13 aliens or......1?

hey another question.

i dont know if someone already mentioned this,cause i dont go to the KOTCS threads cause i hate reading about how much people hate it.....

but at the end of the movie when Irena is learning knowledge (hehe) the skeletons start coming together and it creates One. i thought there was supposed to be 13?? (or how many there was) so is there 13 of them or just 1?

please help!

There were 13.

According to Spielberg, the sequence where they merge into one was taking place inside Spalko's mind. There's also on-set footage where he suggests the idea of- as the aliens spin around the room- having each one stop abruptly to form a single alien. (I think the footage may have been included on the dvd.)

James said:

According to Spielberg, the sequence where they merge into one was taking place inside Spalko's mind.

Click to expand...

Interesting, I never thought about that. The only thing is that even when the remains of Spalko are ascending into the "portal", the alien is seen from the other perspective and appears very much 'there'.

I think Spalko is trying to elude to it somehow with her comment about: "13 beings physically separate, but with a collective consciousness. More powerful together than they can ever be apart."

Yet, I would like to hear others thoughts on this because when it happened in the theater I was confused, and I still am when I watch it at home. I am growing slowly to like the 1 alien, but I think that 13 aliens sending death beams from their eyes into Irina would have been sweeter.

Bvance said:

The only thing is that even when the remains of Spalko are ascending into the "portal", the alien is seen from the other perspective and appears very much 'there'.

Click to expand...

You could argue that Spalko's consciousness was never destroyed- only her physical body.

James said:

There were 13.

According to Spielberg, the sequence where they merge into one was taking place inside Spalko's mind.

Click to expand...

That's what I felt was going on when I first saw it. The live alien is just part of the knowledge she's receiving about who the aliens were.

Bvance said:

Interesting, I never thought about that. The only thing is that even when the remains of Spalko are ascending into the "portal", the alien is seen from the other perspective and appears very much 'there'.

I think Spalko is trying to elude to it somehow with her comment about: "13 beings physically separate, but with a collective consciousness. More powerful together than they can ever be apart."

Yet, I would like to hear others thoughts on this because when it happened in the theater I was confused, and I still am when I watch it at home. I am growing slowly to like the 1 alien, but I think that 13 aliens sending death beams from their eyes into Irina would have been sweeter.

Click to expand...

I think the movie clearly implied that it was a living and breathing alien (although I actually prefer the idea of it being in Spalko?s mind). There is no logical reason why the alien should manifest itself in physical form at the end of the movie? it?s just a money shot for the audience (a shot that I don?t think was necessary at all).

As far as the logic is concerned? My assumption was this - As the 13 have a hive mind (collective consciousness), the decapitation of one of their group meant that they could not activate the portal back home. Until the skull was returned, their chain/link/circuit had been broken. Once the skull was back in situ, full power was restored and the collective consciousness was able to power up the ship/portal.

I?m torn as to who is responsible for Spalko?s death. I thought the crystal 13 were benign beings as opposed to aggressive (as how would Orellana have been able to take the skull?). Therefore, I can only assume that Spalko was too literal with her choice of words? and the aliens (sorry inter-dimensional beings), just granted her wish for better or worse... and just looked at her thinking "Silly girl", rather than "Die Earthling".

Darth Vile said:

My assumption was this - As the 13 have a hive mind (collective consciousness), the decapitation of one of their group meant that they could not activate the portal back home. Until the skull was returned, their chain/link/circuit had been broken. Once the skull was back in situ, full power was restored and the collective consciousness was able to power up the ship/portal.

Click to expand...

That - is a very interesting theory. I had assumed they just didn't want to go back without #13, not that they couldn't. Well done, DV.

Since the temple was built around the portal, it makes sense that the temple would eventually be damaged if the portal was ever activated again.

I’m torn as to who is responsible for Spalko’s death. I thought the crystal 13 were benign beings as opposed to aggressive....Therefore, I can only assume that Spalko was too literal with her choice of words… and the aliens (sorry inter-dimensional beings), just granted her wish for better or worse... and just looked at her thinking "Silly girl", rather than "Die Earthling".

Click to expand...

That's an interesting theory as well. Sort of an - "alright then, you said you wanted to know everything - well...here's everything".

I like the idea of the non-aggressive delivery of knowledge. After all, she's the one that let go of the skull as it attached back to the body, so to them she's the one who actually "returned" it. They said they wanted to thank her and she told them what she wanted.

They are 13 and I think it's a vision of sorts.

I think it would have been cooler if the 13 skeletons had begun to stand up around her and slowly lean their heads towards her as they feed her more knowledge. They wouldn't have touched her, but it would have been creepy to have skeltons that tall (9 feet per the DVD features) stand and then circle around her. They could have even "floated" towards her from their chairs since there was quite a bit of space between where Spalko was standing and where they were seated. That would have been creepy, but SS likes his aliens to be "good guys".

I also would not have had them become fleshy, but I would have made the light in all 13 of the skulls eyes get brighter just before Spalko burns to suggest a last burst of knowledge. Instead what we got was one fleshy alien squinting at her.

I also think the living alien was in irina's mind.

And the alien getting angry could also be the reflection of Irina's own fears.

About her death... who knows, maybe she became 'knowledge' if that makes sense.

sandiegojones said:

They are 13 and I think it's a vision of sorts.

I think it would have been cooler if the 13 skeletons had begun to stand up around her and slowly lean their heads towards her as they feed her more knowledge. They wouldn't have touched her, but it would have been creepy to have skeltons that tall (9 feet per the DVD features) stand and then circle around her. They could have even "floated" towards her from their chairs since there was quite a bit of space between where Spalko was standing and where they were seated. That would have been creepy, but SS likes his aliens to be "good guys".

I also would not have had them become fleshy, but I would have made the light in all 13 of the skulls eyes get brighter just before Spalko burns to suggest a last burst of knowledge. Instead what we got was one fleshy alien squinting at her.

Click to expand...

One fleshy alien that looked kind of like Gollum!LOL

I like your idea better then the one they used! I also wouldn't have minded seeing the aliens look paler and more ethereal, similar to the way they looked in Close Encounters of the Third Kind!

What I'm curious about is why Spalko burned up, but the others were just sucked into the portal? Were the other soliders and Mac doomed to an even worse fate in the portal, or were they going for an intergalactic ride with the IBs? Also why did Indy say "they want to give us a big gift"? Were they just referring to the knowledge of the saucer?

I like the idea of it being in her mind, but I just can't wrap MY mind around it because there are several camera angles that show both Spalko and the alien in the same frame. This would indicate that SS didn't really have that in his mind, unless he's trying to indicate that the alien is in our mind too......

Anyway, it really doesn't make that much sense to me. And the idea is there but not executed exactly to my liking, unless there was some other message SS is trying to send.

Who knows, as you can see I am confused with that whole ending sequence.

deckard24 said:

One fleshy alien that looked kind of like Gollum!LOL

I like your idea better then the one they used! I also wouldn't have minded seeing the aliens look paler and more ethereal, similar to the way they looked in Close Encounters of the Third Kind!

What I'm curious about is why Spalko burned up, but the others were just sucked into the portal? Were the other soliders and Mac doomed to an even worse fate in the portal, or were they going for an intergalactic ride with the IBs? Also why did Indy say "they want to give us a big gift"? Were they just referring to the knowledge of the saucer?

Click to expand...

The gift I think was some knowledge (maybe an answer to a question like "how to cure cancer?"), but Spalko said "tell me everything you know" and then was fu@ked! She burned up because she was the only one who was receiving info from the aliens, plus she was standing on something in the middle of the chamber. The other guys had the ground get sucked up beneath them and they dies I assume.

I think some of the ending was "supposed" be a little confusing. I stated before that it would have been very 50's if Oxley had a little speech at the end that explained everything as 50's b-movies often ended in such a way.

I like the idea also the alien passivley "kills" her with knowledge. But despite her pleas for it being enough - it squints and leans in as if it knows what it is going to do - hurt her a lot.

Also, the skull "told" Indy to return it, remember? And, Irina and her army totally wiped out and killed the tribe the alien beings nurtured. In fact the skull didn't want to speak to Irina. It knew Irina had bad intentions, and Indy and Ox had good ones.

I'm not exactly sure how to take the end really.

I kind of think the merging at the end is actually a form of vision from the knowledge shes aquiring,and it is possibly being projected in to the room itself. As she got more knowledge and could see ("I can see!") - her vision of the rotating skeletons "merged" in to what she could see (the living beings) but as I say, her vision could very well have been projected in to the room herself.

Benraianajones said:

I like the idea also the alien passivley "kills" her with knowledge. But despite her pleas for it being enough - it squints and leans in as if it knows what it is going to do - hurt her a lot.

Also, the skull "told" Indy to return it, remember? And, Irina and her army totally wiped out and killed the tribe the alien beings nurtured. In fact the skull didn't want to speak to Irina. It knew Irina had bad intentions, and Indy and Ox had good ones.

Click to expand...

I think the skull/alien thought of Spalko much like the Conquistadors and Indy and Ox more like the Ugha. The Ugha wanted knowledge (like Indy & Ox) and the Conquistadors just wanted riches and power (like Spalko). If they had made clear how Orellana obtained the skull (which based on art in the temple was a beheading of an alien) it would have clarified the alien skull not "talking" to Spalko and ultimately why it chose to overload her when she asked for "everything". Plus, asking for "everything" is kinda like asking a Genie who gives you 3 wishes to give you more wishes. It's selfish and in the case of Spalko, the intent was to use it for evil.

Yeah, it makes sense the being destroyed her on purpose.

Also, Spalko states "much more powerful together than they could ever be apart" refering to the skeletons/skulls, but I think it is interesting that they all join together as one physical being at the end, especially as it seems the one fleshy being at the end is what causes her the most distress and her destruction.

Bvance said:

I like the idea of it being in her mind, but I just can't wrap MY mind around it because there are several camera angles that show both Spalko and the alien in the same frame. This would indicate that SS didn't really have that in his mind, unless he's trying to indicate that the alien is in our mind too......

Click to expand...

Well in dreams, you can see yourself in 3rd person...

Luke Skywalker said:

Well in dreams, you can see yourself in 3rd person...

Click to expand...

I bet you are right, Agent Spalko wakes up from a dream where 13 crystal aliens merge into one and then it kills her. *Alternate ending to Crystal Skulls begins!

BTW I have never had a dream about myself where I am 3rd person.

Bvance said:

I bet you are right, Agent Spalko wakes up from a dream where 13 crystal aliens merge into one and then it kills her. *Alternate ending to Crystal Skulls begins!

BTW I have never had a dream about myself where I am 3rd person.

Click to expand...

I think most dreams actually allow for 1st and 3rd person alternation (similar to a video game). If you have some modicum of control over your dreaming, it?s even easier However, that still doesn't answer whether or not the physical manifestation of aliens was all in Spalko's mind. At this moment, I still believe the intention was to portray the aliens as physically being there in person (as that is what the movie suggests).

Skulls/Aliens

Greetings,

The ending was a bit confusing I agree.
The book version explains the ending a little better.
However I interpreted as the following:

The aliens gave Spalko the knowledge she asked for - however it was sensory overload. More than any human mind could comprehend. I think the fact that she was not sucked into the portal at first like the her soliders indicates that the aliens were going to her the gift.
In the book it is only her physical form that is destroyed. The book acutally has the last part of it from her non-physical form - observing the whole situation. Her essence goes into the portal aware of what has happened to her body.

What I find interesting is that if you read paranormal literature on this subject Lucas and Spielberg stick close to the belief system (held by many) that ancient aliens are the ones who helped advance civlization.

That many of the stories in the bible (and other religious texts) could be interperted as UFO visitations.
Read "Gods of Eden" for example.
These aliens or beings are not necessarliy friendly but only appear to be... if you look at the aliens face before he gives Spalko that that last "zap" he does not appear to be smiling... he seems to be annoyed?

Thanks for reading,

Regards,

The way I see it, as Spalko recieves more knowledge of the alien/concept, the skeletons "decide" to join together to show her the full image of what she is learning, and this is when it gets too much for her, hence he saying "No more!". Afterall Spalko can now see everything, so why not let her see how th being looked right in front of her, and I think the being knew it'd be way too much for her and wanted to intimidate her.