beards here, as they both have selective memories prone to revisionism.
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Old 04-20-2011, 01:59 PM   #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pale Horse
Now...the periscope scene, the ToD whipping*, the ellusive egg, the artifacts pulled from the Peruvian Temple...

Someone get us screenshots.
Pale, you do realize that you're asking for too much, too early, don't you?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pale Horse
ToD whipping is somewhere here and I'm too lazy to link it, so consider that 1 outta 4. Get cracking treasure hunters.
Are you serious? The whipping scene can be EASILY be found here: Blooper reels. Post #40. I also posted an image FROM THE FILM where Indy can be see lashed to the pericsope in "Raiders" (post #7): The Submarine: U-26 Wurrfler

So that's 2 out of 4. (The bit about extra Peruvian artifacts, I have no clue.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharkey
If I have to assume anything its that Rinzler would have mentioned any scene involving an egg when he put together the making of book and these promo articles.
Rinzler did mention it so you either have a poor memory or you don't know how to read. Go CLUCK yourself, Sharkey-boy!
Quote:
Originally Posted by JuniorJones
I feel there maybe a subtext you missed to my post...
Perhaps, JJ...Are you an egg-doubter, too, then?

The doubters DEMAND proof before they are willing to believe. Can you folks at least wait until JayDee receives his DVD? Really, you guys cannot wait?...or do you require IMMEDIATE INTRANETSES gratification?
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Old 04-20-2011, 02:14 PM   #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pale Horse
Now...the periscope scene, the ToD whipping*, the ellusive egg, the artifacts pulled from the Peruvian Temple...

Someone get us screenshots.

Let's add the US burning LOGO to this.
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Old 04-20-2011, 02:56 PM   #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
Sorry, Wilhelm, but NO. You're suggesting that all the separate witnesses collectively transplanted a scene from "The Goonies" into their earliest memories of "Temple of Doom"? Don't think so...

Well, it's no so strange. In fact I always thought that the Rube Goldberg egg scene was later re-used in "The Goonies":

http://www.imagebam.com/image/16d37a57095575

http://www.imagebam.com/image/8bbb1f57095613

Obviously is the same idea. Maybe people remembered seeing in cinemas a complicated scene with an egg, and mixed that with Short Round appearing in both movies and the proximity of the releases (1984 Temple, 1985 Goonies).

I think they filmed only Indy catching the egg without the complicated mechanism (Later used in Goonies) but that was deleted and never seen.

Last edited by Wilhelm : 04-20-2011 at 03:21 PM.
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Old 04-20-2011, 03:55 PM   #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moedred
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pale Horse
Let's add the US burning LOGO to this.
Add it* to your list if you really want to...but it has no bearing on the validity of the egg scene.

*"U.S. LOGO" (whatever that is supposed to mean) Let's continue this in the appropriate thread...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhelm
Well, it's no so strange. In fact I always thought that the Rube Goldberg egg scene was later re-used in "The Goonies":
The idea might have been re-used later in another Spielberg film...but I've never fully seen "The Goonies" because it's such garbage. (Therefore, your theory has no substance.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhelm
Obviously is the same idea. Maybe people remembered seeing in cinemas a complicated scene with an egg, and mixed that with Short Round appearing in both movies and the proximity of the releases (1984 Temple, 1985 Goonies).
It appears that you haven't paid enough attention to this conversation before commenting. How old were you in 1984 and did you see "Doom" in the theatres?
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Old 04-20-2011, 04:06 PM   #137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
*"U.S. LOGO" (whatever that is supposed to mean) Let's continue this in the appropriate thread...:

It's all just liguistic shell games, until someone provides visual proof.
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Old 04-20-2011, 05:41 PM   #138
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If we approach the Adaptation guys, we should request everything they can recall from the blooper reels.
If their content is common knowledge, more people will want them on the blu-rays.
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Old 04-20-2011, 07:48 PM   #139
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Indy cathes the date in ROTLA

So to my understanding there is a Kyrgyzstan novelization of ROTLA where Indy tosses the date in the air but sees the dead monkey out of the corner of his eye and immediately catches it in his hand resulting in him saying "Bad Dates"




Can anyone shed some light on the matter stated above?
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Old 04-20-2011, 11:54 PM   #140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
...but I've never fully seen "The Goonies" because it's such garbage.

Oh Stoo... Until now, I had a very high opinion of you!
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Old 04-21-2011, 03:10 AM   #141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayDee
Oh Stoo... Until now, I had a very high opinion of you!

My opinion of Stewie just went even higher!
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Old 04-21-2011, 04:02 AM   #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Montana Smith
My opinion of Stewie just went even higher!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blasphemy
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Old 04-21-2011, 05:07 AM   #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
It appears that you haven't paid enough attention to this conversation before commenting. How old were you in 1984 and did you see "Doom" in the theatres?

I was 7 years old and I watched Temple 3 times in the theatres. After that The Goonies was promoted like "An Indiana Jones adventure for kids" (Like the new Tintin movie) including Short Round. I thought that the Goonies Rube Goldberg scene was interesting to mention in this conversation.

But, don't worry, I will not comment anything else. (English is not my native language so I find difficult to understand everything).
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Old 04-21-2011, 08:16 AM   #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharkey
I'm totally egging you on to post proof Mr deMille!
...
I suggest you hatch it before it spoils.
Well, guess I better get crackin' then! (For the record, I totally feel like Matt deMille.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montana Smith
From sitting on the fence on this one, I'm actually falling for the jaw-jaw of Sharkey. While Stewie has a high reputation for Indy accuracy and intuition, this may be one claim too far. That giant chicken may have messed with quite a few memories over the years.
Than go eat some Eggs Benedict, you turncoat! (Get it? Benedict Arnold, the infamous traitor of the American Revolution. Do ya get it?)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayDee
Oh Stoo... Until now, I had a very high opinion of you!
Sorry to disappoint you, JayDee. I'm not a "Goonies" fan.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhelm
I was 7 years old and I watched Temple 3 times in the theatres. After that The Goonies was promoted like "An Indiana Jones adventure for kids" (Like the new Tintin movie) including Short Round. I thought that the Goonies Rube Goldberg scene was interesting to mention in this conversation.
Sure it's worth mentioning but to say that people's memories might be confusing the egg scene with the one in "Goonies" is mildly irritating. It seems that most of you folks just don't want to believe that others have seen the "Doom" egg!

That said, I also remember some scenes with a fat kid in the temple but may be confusing those parts with the fat kid in "The Goonies".
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhelm
But, don't worry, I will not comment anything else. (English is not my native language so I find difficult to understand everything).
Then, Wilhelm, I truly apologize because I didn't know. Entschuldigen! Please, don't stop from commenting. (Though I hope you can understand all the great egg-related puns in this thread! It's nice to have fun while disagreeing.)
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Old 04-21-2011, 09:55 AM   #145
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Post Evidence - Exhibit A

Moedred already pointed the way to this script but I want to highlight a couple of things because they are relevant to the upcoming Exhibits B and C:



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Old 04-21-2011, 11:55 AM   #146
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Post Evidence - Exhibit B

Using annotations from the available scripts and information in J.W. Rinzler's book, ""The Complete Adventures of Indiana Jones", below is a timeline of story revisions and filming schedules. Note that the egg scene was STILL IN PLACE in the FINAL SHOOTING SCRIPT...*4* months after filming began.

(Relevant info emphasized in bold.)

1982 Aug 01 - 1st script draft (Biplane attack on DC-3 passenger plane. No egg scene.)
1982 Sep 13 - 1st script draft revision
1983 Mar 01 - 1st script draft revision
1983 Mar 10 - 1st script draft revision
1983 Apr 06 - 1st script draft revision (Biplane attack deleted. Egg scene added?)
1983 Apr 10 - shooting script
1983 Apr 18 - principal shooting begins
1983 May 09 - shooting script revision
1983 Jun 21 - shooting script revision (Egg scene added?)
1983 Jul 14 - shooting script revision (Egg scene added?)
1983 Jul 20 - shooting script revision (EGG scene present)
1983 Aug 26 - principal shooting ends
1983 Aug 29 - pickup shooting begins (Plane interior filmed)
1983 Aug 30 - pickup shooting (Shorty looking from parachutes filmed)
1983 Sep 07 - film crew moves to Novato for shoot at an airfield.
1984 Feb 02 - After many more pickup and visual effect shots, filming ends.

From "The Complete Adventures of Indiana Jones", J.W. Rinzler, Pages #168-169:

"While Muren, Peterson, Johnston, and others plotted out how they were going to complete ILM's visual effects to-do list in time for the May 1984 release, the live-action pickups began on Monday, August 29, 1983, with the interior of the trimotor cargo area. On hand with Ford, Capshaw and Quan were Akio Mitamura (pilot) and Michael Yama (copilot). Together with Spielberg they finished scenes that had been rewritten at least twice and inserted into the script on June 21 and July 14, 1983 (script revisions had also been made to the interior of the Duesenberg and exterior airport scenes).

Although the biplane attack had been cut, now the pilots were charged with killing Indy themselves:

The copilot picks up a large wrench and hefts it. He peeks out the door again at Indiana Jones-and looks worried. He puts the wrench down and pulls a knife out of his belt...The pilot angrily jabbers in Chinese and hands the copilot a .45 automatic.

Indiana is asleep. Above him a chicken lays an egg-the egg rolls and totters on the brink of the cage-and then falls. Without opening an eye, Indy's hand instinctively reaches out and catches the egg before it hits the ground! Scared off by Indy's reflexes, the pilots decide to empty the gas tanks and bail out of the plane, without leaving parachutes.


When the trio sees its predicament, Willie says, "I picked the wrong week to give up Valium." On August 30, Spielberg shot Shorty looking in vain for more parachutes; Ford came down with the stomach flu, but kept working.

After Spielberg filmed a few more pickups, he and his crew traveled to Hamilton Air Force Base in Novato (about 20 minutes north of ILM) on September 7 to shoot exteriors for the Nang-Tao Airfield and runway."

+ the photo descriptions:

"OPPOSITE: Scenes in the airplane went through several iterations, including one in which the pilots are so impressed at how Jones, even sleeping, can catch and egg in his hand (BELOW, with drawing and mousetrap-like steps spelled out by Joe Johnston) that they pull a gun on him. (BOTTOM RIGHT, with Akio Mitamura as the pilot with the pistol)."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharkey
If I have to assume anything its that Rinzler would have mentioned any scene involving an egg when he put together the making of book and these promo articles.
Sharkey said that Rinzler never mentions the scene in his book. Take that, Sharkey!
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Old 04-21-2011, 12:51 PM   #147
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Key Evidence - Exhibit C (The Smoking Gun)

For all ye who seek the truth,
Here lies the positive proof.
These scenes could not have been played for fun,
Doubters behold the smoking gun!

If the scene was never filmed then these photos would simply not exist. It's not rocket science.
(Note: The shot of the pilot aiming the gun is the same angle as the one from the film.)


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Old 04-21-2011, 01:12 PM   #148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
For all ye who seek the truth,
Here lies the positive proof.
These scenes could not have been played for fun,
Doubters behold the smoking gun!

If the scene was never filmed then these photos would simply not exist. It's not rocket science.
(Note: The shot of the pilot aiming the gun is the same angle as the one from the film.)



Ha!Ha! I was waiting for this. It goes to show how many people own "The complete making of" and have been too dazzled by the pictures to read it! Still, I guess without the scene there will always be doubts.

I wonder if some of the more "professional collectors" may have the final piece of the jigsaw squirrelled away in their archives...

Last edited by JuniorJones : 04-21-2011 at 01:22 PM.
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Old 04-21-2011, 02:24 PM   #149
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But did he cath the date?
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Old 04-21-2011, 02:59 PM   #150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JuniorJones
Ha!Ha! I was waiting for this. It goes to show how many people own "The complete making of" and have been too dazzled by the pictures to read it!
No kidding. Talk about turning a blind eye... All Quiet on the Western Front...
Quote:
Originally Posted by JuniorJones
Still, I guess without the scene there will always be doubts.
Before VCRs were common household items in the early '80s, I snuck a cassette recorder into the theatre for "Empire Strikes Back" and "Raiders" and taped the audio. If only I had done that for "Doom", then I'd have some BETTER proof! (By 1984, VCRs were everywhere so there was no point in audio-taping a movie because it would soon be available to buy a few months later...)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JuniorJones
I wonder if some of the more "professional collectors" may have the final piece of the jigsaw squirrelled away in their archives...
There is another avenue to pursue (but that one is in my back pocket just in case the scene isn't included on JayDee's DVD...)
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