General Indy 5 Thread - rumors and possibilities

Well I can't find that quote in the book. Could have sworn I read it in that.

Darth Vile said:

... I do recognise and appreciate that, in the world of movies, it's slightly more believable to have a youngish man doing that as opposed to a circa 70 year old...

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Yeah, but, fact is, that the circa 70 year-old could easily look like a circa 50 year-old... even less, if they just wanted him to.

Not to mention that, from what I saw in the recent "Cowboys & Aliens" trailers, Ford can still run much faster than many people half his age (look at the scenes where he and Daniel Craig rush down the canyon while everything explodes behind 'em...).

The point is that I don't sincerely understand all of this aversion for an aging protagonist. You talk about verisimilitude? Yeah, Ford is nearing his seventies, but on screen he could look much younger. And a, let's say, fifty-something year old man could still kick ones a** with no regards. You just can't say that a man that age is old.

Darth Vile said:

There is a legitimate reason why Spielberg/Lucas weren't looking to cast a 70 year old for Raiders of the Lost Ark... same reason why Batman, James Bond, Spiderman etc. etc. aren't written as old characters.

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That's obvious. But one thing is if you have to establish a new character as an action hero, envisioned to lead a potential movie series. A completely different thing is when you want to revisit that same character, after many years passed by. Which is exactly the reason why they filmed Indy 4 (and they'd do the same for Indy 5, maybe).

Anyway, putting all of these considerations apart, I'm still hoping for a prequel to "Kingdom". To me, that would be the only way to end the series on a positive note. I think the only real problem now is Lucas' complete lack of interest in this franchise.

Well Darth, despite my thinking that we were talking about what is possible, and not what is probable, I actually have to agree with most of your post.

Honestly, I think the best cure for this franchise is a second trilogy, just like before, with the next one being a prequel to appease the haters, and then a 6th to round it off and have a trilogy fully separate from the OT, rather than just KOTCS (for now) feeling like the odd man out, a curio as you put it tacked on the the OT.

After that, I really don't care if they reboot, recast, put a wildly inappropriate fedora on Mutt, have a spin-off about the gophers/prairie dogs, have Indy in outer space.....etc, etc,.....

I think there is a great opportunity here for redefining the hollywood "action" hero as it is currently understood. The only other series that I can think of that has attempted this is Rambo. I thought the last one was only bested by the original, not that trumping the other abysmal sequels is that difficult a task. But still, I wonder if Rambo fans ever talk about recasting Sly.....

The Stranger said:

Yeah, but, fact is, that the circa 70 year-old could easily look like a circa 50 year-old... even less, if they just wanted him to.

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I’m not sure they could… not without a bit of CGI trickery anyways… Ford may look good for his age, but he looks his age nonetheless. You certainly wouldn’t describe him as a young man in his physical prime - would you?

The Stranger said:

Not to mention that, from what I saw in the recent "Cowboys & Aliens" trailers, Ford can still run much faster than many people half his age (look at the scenes where he and Daniel Craig rush down the canyon while everything explodes behind 'em...).

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I think you underline my point quite well with that example. Ford looks older still when playing alongside the likes of Daniel Craig. It’s Craig who is the one we believe can overturn the odds and win the girl etc. etc. Lets face it, 10/15 years ago Ford would have been playing Craig’s role… and that’s the difference isn’t it? Ford is now playing the Tommy Lee Jones parts.

The Stranger said:

The point is that I don't sincerely understand all of this aversion for an aging protagonist. You talk about verisimilitude? Yeah, Ford is nearing his seventies, but on screen he could look much younger. And a, let's say, fifty-something year old man could still kick ones a** with no regards. You just can't say that a man that age is old.

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As I stated before, with the best will in the world Ford doesn’t look like a 50 year old. Trying to make him look younger would probably make it even worse. There is nothing wrong with having an older protagonist (I cited some classic movies before), but that has to be reflected in the script/tone. We all know that it won’t be… there was enough chagrin around here simply because Indy didn’t use his gun enough in KOTCS. How are they going to cator for ‘us’ if the right direction for Indy senior is to question his use of violence??? How are we going to handle seeing Indy not being the dominant action hero in his own movie (if they want to directly tackle his age by making Indy less physical)??? I personally think they could make a brilliant Gran Torino type movie with the Indy character… but I bet most people here and elsewhere would not be too appreciate of that. For all the posturing about wanting to see Indy’s character evolve, most just want to see him doing the type of stuff he was doing in Raiders… and that’s where the problem lies.

The Stranger said:

That's obvious. But one thing is if you have to establish a new character as an action hero, envisioned to lead a potential movie series. A completely different thing is when you want to revisit that same character, after many years passed by. Which is exactly the reason why they filmed Indy 4 (and they'd do the same for Indy 5, maybe).

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Well it’s kind of obvious that they can keep revisiting the character, played by the same actor, over and over again until it’s no longer physically possible. However, I think it’s more a question of does it actually make for a better movie?

Indy's brother said:

Well Darth, despite my thinking that we were talking about what is possible, and not what is probable, I actually have to agree with most of your post.

I think there is a great opportunity here for redefining the hollywood "action" hero as it is currently understood. The only other series that I can think of that has attempted this is Rambo. I thought the last one was only bested by the original, not that trumping the other abysmal sequels is that difficult a task. But still, I wonder if Rambo fans ever talk about recasting Sly.....

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I think anything is possible... but it's the probable (and I have to say logical) choices they'll make which is the issue here.

Re. Rambo... it's such a poor set of movies I'm not sure it can be sighted as an example. Rocky is probably a more suitable one.

Darth Vile said:

Lets face it, 10/15 years ago Ford would have been playing Craig?s role? and that?s the difference isn?t it? Ford is now playing the Tommy Lee Jones parts.

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I would MUCH rather see Harrison Ford transition to cool character and supporting roles (like in Cowboys & Aliens) than watch him try to cling to "leading man" status into his seventies. Tommy Lee Jones, Paul Newman - those are the kinds of late-period careers he should now be emulating.

Sure, there could still be some opportunities to take center stage, as Clint Eastwood manages to do, but I think he still has a lot to offer if we all modulate our expectations.

Lance Quazar said:

I would MUCH rather see Harrison Ford transition to cool character and supporting roles (like in Cowboys & Aliens) than watch him try to cling to "leading man" status into his seventies. Tommy Lee Jones, Paul Newman - those are the kinds of late-period careers he should now be emulating.

Sure, there could still be some opportunities to take center stage, as Clint Eastwood manages to do, but I think he still has a lot to offer if we all modulate our expectations.

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Agree 100%...

Let's get this topic back to where it should be--Indy 5!

michael said:

It just wouldn't be right. And I'm not saying I'm a fan of it, but INDY is too old for them to NOT be in it. That character HAS a family now.
There's always the chance a writer can pull it off...

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Excuse me, and that so-called family is Marion, Mutt, and possibly Oxley (as honourary uncle/grandfather)... seriously, do you think any of these characters would stay put if Indy goes gallivanting off on an archaeological quest?!

Or, let me put it to you this way:do you think Marion Ravenwood-Jones would be happy being a 'little suburban housewife' in 1958? Do you think Indy would be happy with 'little suburban housewife Marion'? Let's have Marion be an incompetant housewife but a very competant, argumentative archaeologist-companion for Indy.

Don't you think it's time that Indy's archaeology moved from the Old World to the New? Yes, I know, we see the Cross of Coronado, but only briefly, we see the Hovitos/ Chachapoyan idol, but only briefly. The first three movies were old-world stories, ultimately, and Crystal Skull is the only--so far--to be set in the New World. Let's continue this new tradition!

Let's purchase Mr. Lucas and Mr. Spielberg some inspiration; everyone send them "The Lost City of Z: A Tale of Deadly Obsession in the Amazon", by David Grann, published by Doubleday in both hardcover and trade paper editions. If you Indy fans here haven't read it, I think you should. It's rumoured that Fawcett was Conan Doyle's inspiration for Roxton, and Fawcett's last search for the City of Z was an inspiration for The Lost World itself.

Okay, it's expensive; if you can't afford to buy and send two books to Lucas & Spielberg, write a letter to them, recommending or suggesting that they read it.

What if Fawcett's map to the lost city of Z was transposed, north lat and longitude positions flipped for actual South coordinates?


Let's begin with: insert brief Indy ending cliffhanger, add Marion or Mutt at your discretion. Oxley is no longer at the University of Chicago; he's at Marshall College, where Marion, Mutt, and Indy can keep a benevolent eye on him. Mutt takes a South American history/archaeology course taught by Oxley in which Ox starts speaking in dead Meso-American pre Columbian tongues.

What if Oxley's exposure to the crystal skull aliens has left him with a sixth sense? What if he's channeling ancient pre-Columbian Meso-American guides to hidden cities? What if other people are mistaking his babbling for alcoholism, drug abuse, or dementia, and Indy and Mutt are the only people who believe what he's saying, and they can't get funding to find the city of Z?

Let's bring Sexy Library Girl back as Mutt's argumentative, slightly stuck-up main squeeze, more Marion than Willie, untrained in roughing it or archaeology, but game to follow Mutt anywhere for an adventure. No, she's not gonna get killed off in Reel 3! We could be seeing the future Mrs. Williams-Jones! Perhaps she's got a trust fund that she can get into and pay for a trip to South America? Let's see more lines on those screen-maps!


So, what do you think? What do they find? Do they find Atlanteans at Z, and decide not to tell the world? Does Sexy Library Girl write it up as a fictional adventure, transforming Mutt into a fictional Indy?

Do you think we can really convince Lucas & Spielberg to film at (above) Nazca, or Macchu Picchu (it was done before, in 1954)? Enquiring minds want to know!

I do like some of your ideas however there's a couple of things you may want to consider:

1. There's already an Indiana Jones novel involving the Lost City of Z. It's called "Indiana Jones and the Seven Veils" by Rob McGregor.

2. South America has already been featured twice in the series- Raiders and Skull. There are tons of exotic and interesting locales to be explored!

3. To me, a little bit too much like Crystal Skull 2 rather than Indy 5 and in the previous three, very few characters returned.

That's about as iron-clad case as one can make, Violet. I hadn't really considered any of that, but now that you've made your points, they are hard to ignore.

Thanks, though I'd say points 2 and 3 are the real iron-clad ones. The first point doesn't really matter as there was the ride at Tokyo involving the Crystal Skull before the film existed. Ironically, no aliens used in that ride, but they do have "portals". In any case, I figured it was still worth mentioning so our friend may get some more ideas on the subject. It could still be a worthy fan-fiction.

You're Welcome.

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I had to...

Can't wait for May 2018.

Athenee said:

Let's purchase Mr. Lucas and Mr. Spielberg some inspiration; everyone send them "The Lost City of Z: A Tale of Deadly Obsession in the Amazon", by David Grann, published by Doubleday in both hardcover and trade paper editions. If you Indy fans here haven't read it, I think you should. It's rumoured that Fawcett was Conan Doyle's inspiration for Roxton, and Fawcett's last search for the City of Z was an inspiration for The Lost World itself.

Okay, it's expensive; if you can't afford to buy and send two books to Lucas & Spielberg, write a letter to them, recommending or suggesting that they read it.

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Being an avid fan of all things related to "The Lost World", I knew that Fawcett's exploits were partly an inspiration for Doyle's novel (they were friends) but was unaware that Lord Roxton was rumored to be based on Fawcett. That said, I'm pretty sure "The Lost World" was inspired by one of Fawcett's early non-"Z" related expeditions since it was published more than 10 years before he disappeared.

Anyway, Athenee, there's no need to send Lucas a copy of the book because he knows about Fawcett and "Z". There was a planned episode of Young Indiana Jones which would have featured the explorer & his search. (Plus, there's the "Seven Veils" novel that Violet already mentioned.)

Athenee said:

Let's bring Sexy Library Girl back as Mutt's argumentative, slightly stuck-up main squeeze, more Marion than Willie, untrained in roughing it or archaeology, but game to follow Mutt anywhere for an adventure. No, she's not gonna get killed off in Reel 3! We could be seeing the future Mrs. Williams-Jones! Perhaps she's got a trust fund that she can get into and pay for a trip to South America? Let's see more lines on those screen-maps!

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Seeing more of Library Girl would be nice but wouldn't it be ironic if Mutt paired up with Slugger (Sasha Spielberg)? She could beat up Mutt during a lovers' quarrel and become Indy's new sidekick!

"It's up to you, There's always a lot of material left for Indiana Jones and many other, you know, sort of paranormal McGuffins or Icons to go after, antiquities to go after...I would like to say, if the audience put those same demands on us its going to be hard for us to say no. But it's not up to me it's up to them."

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Rocket Surgeon said:

"It's up to you, There's always a lot of material left for Indiana Jones and many other, you know, sort of paranormal McGuffins or Icons to go after, antiquities to go after...I would like to say, if the audience put those same demands on us its going to be hard for us to say no. But it's not up to me it's up to them."

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If it were only that simple... Even as someone who enjoys KOTCS, I recognise that the appetite for more Indiana Jones is (understandably) lesser now than it was prior to 2008... simply because they've given us a new one already.

Athenee said:

Excuse me, and that so-called family is Marion, Mutt, and possibly Oxley (as honourary uncle/grandfather)... seriously, do you think any of these characters would stay put if Indy goes gallivanting off on an archaeological quest?!

Or, let me put it to you this way:do you think Marion Ravenwood-Jones would be happy being a 'little suburban housewife' in 1958? Do you think Indy would be happy with 'little suburban housewife Marion'? Let's have Marion be an incompetant housewife but a very competant, argumentative archaeologist-companion for Indy.

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umm, so you agree with me then, right? Because your first paragraph is exactly what I meant...

Almost $800 million at the box office should have been an indicator but oh well.

Dr.Sartorius said:

Almost $800 million at the box office should have been an indicator but oh well.

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The "nuke the fridge" meme, along with the South Park episode, have made it "cool" or "hip" to consider KOTCS one of the worst movies of all time. That killed any chance of Indy 5. Even though it really isn't a bad movie, it's considered to be on the same level as Batman and Robin due to all the memes and popular hate for it.

Raiders112390 said:

The "nuke the fridge" meme, along with the South Park episode, have made it "cool" or "hip" to consider KOTCS one of the worst movies of all time. That killed any chance of Indy 5. Even though it really isn't a bad movie, it's considered to be on the same level as Batman and Robin due to all the memes and popular hate for it.

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I disagree. KOTCS doesn't nearly have the same stigma as Batman and Robin. Not even close.

And the Indy 4 hate has nothing to do with Indy 5's lack of development. Spielberg and company know Indy 4 made bank. And they know a lot of Indy fans (and a lot of movie-goers) still were satisfied with it.

Dr.Sartorius said:

And they know a lot of Indy fans (and a lot of movie-goers) still were satisfied with it.

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Of course, Lucas also assumed the film would just be torn apart online, so I'd be surprised if he lost any sleep over the backlash.