The Old Indiana Jones Bookends Thread

ReggieSnake

New member
Flannery10 said:
That's exactly how I feel about the bookends. The results of some of the actions the historical people took, are not explained in the re-edits, at all.
Having just watched My First Adventure, or more precisely Curse of the Jackal, I can definitely see what you mean. What about the Jackal? The impact is completely lost without the the second part (which I've read about, but haven't watched yet:rolleyes: ) and the Old Indy conclusion.

Also, the continuity (Corey Carrier's age) would be bad for people who didn't know they were once two different episodes.

...looking back, Flannery, I guess what I just wrote didn't relate exactly to what you said...you get what I was trying to say anyway.;)
 

Adamwankenobi

New member
ReggieSnake said:
Having just watched My First Adventure, or more precisely Curse of the Jackal, I can definitely see what you mean. What about the Jackal? The impact is completely lost without the the second part (which I've read about, but haven't watched yet:rolleyes: ) and the Old Indy conclusion.

Also, the continuity (Corey Carrier's age) would be bad for people who didn't know they were once two different episodes.

...looking back, Flannery, I guess what I just wrote didn't relate exactly to what you said...you get what I was trying to say anyway.;)

I can just imagine the conversation when Lucas brought the cast back together in 1996 to shoot the "Tangiers" segment:

Cast: "Why are we shooting this now? Isn't Corey a little old to be playing a nine year old?"

Lucas: "Well, I had this idea... it's a little strange, but I think it'll work (laughs). We're gonna take part of the jackal story and put it with this."

Rick McCallum: "Awesome idea, George!"

Cast: "Don't ya think it'll be kinda obvious to the audience that Corey's aged a bit?"

Rick McCallum: "We'll fix it in post."

(While George and Rick have their backs turned discussing production costs, the cast look at each other with confused looks and roll their eyes.)

George Lucas: (turns back around) "You know, I actually had this idea in the beginning, but... you know... I was a little limited in what I could do. But now we're gonna fix the whole series to how I originally intended it to be. We're gonna take this and make it a movie, and..."

(The cast members pretend to pay attention, but tune out, instead focusing on their paychecks.)
 

Indy Smith

New member
I'll need to watch all of the episodes to see what we mean about the age difference.

Wasn't SPF 26-27 when he started Young Indy? I'm assuming they started shoooting 91 so it would first release in 1992. So technically SPF would have been ten years older than what Indy was. Keping it in the same vein then now seeing as Ford is a good few years older than what Indiana Jones is in Crsytal Skull.
 

Stoo

Well-known member
Flannery10 said:
What we find out about Indiana Jones:
First of all, we find out that he's still carrying the busticket with him, so he really seems to keep artifacts of all of his adventures, the biggest one certainly being the diary, in which he wrote down everything. Except that, we don't really find out to much about his personality and other traits.
Yes, he carries it around in his jacket pocket! The rare appearance of his diary
in the bookends.

We are also given another clue towards his senility (or his devious side) as his
tax affairs are in a questionable state. He is under investigation by the IRS and
is not able to produce any receipts. (You can hear the accountant/lawyer
talking about this as Indy is trying to listen to "the voice".)
Adamwankenobi said:
How are the original episodes not a history series, though? :confused: They may have not have been marketed by ABC as a history series, but ABC made some bad choices with that show. If anything, the bookends make the episodes feel more like a history show, because it's being told in the past tense via flashbacks. And Old Indy always sums up things in the end, relating to us the moral of the story and relating history to whatever he's doing at the moment.
When it started, my peers (all casual fans) were excited about the series but
the bookends became a big turn-off. They were too kiddy-ish. (Picture Burl Ives
as the snowman telling the tale of Rudolph, etc. in those late '60s Rankin/Bass
Christmas specials.)

Actually, the preview for Season 2 does market it as "history series" (and when
I get around to posting it you'll see why) but the bookends gave the show that
"Family Special" feel on top of everything else.
 

Adamwankenobi

New member
Stoo said:
(Picture Burl Ives
as the snowman telling the tale of Rudolph, etc. in those late '60s Rankin/Bass
Christmas specials.)

LOL! Burl Ives actually narrated an earlier Lucas production, The Ewok Adventure (aka Caravan of Courage: An Ewok Adventure).

Stoo said:
but the bookends gave the show that
"Family Special" feel on top of everything else.

In the interviews he conducted for the YIJ DVD press kit, Lucas says that that was the original intention: for the show to have that "family hour" feel.
 

Stoo

Well-known member
Adamwankenobi said:
LOL! Burl Ives actually narrated an earlier Lucas production, The Ewok Adventure (aka Caravan of Courage: An Ewok Adventure).
Ha!:D I have both Ewok movies that I taped off TV. Yeah, Burl Ives narrates the 1st one.
You see what I mean??? When I first saw "Jackal", I thought..."He ewoked Indy!?!"
(Is "ewok" a verb yet?)
In the interviews he conducted for the YIJ DVD press kit, Lucas says that that was the original intention: for the show to have that "family hour" feel.
He succeeded...and in the process:

-alienated casual fans
-alienated TRUE trilogy fans
-satisfied or exceeded expectations of liberal fans
-created new fans
 

Lao_Che

Active member
Jones convieniently meeting Prentiss again at the end of the episode is a bit too much for me in the cheese department. I think Love's Sweet Song actually works better ending with the train disappearing and the screen going to black and white. It's a downer but it can be turned into a foreshadowing of how World War I goes for him anyway.

The interesting thing is if Indy never forgets about Prentiss, what does that say about his marriage to (British) Dierdre Campbell in the novels? Especially since he denies ever being married in Hollow Earth (might be Secret of the Sphinx come to think of it).
 
Last edited:

Adamwankenobi

New member
Lao_Che said:
The interesting thing is if Indy never forgets about Prentiss, what does that say about his marriage to (British) Dierdre Campbell in the novels? Especially since he denies ever being married in Hollow Earth.

No one forgets their first true love. They just don't talk about it once they're married.
 

Flannery10

New member
Lao_Che said:
Jones convieniently meeting Prentiss again at the end of the episode is a bit too much for me in the cheese department. I think Love's Sweet Song actually works better ending with the train disappearing and the screen going to black and white. It's a downer but it can be turned into a foreshadowing of how World War I goes for him anyway.

The interesting thing is if Indy never forgets about Prentiss, what does that say about his marriage to (British) Dierdre Campbell in the novels? Especially since he denies ever being married in Hollow Earth (might be Secret of the Sphinx come to think of it).

Well, first of all, I really like the original ending of the London episode. Old Indy tells the story because he heard a voice that reminded him of Vicky and therefore it makes perfect sense for him to find out it really was Vicky in the end. But if you think it works better without the bookends, that's your opinion, of course. It just bums me, that Lucas only released the re-edits on the DVD, and not the originals, too.

In my opinion Rob McGregor's novels make the perfect transition from the Young Indy series to the adult movies. In fact, I read somewhere that he wanted to put bookends in his first book "Perils at Delphi", an idea he dropped quite early though. The scene in Secret of the Sphinx where Indy says he never married, is something that happened a couple of times in the novels. The three authors (four, if you speak German) sometimes didn't read what the others wrote and therefore ignored major storylines or details they put in there. Caidin though obviously read McGregor's books, since he put Jack Shannon in his ones, too.
 

Adamwankenobi

New member
Flannery10 said:
Well, first of all, I really like the original ending of the London episode. Old Indy tells the story because he heard a voice that reminded him of Vicky and therefore it makes perfect sense for him to find out it really was Vicky in the end.

Plus, when has an Indiana Jones production been without the cheesy elements? To quote Joss Whedon, "I loves me some cheese". :whip:

Flannery10 said:
It just bums me, that Lucas only released the re-edits on the DVD, and not the originals, too.

I feel your pain. :(

Flannery10 said:
In my opinion Rob McGregor's novels make the perfect transition from the Young Indy series to the adult movies. In fact, I read somewhere that he wanted to put bookends in his first book "Perils at Delphi", an idea he dropped quite early though.

Here's the interview you're refering to. He seems to hint that the concept of an Old Indy was his idea in the first place. :eek:
 

Flannery10

New member
Adamwankenobi said:
Here's the interview you're refering to. He seems to hint that the concept of an Old Indy was his idea in the first place. :eek:

Why not? Perhaps it really was his idea, and if it was, it's too bad the Old Indy scenes were never published.
 

Lao_Che

Active member
Flannery10 said:
Well, first of all, I really like the original ending of the London episode. Old Indy tells the story because he heard a voice that reminded him of Vicky and therefore it makes perfect sense for him to find out it really was Vicky in the end. But if you think it works better without the bookends, that's your opinion, of course. It just bums me, that Lucas only released the re-edits on the DVD, and not the originals, too.

Then I take back my cheese comment because it works in context. :hat:

I like the idea of the bookmarks, it's just the execution of them I disagree with.
 

Flannery10

New member
Lao_Che said:
Then I take back my cheese comment because it works in context. :hat:

I like the idea of the bookmarks, it's just the execution of them I disagree with.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhUpk7w_0vc

You might wanna watch the bookends again, and see for yourself, if you haven't already.
I also disagree with the complete removal of the bookends, and think both versions should have been released on DVD.
 

Lao_Che

Active member
Flannery10 said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhUpk7w_0vc

You might wanna watch the bookends again, and see for yourself, if you haven't already.
I also disagree with the complete removal of the bookends, and think both versions should have been released on DVD.

I did, that's why I took my statement back. :)

And yes, they should have been made available on DVD even if they weren't part of episodes. If only to respect the people who actually watched the series first time round.
 

Adamwankenobi

New member
Lao_Che said:
And yes, they should have been made available on DVD even if they weren't part of episodes. If only to respect the people who actually watched the series first time round.

And to respect George Hall, who died in 2002.
 
Top