Is KotCS too Fake?

indyartist

New member
kinda pushing the envelope for this character. I wish they'd just go back to the basics in Indy 5 like in Raiders and seriously minimize the CGI.
 

Darth Vile

New member
It's interesting how we all seem to get involved, knowingly or unknowingly, with the debate concerning "progression" versus "regression". I?ve always been in the camp that wanted KOTCS to be somewhat different, both stylistically and narratively? rather than wanting them to simply try and reproduce what went before.

Kaminski is clearly a qualified and experienced cinematographer who has his own style (be that good/bad or indifferent). I would assume that neither he nor Spielberg set out to make KOTCS look inferior to the other movies, nor was it an exercise in ego (well no more than any other movie production). I watch KOTCS and to me, the cinematography acknowledges Slocombe?s distinct style without replicating it to the nth degree. I would agree that there are several scenes that seem somewhat over lit, including Doom Town and ?Ants?... but, IMHO, the majority of the movie seems to have successfully captured the aesthetic of an ?older? movie, which I?m assuming was the main objective.

The screen shot used in a couple of previous posts (of Mutt and Spalko) is, in my opinion, less indicative of the movie. It looks like a typical 21st century blue/green screen shot? just as much as those similar shots within TOD and TLC look like effects shots from the 1980?s. I too would much rather the effects be completely photorealistic? but that?s the limits of technology for yer. There are numerous other examples one could cite where the lighting/cinematography in the movie is top notch and extremely effective (the warehouse at dusk, inside the warehouse, the diner, Peru, inside Akator etc.)? and ultimately the better cinematography/lighting is, I believe, more reflective of KOTCS as a whole.
 

JP Jones

New member
Forbidden Eye said:
Actually, if you look at the film, you'll see that outside of the obvious clip(Aliens, ants, fridge) that the film was mostly shot CGI-free. Even scenes where Indy busts through the barrels was done live with any CGI as shown on the DVD features.

What you're noticing is the coloring which is digitally-processed as opposed to chemically processed like the originals.

I think this clip explains it better like I can. Frankly this is why every film looks different today than the 1980's or films like Fargo or No Country For Old Men look different despite being only a decade apart. We just don't ever really notice because those films aren't in a series and have fans that can compare scenes unfairly, frame by frame. ;)

I think its unfair to expect Kingdom to have looked exactly like the first 3 films like you seem to have expected, as it was always going to look different, even if the 95-year-old Slocombe had enough energy to have returned. Because like typing a screenplay on a type-writer instead of a computer, it'd just too much of a hassle.

I think Kingdom and does a really good job at capturing the original colors considering(the best example being the graveyard scenes). But as for why it doesn't look like it was shot in the 1980's, well that's because it was not shot in the 1980's.
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Good point, KotCS doesn't look like the originals,no, but not fake. CGI was so heavily under fire,yet cgi had nothing to do with the look of it. It's just totally wrong to judge the fakeness of something based on the fact that it wasn't made in the 80s.
 

Cole

New member
Look none further than the origins and inspirations of the "pulp-action/adventure" genre in which Indiana Jones is based.

It is essentially a comic book put on screen.........hence the name "pulp-action."

Indiana Jones has always been more or less a "regular" guy, and the action grounded in real life..........but also clearly over-the-top and exciting.

The refrigerator clearly takes its liberties, but is within the genre to me.............more importantly, it is an exciting, extraordinarily well-constructed scene.
 

Cole

New member
Kaminski's white haze or whatever you want to call it is a staple of his work...............I think it is very interesting. In the jungle scene, it gives a sense of exoticness, and in Indy's house, or the wedding scene, it gives a sense of romanticism.

It doesn't exist in every single scene.

The visual tone feels like an Indy movie for sure..........but ya, it feels like an Indy movie made in 2008 and not 1988. That's pretty much inevitable.

The digitial effects were state-of-the-art.........I don't think they used it inappropriately. Again, it felt very appropriate within the genre, and visually, it was stunning.
 

HJJNR

New member
HovitosKing said:
let me put it this way...they ruined the KotCS cartoon by including a few too many live-action shots.
Plus; not enough Bullwhip... and he didnt even once fire his pistol! (to the best of my knowledge)
 

JP Jones

New member
HJJNR said:
Plus; not enough Bullwhip... and he didnt even once fire his pistol! (to the best of my knowledge)
I agree we could have used more whip, but does that have anything to do with how fake the film is:confused: . Let's not get off topic.
 

Meerkat

New member
Another thing that got me was the aliens' spaceship. First it looked like the temple was inside the spaceship, and then the portal opened up in the roof, which gave it the feel that the ship was hovering OVER Akator. Then when Indy & company escape, the temple of Akator crumbles and the spaceship rises from UNDERNEATH it.
That=:confused:
 

Dayne

New member
Udvarnoky said:
The temple chambers that the characters were exploring were subterranean toward the end of the film.

And thus inside the inter-dimensional craft.
 

Dayne

New member
Dr.Jonesy said:
I love KOTCS, but I think that is the worst looking shot in the film...

I agree the shot in the film looks chintzy and lame, but I was referring more to the snapshot in which you cannot notice the bluescreen as much. Though you may and probably will be of the same opinion, I just wanted to clarify. :hat:
 

indyartist

New member
I didn't think it was truthful when Indy was hanging around watching the flying saucer go up with ALL that debri flying around. That stuff could've easily hit him and should have.
 

Dr.Jonesy

Well-known member
Dayne said:
I agree the shot in the film looks chintzy and lame, but I was referring more to the snapshot in which you cannot notice the bluescreen as much. Though you may and probably will be of the same opinion, I just wanted to clarify. :hat:

Oh I gotcha now
:hat:
 

Lance Quazar

Well-known member
Udvarnoky said:
The temple chambers that the characters were exploring were subterranean toward the end of the film.

I agree. Most of Akator looked really phony and off-the-shelf.

Granted, most of the Grail Temple interiors in LC were certainly nothing to write home about. Couple crappy-looking lions, not much else.

But, in the case of KOTCS, when you're not engrossed in the story, those kinds of problems just stand out even more.
 

Dayne

New member
Lance Quazar said:
Granted, most of the Grail Temple interiors in LC were certainly nothing to write home about. Couple crappy-looking lions, not much else.

Oh and don't forget the fakest-looking "Library" in history, not to mention the following boat chase through the fakest-looking part of "Venice" ever caught on film.

"Ahhhh Venice..." ;)
 

AlivePoet

New member
Dayne said:
Oh and don't forget the fakest-looking "Library" in history, not to mention the following boat chase through the fakest-looking part of "Venice" ever caught on film.

"Ahhhh Venice..." ;)

Actually, Venice looked very realistic. If you've experienced the touristy parts of Venice and been to the terminal port, you'll know differently.
 

Lance Quazar

Well-known member
Dayne said:
Oh and don't forget the fakest-looking "Library" in history, not to mention the following boat chase through the fakest-looking part of "Venice" ever caught on film.

"Ahhhh Venice..." ;)

Those looked fine to me....:confused:
 

HJJNR

New member
mr.kotcs said:
I agree we could have used more whip, but does that have anything to do with how fake the film is:confused: . Let's not get off topic.

Sorry I didn't mean to go off topic, I was just adding to the comment of what ruined it...thats all.
 
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