Dr. Indy Jones
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All and All, I'm just glad that John Williams is doing the score for Indiana Jones 4. It should be GREAT!!!! 
John Williams confirmed for Indy IV...
- Thread starter Echo22
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Probably an action sequence! Could be the next Scherzo for Motorcycle...sarah navarro said:
The highest resolution I uploaded is not much clearer. If it were, it could be typed into music notation software and heard...
sarah navarro
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I love the scherzo for mototrcycle!and action sequences!Moedred said:
If it is in KOTCS or maybee its for the new abe lincoln movie.
commontone
New member
I was listening to Prokofiev's "Romeo and Juliet" last night, and couldn't help but think it was an influence Williams would draw from for Indy 4...the villains being Russian and all.
Also, Shostakovich would be fitting. Big, dark, loud, brassy Communist music (which is different from big, dark, loud German/Nazi music).
Also, Shostakovich would be fitting. Big, dark, loud, brassy Communist music (which is different from big, dark, loud German/Nazi music).
commontone
New member
I noticed that imdb has some people listed as "orchestrators" alongside John Williams, for Indy 4. I know what orchestration is, and have done it myself, but why would John Williams need an orchestrator? Surely he orchestrates his own scores.
I know Danny Elfman had orchestrating assistants in his early days as a film composer, because he was just a rock guy banging out movie music on a keyboard, and hadn't yet learned the fine art of orchestrating.
But Williams is such a veteran, it makes no sense.
I know Danny Elfman had orchestrating assistants in his early days as a film composer, because he was just a rock guy banging out movie music on a keyboard, and hadn't yet learned the fine art of orchestrating.
But Williams is such a veteran, it makes no sense.
herr gruber
Guest
commontone said:
Yeah, he usually has Herb Spencer, does he not?
I wonder if Herbert will return?commontone
New member
herr gruber said:Yeah, he usually has Herb Spencer, does he not?
Herbert Spencer passed away some years ago.
That's disappointing to me (that Williams doesn't orchestrate his own scores) (OK, and also that HS died). To me, orchestration is a fine art in itself, and it's hard to call someone a composer if they don't do it themselves. Stravinsky and Rimsky-Korsakov are known as much for their innovative orchestrations as for the actual music they wrote.
I wonder if it's mostly a time issue--as Williams completes sections of the score with his piano, someone else needs to be continuously orchestrating them in order for it all to be done in time, or something. I wonder if, once the score is done and set in stone, Williams looks over the completed score and at least tweaks it to his own concepts..or maybe he marks key portions while writing ("dark brass here," "pizzicato" etc)
Anyone know of a good resource to learn about the process of scoring a film?
commontone said:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=4Xsujnj2N0U
I think that the last minute of that clip should answer your question.
edit: oops. didn't refresh and hence missed the two new posts. and actually i don't have to add anything like any links to resources or such. but I agree as far as the art of orchestration is concerned and am impressed that you've done it yourselve. I guess that sometimes you just have to say goodbye to your romantic concepts about artists and the alleged purity of their work. That said I guess the clip makes it clear that it's more of a time issue for Williams and while the orchestrator inevitably adds his idea of the music it is in the end Williams' vision.
I find the existence of orchestrators for film scores quite funny as it is yet another example of the sheer endless collaborative aspects of filmmaking.
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WhipItGood
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Actually, if you look up film credits for movies scored by your favorite composers and you'll find most if not all worked with orchestrators on their projects. I'd agree with the notion that this collaboration is a necessity of the tight time schedules for recording the scores, and not at all a reflection on the composers' skills or interest.
I'd suspect there is a basic level of orchestration which a production need not pay someone of Williams' caliber (and salary) to arrange, and that could be done by another orchestrator under the composer's instructions. Then John would tweak and refine the orchestration during rehearsal in the studio once he hears the music on its feet.
After all, Spielberg is a somewhat accomplished director you might agree, yet he has assistant directors on every project. No one thinks Spielberg can't handle directing his own films, it's just that not every bit of work needs to be done by the big guns themselves.
I'd suspect there is a basic level of orchestration which a production need not pay someone of Williams' caliber (and salary) to arrange, and that could be done by another orchestrator under the composer's instructions. Then John would tweak and refine the orchestration during rehearsal in the studio once he hears the music on its feet.
After all, Spielberg is a somewhat accomplished director you might agree, yet he has assistant directors on every project. No one thinks Spielberg can't handle directing his own films, it's just that not every bit of work needs to be done by the big guns themselves.
DarthLowBudget
New member
commontone said:
Little insider knowledge, Elfman still has someone else orchestrate his music. Most of the time it's Steve Bartek, who was the guitarist for Elfman's Band Oingo Boingo. Bartek orchestrated most of the parts for and horn lines for the Boingo music as well, and is a talented composer in his own right, working mostly in television.
herr gruber
Guest
commontone said:
Oops. I hear his brother Frank Spencer is a pretty good composer.
DarthLowBudget said:
Aaaaaahhhhhhh....this thread is starting to become one of those imdb trivia experiences. Because...isn't Oingo Boingo also the Band that Battlestar Galactica composer Bear McCreary has worked with from time to time?
I also once heard that Danny Elfman actually only hums his tunes into a voice recorder...*lol* I guess this is one of those urban tinseltown myths. Or maybe...not.... ?!
commontone said:
Williams drafts out the orchestrations in his piano scores. He usually writes out the melodies, accompaniments, and bass line in his piano scores. Then, he makes notes on the piano score as to what instruments should play what, which instrument carries the melody, etc. Sometimes he writes out figured bass notations and writes which instruments should play which tone of each chord, etc.
Williams instituted his trademark "sound" in his early days...and he's quite capable of doing orchestrations. It's just that with the amount of music he has to write and the limited time frame in which to write it, he leaves the prchestrating to someone else so he can concentrate on actually completing the score.
I understand that it's somewhat disappointing to learn of this...but, it's not as if Williams isn't capable of doing the same work. It's just that he (like Jerry Goldsmith, James Horner, Danny Elfman, etc.) leaves the orchestrating to others so he can get in "under deadline".
DarthLowBudget
New member
torao said:
Yeah, Bear McCreary got started working with Steve Bartek. His brother also performs lead vocals when the members of Oingo Boingo (sans Elfman) get together for their yearly Halloween tribute concerts.
DoomsdayFAN
Member
Wasnt it a givin that he was coming back?