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Old 09-02-2008, 04:48 PM   #51
RaiderMitch
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Maybe they are smaller colleges on the same campus. At Yale University where Skull was filmed, several of the oncampus "colleges" that make up Yale University were turned into Marshall College. Calhoun College at Yale was turned into te classroom, the courtyard where the Commie Rally was held is on the old grounds of Branford College, again Yale -- Now, these names appear on the buildings and the maps, but in general they all make up Yale University and that is how it is referred to off campus.

Now if the only didnt switch the mailing address between Fairfield, New York (Barnett) and Bedford, Connecticut (Marshall) this would have made sense that Barnett was an affiliate or old campus school that made up Marshall campus -- but it wouldn't be bewteen states.

We have UConn here but its main campus in in Storrs, CT but has satillite campuses some 70 miles away in Stamford, CT...

Who knows maybe Marcus worked at both as well and was Curator at the National Museum.
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Old 09-03-2008, 03:48 AM   #52
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We are talking about the movies, right? Why do people think that there are two colleges??? In Raiders and Crusade he was at the same College. The Marshall College!
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Old 09-03-2008, 09:40 AM   #53
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At 16 minutes in Last Crusade, when the students are swarming outside Indy's office, look at their notebooks. Most of them have white stickers that say "Barnett" in big letters. I'd offer a screen capture, but I'm not sure how to take one on this computer.

16:01 - there's a great shot of one in the lower left corner of the screen, then as the camera moves back you can see it again in the center.

Now, Sankara, please don't reply back with "They're the same college!" unless you can offer some sort of evidence to support your claims.
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Old 09-03-2008, 11:12 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sankara
We are talking about the movies, right? Why do people think that there are two colleges??? In Raiders and Crusade he was at the same College. The Marshall College!

It's a fact that Indy works at Barnett College in New York in Last Crusade (as well as the video game Fate of Atlantis, which takes place right after), and in Marshall College in Connecticut in Raiders and Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. The question is why, not if, the colleges are different.

My guess is that Spielberg and co. genuinely forgot about the whole Barnett thing and "retained" Marshall College as Indy's workplace as a well-meaning but ultimately confusing nod to the fans. Unless I'm making things up, the behind-the-scenes reason for making the college different in Last Crusade was because the exterior of the school location they shot at was different for logistical reasons. You'll notice that the establishing shot of Marshall College in Crystal Skull is literally lifted from Raiders of the Lost Ark. It's just a goof on the film makers part that Indy's stay at Barnett is never addressed, because I'll bet they forgot themselves.

Last edited by Udvarnoky : 09-03-2008 at 11:18 AM.
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Old 09-03-2008, 12:31 PM   #55
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Hehe, perhaps Indy was a visiting prof, or something similar, at Barnett and the "boiler room/ office" made him decide to permanently return to Marshall

Sorry, I just love the scene where he sneaks out of his office.
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Old 09-03-2008, 03:11 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyKate
At 16 minutes in Last Crusade, when the students are swarming outside Indy's office, look at their notebooks. Most of them have white stickers that say "Barnett" in big letters. I'd offer a screen capture, but I'm not sure how to take one on this computer.


Hope this helps...

http://www.theraider.net/showimage.p...nshots/077.jpg

Note the note book at the bottom of the image.

IndyKate,Pay no attention to Sankara.....His persistence is annoying.
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Old 09-03-2008, 03:27 PM   #57
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Great shot, thanks!
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Old 09-04-2008, 09:26 AM   #58
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*LOL*

At 16 minutes in Last Crusade, when the students are swarming outside Indy's office, look at blond guy with a white shirt and a big blue "M" on it!
"M" for Marshall College!

You can see the shirt better in "The complete making of Indiana Jones"-Book page 216! Same Shirt in on page 264!

As you know I studied the Indiana Jones-Movies all my life. I read many-many-many-may books about making this movies... and I saw everything about making the movies... I've never heard some of the makers saying that Indy (and Brody *LOL) switching between two colleges.

It's the same colleges in all movies...
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Old 09-04-2008, 10:42 AM   #59
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You can see the blond guy with the "Marshall"-Shirt better in Minute 14.26...
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Old 09-04-2008, 12:50 PM   #60
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Isn't it more likely the Crusade art department just didn't remember the Raiders school had a name? (I doubt anybody on the crew including Spielberg read the novelization 6 years earlier.)
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Old 09-04-2008, 01:56 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Udvarnoky
You'll notice that the establishing shot of Marshall College in Crystal Skull is literally lifted from Raiders of the Lost Ark.
Aahh, but the cars are not the same.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sankara
As you know I studied the Indiana Jones-Movies all my life. I read many-many-many-may books about making this movies...
and I saw everything about making the movies...
Then I suggest you turn to page 174 of 1994's From Star Wars to Indiana Jones - The Best of the Lucasfilm Archives.
There you will find the Grail diary's parcel paper prop with a mailing address that reads:

Prof. Indiana Jones
Barnett College
Hamilton Hall
Grove Avenue
Fairfield, New York

Guess you didn't "study" hard enough, Sankara!
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Old 09-04-2008, 02:02 PM   #62
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@Stoo
Old news and nobody studied "Indiana Jones" harder than me!

Once again: We are talking about the movies. You don't see the "mailing Adress" in the movie. *LOL*

What do you think? Why is this blond Guy wearing this "M"-Shirt?
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Old 09-04-2008, 03:14 PM   #63
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Well.. is Marshall mentioned by name in Raiders? The M could easily stand for something else. Its a common enough letter. Also check what metalinvader posted the page before. I think we've deflected ourselves from the point of this thread. I thought it was commonly accepted that Indy switched colleges
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Old 09-04-2008, 03:14 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sankara
@StooOnce again: We are talking about the movies. You don't see the "mailing Adress" in the movie. *LOL*

Doesn't mean it isn't written on the envelope of the actual prop. Since the item Stoo mentioned is a picture of the actual prop used in the movie, end of discussion.
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Old 09-05-2008, 08:32 AM   #65
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The idea of Indy AND Marcus switching to Barnett College... and than Indy AND Marcus (*LOL*) switching back to Marshall College is Expanded Univierse-BS! Nothing more...

"The complete making of Indiana Jones"-Book page 216:

About "Crusade"

'At the Royal Masonic School at Rickmansworth, as he had on "Raiders", Spielberg shot interiors and exteriors for Indy's College'

*LOL* If this should be another college - he would shot this scenes not in the same place...

Robers Watts saying in the making of DVD "We came back to a location used in Raiders...

As you know I know 99,99 percent of all Interviews about the "Indiana Jones"-Movies. I've never heard some of the makers saying: "Yes, Indy and Marcus switched the Colleges!" *LOL* "Yes, in 'Crusade' it's not the same College like in 'Raiders'!" *LOL*

@Kooshmeister
NOW is the end of the discussion! There is only ONE College in the movies.
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Old 09-05-2008, 09:39 AM   #66
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Odd innit? I always assumed they were the same place, but if the names don't match up I'll accept it. I wonder if it was intentional or not: were they supposed to be the same place but they just changed the name or did they actually intend for Indy to be changing colleges? Would seem strange to make them look exactly the same if so.

In my mind they're the same place, and Marcus works there too (it would seem odd for him to say that the FBI chaps in Raiders were 'there to see him' if he didn't work there- why would they go through Marcus if he had nothing to do with the college?).
Was it explicitly stated to be Marshall in Raiders?
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Old 09-05-2008, 02:13 PM   #67
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I admit that when I first saw Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade back in May of '89 it didn't even occur to me the school might be a different one from Raiders of the Lost Ark, but over the years since then I've seen it stated many, many times from different sources that it's Marshall in Raiders and Barnett in Crusade.
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Old 09-05-2008, 03:10 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sankara
The idea of Indy AND Marcus switching to Barnett College... and than Indy AND Marcus (*LOL*) switching back to Marshall College is Expanded Univierse-BS! Nothing more...

Why would Marcus "switch?" He didn't work at either Barnett or Marshall in either Raiders or Last Crusade. He only became Marshall's dean in the 40's between Last Crusade and Crystal Skull. Prior to that, he was just a regular visitor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by emtiem
In my mind they're the same place, and Marcus works there too (it would seem odd for him to say that the FBI chaps in Raiders were 'there to see him' if he didn't work there- why would they go through Marcus if he had nothing to do with the college?).
Was it explicitly stated to be Marshall in Raiders?

Well for starters, Musgrove and Eaton are Army Intelligence, not FBI. And Marcus could come and tell Indy they wanted to see him at Marshall despite not working there. Since he's curator of a museum, what likely happened is that Musgrove and Eaton came to him first and asked him to recommend a guy who could help them and Marcus said, "I know just the fellow," and they went to Marshall where he told them to wait in the lecture hall while he went and fetched Indy, who he was already scheduled to meet about the idol anyway.

Marcus' presence at Barnett despite not being a member of its faculty, can be explained similarly; Indy phoned him as soon as he got the Cross of Coronado and Marcus came to get it.

So, Marcus never changed colleges, because he never worked at Marshall in the first place. He's just a museum curator who does business with whatever college Dr. Jones happens to be working for, due to his being an obtainer of rare antiquities. Indy is the only one who changed colleges. And really, that isn't too unusual in the teaching world.

As to why he switched to and from colleges, well, maybe Barnett offered him more money, and then he later returned to Marshall for whatever reasons. Probably he went back after Marcus became its dean, because Marcus (and later Stanforth) ensured better pay than that which had been used to lure him away from Marshall to Barnett originally.
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Old 09-05-2008, 03:37 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sankara
*LOL*

At 16 minutes in Last Crusade, when the students are swarming outside Indy's office, look at blond guy with a white shirt and a big blue "M" on it!
"M" for Marshall College!
You think a single letter is more definitive than "Barnett" being explicitly spelled out?
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:33 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kooshmeister
And Marcus could come and tell Indy they wanted to see him at Marshall despite not working there. Since he's curator of a museum, what likely happened is that Musgrove and Eaton came to him first and asked him to recommend a guy who could help them and Marcus said, "I know just the fellow," and they went to Marshall where he told them to wait in the lecture hall while he went and fetched Indy, who he was already scheduled to meet about the idol anyway.

He could, but I think it's reasonable to think that it was intended for the audience to think that he worked there: this seems to be all a lot of fan bending after the event to try and sort out what just seems like some mistakes made onscreen; or perhaps they just thought Marshall was too much of an in-joke and changed it, but then went back for Skull.
It's also implied that the Government guys came to Indy because he knew Abner Ravenwood as named in the Nazi message; if so they wouldn't have needed to go to Marcus so there'd have been little reason for him to be involved unless he worked at the college. It's all open to interpretation, though.

I appreciate that some largely unseen details do assert that they're different colleges, but for me I find it easier just to think that they're all the same college and that Marcus works there. There's nothing explicit to say that's wrong and it just makes things a little bit more satisfying, especially as the places look so similar which seems to imply that they're intended to be the same place (Darabont seemed to think the same- we see the college museum in City of the Gods full of stuff Indy obtained for Marcus' museum which implies Marcus worked for the college, and Spielberg presumably didn't mind that). Sometimes an error is just a error and a moviegoer has to ignore it: I'm definitely not saying anyone's wrong though; just which scenario I prefer.
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Old 09-06-2008, 01:52 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emtiem
It's also implied that the Government guys came to Indy because he knew Abner Ravenwood as named in the Nazi message; if so they wouldn't have needed to go to Marcus so there'd have been little reason for him to be involved unless he worked at the college. It's all open to interpretation, though.

True but what they say is he studied under Professor Ravenwood. It's never explicitly said they sought Indy out first. Marcus knew Abner, too. Or so it's implied ("Rubbish. Ravenwood's no Nazi."). I think they went to Marcus about Abner first, then Marcus suggested taking them to see someone who knew him better, like Indy.

I admit it really is simpler to just assume they're the same university, and that the museum Marcus is said to curate is the university's in-house one, I just like looking at different possibilities.
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Old 09-06-2008, 02:11 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kooshmeister
True but what they say is he studied under Professor Ravenwood. It's never explicitly said they sought Indy out first. Marcus knew Abner, too. Or so it's implied ("Rubbish. Ravenwood's no Nazi.").

Very true; both are implied.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kooshmeister
I admit it really is simpler to just assume they're the same university, and that the museum Marcus is said to curate is the university's in-house one, I just like looking at different possibilities.

Fair enough, yes- it has made me think of it in a different light, that's certainly true.
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Old 09-06-2008, 02:20 PM   #73
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Dude, Barnett is just a mistake by the art department that slipped through. But Lucasfilm doesn't make mistakes so their marketing people fumble around like dorks trying to explain it. the end.
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Old 09-06-2008, 03:10 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sankara
What do you think? Why is this blond Guy wearing this "M"-Shirt?
I take it for what it is, which is a letter "M". On top of everything else presented in Barnett's defence,
one of the DVD chapters is titled: Barnett College!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kooshmeister
True but what they say is he studied under Professor Ravenwood. It's never explicitly said they sought Indy out first. Marcus knew Abner, too. Or so it's implied ("Rubbish. Ravenwood's no Nazi."). I think they went to Marcus about Abner first, then Marcus suggested taking them to see someone who knew him better, like Indy.
Nice one, Koosh, but if you look at the dialogue, they were searching for Indy from the beginning.

Marcus: The people I brought are important. They're waiting.
Indy: What people?
Marcus: Army Intelligence. They knew you were coming before I did. Seem to know everything.
Wouldn't tell me what they wanted.

If they wouldn't disclose any info to ol' Marcus then he wouldn't have known to bring them to Indy.
Plus, of note is the line, "people I brought", which implies that Brody chaperoned the G-Men from
outside the university (instead of ex. "people who are here" if Brody was a faculty member).
That's my take on it, anyway...
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:19 PM   #75
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Nice one, Koosh, but if you look at the dialogue, they were searching for Indy from the beginning.

Nutmuffins.
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