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Old 05-30-2018, 03:35 PM   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emtiem
Maybe don't spoil a movie plenty of folks haven't seen yet in a thread unrelated to that movie?



Who hasn't seen TFA at this point?
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Old 05-30-2018, 05:02 PM   #127
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I thought Solo was considerably better than Rogue One. All of the supporting characters were far more memorable and fleshed out, and the fan service was a lot more subtle. It was fun and funny in all the right ways. I actually really loved it. It's too bad it's getting a bad rap--I think it's franchise fatigue and Last Jedi backlash, mostly. Though I definitely agree that the script is a laundry checklist of "things Han or Lando mentioned from their past in the original trilogy." Still fun as hell though.
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Old 05-30-2018, 08:41 PM   #128
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Bottom line for me is that Solo makes the FIFTH prequel film to New Hope. Frankly, as an at-best casual Star Wars fan, I just do not care enough to watch more. Strategically, I think this is yet another area where Kennedy let herself get led astray. Too much emphasis on prequels.

I should have waited 24 hours and just posted a link to this Washington Post article. This is the type of article that the Disney Board and Iger will read and realize they are on the verge of a very, VERY large mistake if they let the franchise continue on its current trajectory.

In my last post, I mentioned licensing revenue. Toy sales have already tanked and once the current crop of Ren/Last Jedi licensing deals come to term, then the licensing revenue shortfall becomes all the more glaring since Solo has signaled that the Star Wars brand isn't what it once was. I wouldn't want to be the Lucasfilm segment CFO reporting on those numbers in coming quarters.

Again, I'll wait to see how well the Solo hold is at the box office over the next two weekends but I think if it is low (below forty million for the second weekend of release) then I think Disney will move quickly to get rid of Kennedy. No matter what though, I don't think she lasts more than a year or two if they decide to let her finish the trilogy and Indy (though there is media out there saying that Solo's poor performance doesn't bode well for Indy).

Back to the film.

There are few aspects of the story that annoyed me.

First, Solo's youthful dreams of being a pilot. These ambitions too closely mirror Luke's in New Hope. Too me, Solo is a scoundrel first and the fact that he is a great pilot is incidental. Repeatedly having to listen to someone not named Ford playing Solo and talking nonstop about wanting to be pilot was jarringly wrong. What makes it worse, is not just that we've heard this all before from whining Luke but that we have a younger generation (the presumed intended audience for this film) that has no interest in driving or flying. Hell, most flight is automated now anyway. Dreaming of growing up to be a pilot belongs to Kasden's crusty generation. Trust me, my son and his buddies wracking up kills on Fortnight (SP?) are not dreaming of being pilots. Give it up Kasdens -- you are hopelessly out of touch.

Second, I noted above that I'm at best a casual Star Wars fan. There's one area where that's not quite true. I love Star Wars design and as a kid my most treasured possession was the Star Wars Sketch book (right now I've got the Rogue One sketch book out in my living room -- a gift from my wife). The reason why I bring this up is that the Star Wars Sketch book said which ships were from Corellia -- and I imagined this sophisticated land as a kind of German-like design nirvana. So in Solo, I finally get to see Corellia and what do I get? The Kasden's version of a space Detroit. Again, give it up Kasdens.

I don't want to give away a minor spoiler but the reason given for why Solo is familiar with the Falcon is laughably amateurish. If I had proposed what the Kasden's foist on us in Solo in an introduction to screenwriting class at the local Community College, I would have gotten bounced from the reading. Again, give it up Kasdens.

Reading the fallout press I see how Ron Howard lobbyied hard for the Cameo villain and the Kasdens talking about how they lobbied hard for this and that aspect of the story. While none of these articles say who was being lobbied, it is clear that they were lobbying Kennedy. We all see the end product and the lack of vision. It will be interesting to see what Disney chooses to do.

Last edited by Joe Brody : 05-30-2018 at 08:55 PM.
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Old 05-30-2018, 11:00 PM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Brody
I should have waited 24 hours and just posted a link to this Washington Post article. This is the type of article that the Disney Board and Iger will read and realize they are on the verge of a very, VERY large mistake if they let the franchise continue on its current trajectory.

In my last post, I mentioned licensing revenue. Toy sales have already tanked and once the current crop of Ren/Last Jedi licensing deals come to term, then the licensing revenue shortfall becomes all the more glaring since Solo has signaled that the Star Wars brand isn't what it once was. I wouldn't want to be the Lucasfilm segment CFO reporting on those numbers in coming quarters.

Again, I'll wait to see how well the Solo hold is at the box office over the next two weekends but I think if it is low (below forty million for the second weekend of release) then I think Disney will move quickly to get rid of Kennedy. No matter what though, I don't think she lasts more than a year or two if they decide to let her finish the trilogy and Indy (though there is media out there saying that Solo's poor performance doesn't bode well for Indy).

Back to the film.

There are few aspects of the story that annoyed me.

First, Solo's youthful dreams of being a pilot. These ambitions too closely mirror Luke's in New Hope. Too me, Solo is a scoundrel first and the fact that he is a great pilot is incidental. Repeatedly having to listen to someone not named Ford playing Solo and talking nonstop about wanting to be pilot was jarringly wrong. What makes it worse, is not just that we've heard this all before from whining Luke but that we have a younger generation (the presumed intended audience for this film) that has no interest in driving or flying. Hell, most flight is automated now anyway. Dreaming of growing up to be a pilot belongs to Kasden's crusty generation. Trust me, my son and his buddies wracking up kills on Fortnight (SP?) are not dreaming of being pilots. Give it up Kasdens -- you are hopelessly out of touch.

Second, I noted above that I'm at best a casual Star Wars fan. There's one area where that's not quite true. I love Star Wars design and as a kid my most treasured possession was the Star Wars Sketch book (right now I've got the Rogue One sketch book out in my living room -- a gift from my wife). The reason why I bring this up is that the Star Wars Sketch book said which ships were from Corellia -- and I imagined this sophisticated land as a kind of German-like design nirvana. So in Solo, I finally get to see Corellia and what do I get? The Kasden's version of a space Detroit. Again, give it up Kasdens.

I don't want to give away a minor spoiler but the reason given for why Solo is familiar with the Falcon is laughably amateurish. If I had proposed what the Kasden's foist on us in Solo in an introduction to screenwriting class at the local Community College, I would have gotten bounced from the reading. Again, give it up Kasdens.

Reading the fallout press I see how Ron Howard lobbyied hard for the Cameo villain and the Kasdens talking about how they lobbied hard for this and that aspect of the story. While none of these articles say who was being lobbied, it is clear that they were lobbying Kennedy. We all see the end product and the lack of vision. It will be interesting to see what Disney chooses to do.

So you don’t like the movie because it doesn’t live up to your childhood dreams.... Jesus JB. I loved that his planet was a pit and gave Han motivation to leave. Also, with a lack of education what else would he aspire to be other than a pilot? A pilot is how flys the ships they build away. So Han wanting to be a pilot didn’t bother me. Also his up bringing justified his bein* ok with being a crook. As far as the villain I agree, lame. But we know toy sales have lagged. I think that villain is a lame attempt at having a more marketable toy for the next movie.

I am surprised you missed the worst point of the whole flick - which we can discuss off screen.
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Old 05-30-2018, 11:10 PM   #130
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the best part of the film to me was that it pandered to the deepest Fanboys, without being overt. Could have it been a tighter film, probably. I think Ron Howard played it safe. The Kasdan's certainly didn't push the envelope.

as to the marketing, my 11 year old boy asked me if I wanted to indulge in the Solo collection, as it pertains to Legos. He didn't like some of the characters chosen for the marketing, but he certainly wanted to be a part of the consumerism. That's telling.
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Old 05-31-2018, 01:46 PM   #131
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Read the thing about the lobbying for the cameo villain. I wonder if thats a thing that will continue in the boba fett movie or a one and done.
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Old 05-31-2018, 01:51 PM   #132
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Read the thing about the lobbying for the cameo villain. I wonder if thats a thing that will continue in the boba fett movie or a one and done.

I've read (taking with a grain of salt) that there is a desire for Fett, Solo, and Kenobi to wind up on Tatooine pre 1977 New Hope. That coupled with the cameo would make for an interesting soap opera. Of course Kenobi and Solo couldn't meet, but it's a big small planet.
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Old 05-31-2018, 03:04 PM   #133
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https://twitter.com/heroichollywood/...78089941028865

Lo and behold... Anthony Ingruber DID audition for Solo. wonder how that would've changed the movie.
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Old 05-31-2018, 03:21 PM   #134
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https://twitter.com/heroichollywood/...78089941028865

Lo and behold... Anthony Ingruber DID audition for Solo. wonder how that would've changed the movie.


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Old 06-03-2018, 06:01 PM   #135
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With a terrible $29M in its second weekend in release, it's clear Solo is a disaster and calls into question the future of more pre-New Hope films (Boba Fett, Solo sequels and Lando). Given Solo's failure, that whole slate should be re-examined, and I think Kennedy resigning would be the best way out for all concerned.

. . .and for the Kasden's, I'd be embarrassed if I were them and this fluff article ran today in the Arts & Leisure section.

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Old 06-04-2018, 09:01 AM   #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFedora
https://twitter.com/heroichollywood/...78089941028865

Lo and behold... Anthony Ingruber DID audition for Solo. wonder how that would've changed the movie.

If he didn't get it I'm presuming he wasn't good enough.
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Old 06-06-2018, 07:48 AM   #137
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By "large portion," do you mean the vocal minority of randoms who complain about this stuff on internet movie message boards? Mainstream audiences are Disney's target, not cinephiles like us, and they are still lapping up every shred of content related to Disney's film universes. The large-scale backlash that you guys keep talking about is not in the mainstream.
By writing, "a large portion of loyal, paying customer$", I wasn't referring to the mainstream but, rather, fans who see the movies in the theatre multiple times. They make a difference and, from what is visible with the numbers coming in, the disinterest is palpable.

Never thought I'd say this in my entire life but it's satisfying to see a "Star Wars" movie underperforming at the box office. A classic case of schadenfreude because I don't want K.Kennedy anywhere near Indiana Jones (nor "Star Wars") with the position that she presently holds.

---
"Solo" is an OK action flick but it isn't a good "Star Wars" film. Outside of 3 or 4 worthy scenes, the rest can't keep it afloat. Just like "Rogue One", many details don't match with the original movies (which is crazy, considering that Larry Kasdan was involved). L3 is excruciatingly annoying and the last 20-30 minutes are boring, groan-inducing & nonsensical.

Design: What's with the lame designs under Disney's reign? Most of the entirely new vehicles are mere rectangles with no interesting characteristics, whatsoever. Almost everything recent is basically a flying box. (Are Joe Johnston and Nilo Rodis-Jamero things of the past?)

Language: Two of George's rules for "Star Wars" in general were no sex and no swearing. Now, I'm no f*ckin' prude, yet in "Solo", I heard two mentions of "ass" and a friend heard one "bastard". Not very Star Warsy dialogue and too earthbound. Honestly, folks, whose idea of "Star Wars" willfully accepts a droid saying, "Get your presumptuous ass out of my seat!"??? (Han obeys the droid!!!) Ridiculous beyond belief.

Lando: Mmmm, he just lo-o-o-oves sexual contact with a metal robot (while seemingly embarrassed by it). This is definitely implied.

Han: The origin of his last name is absurd & just plain dumb. Han remembers his dad building Corellian freighters but doesn't even know his own last name? Way to go, Jon & Larry Kasdan! Alden Ehrenreich's smarmy portrayal rarely evokes any sense of Harrison Ford but it doesn't bother me too much because Sean Patrick Flanery didn't really either (and I'm an avid Young Indy fan). The most irritating thing, though, is Alden's face. His nose is, like, way too pointy to be Han's (unlike Flanery, who has a much more suitable nose) and this is what completely destroys the film. Had they hired someone with a proper nose, "Solo" would've been a guaranteed, box office smash sensation!

Positives: Finally seeing an earlier & cleaner version of the Falcon, a decent performance by Donald Glover as Lando and...la pièce de résistance...lots of great scenes with Chewie!

Rating: 5 out of 10.

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Yes, congratulations to those boycotting Solo because of Kathleen Kennedy ruining Star Wars with forced diversity and putting women in the lead of the films.

Sinking the the film with the white male lead will surely help your cause.
Despite my rally cry last month to boycott the 1st weekend...I was there on opening night. Couldn't resist! Been a fan since '77 but my love affair with "Star Wars" is coming to an end. Thank you, Kathleen & Rian.
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Old 06-06-2018, 08:02 AM   #138
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Your complaints seem to be mainly based around continuity and what the rest of the series does than the film's quality on its own merits.
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Old 06-06-2018, 08:30 AM   #139
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Oh, there are more complaints beyond those. "Solo" cannot stand on its own merits because it doesn't have many.

Imagine this being the 1st "Star Wars" movie you ever watched. You'd probably be scratching your head at the end asking,"What the heck was that all about?"
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Old 06-06-2018, 09:23 AM   #140
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Thanks to Disney, I will probably never watch any of the old films again. What they did to the series made it so I'm almost grossed out by the originals. No point in those films now since we know everything happening as all for nothing. No rooting for Han and Leia's romance because it's doomed and Han is secretly a deadbeat dad and terrible person. Seeing Luke go from whiny kid to self-sacrificing warrior? Doesn't matter. He fails and becomes a would-be child killer. Lando, coolest guy in the galaxy? Has sex with robots.

Yeah, never watching any Star Wars film again. I just hope Disney doesn't butcher Indy as badly.
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Old 06-06-2018, 12:51 PM   #141
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Thanks to Disney, I will probably never watch any of the old films again. What they did to the series made it so I'm almost grossed out by the originals. No point in those films now since we know everything happening as all for nothing. No rooting for Han and Leia's romance because it's doomed and Han is secretly a deadbeat dad and terrible person. Seeing Luke go from whiny kid to self-sacrificing warrior? Doesn't matter. He fails and becomes a would-be child killer. Lando, coolest guy in the galaxy? Has sex with robots.

Yeah, never watching any Star Wars film again. I just hope Disney doesn't butcher Indy as badly.

Your loss, I guess.
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Old 06-06-2018, 02:12 PM   #142
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Oh, there are more complaints beyond those. "Solo" cannot stand on its own merits because it doesn't have many.

Imagine this being the 1st "Star Wars" movie you ever watched. You'd probably be scratching your head at the end asking,"What the heck was that all about?"

Not sure why you would: it's a guy having adventures on a spaceship. It's not exactly hard to follow...

It's a breezy, fun and exciting adventure film: miles better than the last Star Wars film on that count. If you're worried about the shapes of the robots not matching how they did 40 years ago or something then perhaps you won't enjoy it.
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Old 06-06-2018, 02:21 PM   #143
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Not sure if I should post this here or the Disney thread. But one thing the Mouse House is known for is "innovation". Agenda pushing matters like sex with droids is just one example of how the Company uses ideas and concepts to test the waters. They do it all the time in their parks. Magic Bands in Disneyworld let to the Maxpass technology used on your phones at Disneyland. It's awe inspiring and terrifying at the same time.

Back to Lando, you certainly won't get your middle-line waling production company caught up in a Weinstein #metoo controversy because how do you harass a droid?
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Old Yesterday, 01:46 PM   #144
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Finally saw it. Better than expected. The new guy is just fine. It's too bad it got squeezed by other Disney / Marvel juggernauts. An early December release may have worked better, or more fitting the lighter tone, August.

The franchise should emerge this decade with five quality installments (even though I seem to be alone thinking most of Rogue One was spinning its wheels). Kathleen Kennedy will have met Disney's demands for a movie a year despite briefly employing a batch of mismatched directors.

And then what? Will passing fans follow Star Wars stories outside the main saga? Are other franchises playing their game as well or better? A-list writers are typing away, and that's what matters most.
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Old Yesterday, 06:00 PM   #145
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Disney just announced that all the "A Star Wars Story" movies are now on hold. Episode IX is clearly still a go and I haven't seen anything yet on the status of the other announced trilogies, but the rumored Boba Fett, Obi-Wan, etc. movies are paused.
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Old Yesterday, 06:32 PM   #146
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Disney just announced that all the "A Star Wars Story" movies are now on hold. Episode IX is clearly still a go and I haven't seen anything yet on the status of the other announced trilogies, but the rumored Boba Fett, Obi-Wan, etc. movies are paused.


You beat me to it -- though the reports I've seen are attributing anonymous sources, so it would be good to have Disney confirm.

I saw this weak blurb from Wired that says that Kennedy isn't going anywhere, but I don't rate that at all. Consistent with the demise of journalism in general, the Wired article distorts reality by stating that Kennedy isn't going anywhere after making "three of the most successful movies in recent memory."

That's a gross distortion. Let's take a look at those three 'successes': (1) While an adequate film, The Force Awakens' success was because it had massive pent-up fan demand. As it turns out TFA is a lame story that hamstrung the rest of the trilogy. (2) We now know that the success of Rogue One was a freak accidence (the second director salvaging a disaster). (3) The success of Black Panther's (with a black cast, a third tier Marvel character and a divisive plot) box office besting The Last Jedi proves that despite its box office numbers, Last Jedi -- beyond being a garbage film -- badly underperformed at the box office.

Additionally, no one can argue that the recent Star Wars films have completely failed overseas -- which means that the current Lucasfilm team has failed a major mandate of any modern studio: grow international markets.

Put it all together and Kennedy is toast. I believe the unsubstantiated reports that she's out this Fall -- likely by way of her announcing her retirement.

To me the most telling bit of circumstantial evidence is that to my knowledge she hasn't given any press interviews since the confirmation of Solo being a flop at the box office. When a leading executive is in control and has a crisis, they go to mics. See Zuckerberg. For Kennedy, it is all silences and that tells me she's not in control.
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Old Yesterday, 11:16 PM   #147
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When a leading executive is in control and has a crisis, they go to mics. See Zuckerberg. For Kennedy, it is all silences and that tells me she's not in control.

Perhaps The Mouse House is much too preoccupied with the Lassiter exit to address Kennedy right now.
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