Why Yale???

Joe Brody

Well-known member
Fictional institutions of higher learner have been good enough for Indy films in the past -- so what are we to think of the prospects of at least an action set on the campus of one of the most elite universities here in the States?

Could one of the powers-that-be be angling to get in the school's good graces to help get a kid into the joint?

Or perhaps there's something more interesting afoot. Check out this article (from yesterday's New York Times Magazine) on Yale's Incan collection that has at the middle of an increasingly higher profile repatriation battle:

The Possessed
By Arthur Lubow
Published: June 24, 2007

[...]

If you have visited Machu Picchu, you will probably find Bingham?s excavated artifacts at the Yale Peabody Museum in New Haven to be a bit of a letdown. Mostly, the pieces are bones, in varying stages of decomposition, or pots, many of them in fragments. Unsurpassed as stonemasons, engineers and architects, the Incas thought more prosaically when it came to ceramics. Leaving aside unfair comparisons to the jaw-dropping Machu Picchu site itself, the pottery of the Inca, even when intact, lacks the drama and artistry of the ceramics of earlier civilizations of Peru like the Moche and Nazca. Everyone agrees that the Machu Picchu artifacts at Yale are modest in appearance. That has not prevented, however, a bare-knuckled disagreement from developing over their rightful ownership. Peru says the Bingham objects were sent to Yale on loan and their return is long overdue. Yale demurs.

In many ways, the dispute between Yale and Peru is unlike the headline-making investigations that have impelled the Metropolitan Museum in New York, the Getty Museum in Los Angeles and the Museum of Fine Arts in Boston to repatriate ancient artifacts to their countries of origin. It does not revolve around criminal allegations of surreptitious tomb-raiding and black-market antiquities deals. But if the circumstances are unique, the background sentiments are not. Other countries as well as Peru are demanding the recovery of cultural treasures removed by more powerful nations many years ago. The Greeks want the Parthenon marbles returned to Athens from the British Museum; the Egyptians want the same museum to surrender the Rosetta Stone and, on top of that, seek to spirit away the bust of Nefertiti from the Egyptian Museum in Berlin. Where might it all end? One clue comes in a sweeping request from China. As a way of combating plunder of the present as well as the past, the Chinese government has asked the United States to ban the import of all Chinese art objects made before 1911. The State Department has been reviewing the Chinese request for more than two years.

The movement for the repatriation of ?cultural patrimony? by nations whose ancient past is typically more glorious than their recent history provides the framework for the dispute between Peru and Yale. To the scholars and administrators of Yale, the bones, ceramics and metalwork are best conserved at the university, where ongoing research is gleaning new knowledge of the civilization at Machu Picchu under the Inca. Outside Yale, most everyone I talked to wants the collection to go back to Peru, but many of them are far from disinterested arbiters. In the end, if the case winds up in the United States courts, its disposition may be determined by narrowly legalistic interpretations of specific Peruvian laws and proclamations. Yet the passions that ignite it are part of a broad global phenomenon. ?My opinion reflects the opinion of most Peruvians,? Hilda Vidal, a curator at the National Museum of Archaeology, Anthropology and History of Peru in Lima, told me. ?In general, anything that is patrimony of the cultures of the world, whether in museums in Asia or Europe or the United States, came to be there during the times when our governments were weak and the laws were weak, or during the Roman conquest or our conquest by the Spanish. Now that the world is more civilized, these countries should reflect on this issue. It saddens us Peruvians to go to museums abroad and see a Paracas textile. I am hopeful that in the future all the cultural patrimony of the world will return to its country of origin.? Behind her words, I could imagine a gigantic sucking whoosh, as the display cases in the British Museum, the Smithsonian, the Louvre and the other great universal museums of the world were cleansed of their contents, leaving behind the clattering of a few Wedgwood bowls and Sèvres teacups.

[....]

Burger and other scholars believe there was no gold for Bingham to find at Machu Picchu because the royal family would take precious objects back to Cuzco when they left the estate. During his lifetime, however, Bingham was plagued by rumors that he had smuggled gold out of Machu Picchu through Bolivia. Those rumors persist. I heard them myself in Peru, from people who told me that their grandparents witnessed Bingham?s caravans laden with mysterious material, heading east for the border to evade export controls.

Such gossip is wishful thinking. By the time Bingham came to Peru, there was very little Inca gold remaining anywhere in the world. It vanished centuries earlier. When Francisco Pizarro seized Atahualpa in 1532 and held him hostage, the Inca ordered his subjects to collect a ransom. The obedient populace stripped the enormous gleaming panels and other lavish embellishments from the Temple of the Sun in Cuzco, which were a legacy of Pachacuti. They dismantled an artificial garden of sculptures of corn, flowers and birds, all realistically made with precious metals. They conveyed vases, idols, drums, pots, altars, fountains, masks and other creations of the finest goldsmiths ? the tribute that this great and isolated civilization had paid to its gods and rulers. The chronicles record the steady arrival of prodigious quantities of gold, which the conquerors stored alongside their prisoner. All for naught. The Spanish executed Atahualpa anyway and melted down the treasure to ship home. As I talked to people in Peru about the Bingham collection, this tragic history was always flickering in the background. The Spanish ships heavy with plunder sailed from Peru long ago. The patrimony is irretrievable, the Spaniards unaccountable. Yet the drama continues to play out, like a recurring nightmare or a neurotic repetition compulsion, within Peru today. Precious objects that remain in Peru ? things far more beautiful than the Machu Picchu crockery ? are still being extracted at a horrifying rate. In many parts of the country, especially along the coast, tomb-robbing is a major industry: the huaqueros sell the plundered antiquities to middlemen for placement with rich collectors in Lima or abroad. The dispute with Yale is a sideshow.

Historic relics have pragmatic value: politically, for purposes of national pride and partisan advantage; economically, for display to tourists, museumgoers, magazine readers and TV-program watchers; scientifically, as research material for scholars pursuing academic careers; and, most nakedly, as merchandise for dealers in antiquities. In comparing the arguments and motivations of the different claimants to the Yale collection, I often identified with historians of the Inca trying to untangle those Spanish chronicles that were spun from the tales of native informants with their own purposes. The people at Yale say that they have preserved the collection as a legacy of a great civilization and they want to continue to study these artifacts to learn more about that culture. They are also paying tribute to one of the most colorful and glamorous figures in the university?s history. The Peruvians celebrate their own legendary ancestor when they describe the urgency of their case, but they also have very down-to-earth political and commercial uses for the collection. ?Cultural patrimony? ? the phrase sounds so otherworldly. Bingham and Pachacuti were both very practical men. They would not have been fooled for a minute.

Note: I edited out 95% of the article was rambling and poorly edited. For a time, you can find the whole article here.

Rapatriation. It's the best storyline out there. . .
 

Deadlock

New member
Hmmm.... all this sounds strangely familiar. ;)

I don't see Hiram Bingham being a pressing reason to connect Indy with Yale in the fifties... The dude was dead in '56.

Not to burst your bubble, but I think it's strictly a backdrop decision. I'd be willing to bet the tradition of fictional universities continues.
 
Deadlock said:
Hmmm.... all this sounds strangely familiar. ;)

I don't see Hiram Bingham being a pressing reason to connect Indy with Yale in the fifties... The dude was dead in '56.

Not to burst your bubble, but I think it's strictly a backdrop decision. I'd be willing to bet the tradition of fictional universities continues.

Indiana Jones is mentioned as being an alumni of the University of Chicago which is a real university.

Perhaps Indiana Jones will be at Yale to show that he has progressed in his career and now is a well respected tenured professor at one the nation's most elite schools. It is also possible that Yale is just a backdrop for a fictional university or some other school, it would be quite interesting if the school in the movie is the University of Chicago in spite of it being shot at Yale.
 

Joe Brody

Well-known member
Deadlock said:
Hmmm.... all this sounds strangely familiar. ;)

I don't see Hiram Bingham being a pressing reason to connect Indy with Yale in the fifties... The dude was dead in '56.

Not to burst your bubble, but I think it's strictly a backdrop decision. I'd be willing to bet the tradition of fictional universities continues.

I'm not so much talking about Bingham as the fact that Yale is holding onto a collection. Fact could be fudge that Indy or Abner helped produce the Yale collection. You could be right about the backdrop -- but Lucas took aim at present admin in his last film and Yale might present a second target of opportunity (assuming he's not trying to get his young Jedi in there -- which I doubt since he's so Left coast. . . .where's Pale Horse when you need him?)

How have you been?


chicago103 said:
Indiana Jones is mentioned as being an alumni of the University of Chicago which is a real university.

Point taken.

chicago103 said:
Perhaps Indiana Jones will be at Yale to show that he has progressed in his career and now is a well respected tenured professor at one the nation's most elite schools.

This would sadden me since the last we saw him on campus, IJ was climbing out of a window to get away from this students.

chicago103 said:
It is also possible that Yale is just a backdrop for a fictional university or some other school, it would be quite interesting if the school in the movie is the University of Chicago in spite of it being shot at Yale.

I doubt this because I think the schools have two very distinct architectual traditions. (And why not just film in Chicago?)
 

Attila the Professor

Moderator
Staff member
I've suspected, perhaps without foundation, and at the very least have hoped they're using the streets around Yale merely to masquerade as some other school. That does beg the question though of how a school as known as Yale is somehow the best choice rather than one which might be less touched by the passing of time. Perhaps it was a matter of infrastructure and housing for the film crew and the inevitable masses that would show up once they found out what was happening; I still don't quite understand the urge to be there, but even so.

I agree with you, Joe - even if he's brilliant, he doesn't seem to actually be into the teaching. Although, then, that's just the sort of thing Yale would go for (oh, I love snarking at the Ivies).
 

nymph_shadowed

New member
wow, you guys are thinking way to hard into this,
the reason they're filming at Yale is really two reasons:
A.) Connecticut gives filmmakers a 30% tax break if they film in Connecticut
B.) Chapel St. and the Yale Campus are places that can easily transform into a given period, like the 1950s, probably more than any place in CT.

Also, Spielberg got an honorary degree from Yale, so he might have wanted to pay them back in this way...
 

MsIndy07

New member
Perhaps Jones is now a Professor at Yale. He is 18 years older now, and i figured him retiring form archeology and just strickly teaching was a plot line they are going to use. Then someone who he either took an artifact from or jaded somehow comes to find him while he is at school. That is when they have the big chase. This in turn forces Jones to go on another, unexpected, relic hunt. Yeah!!!

Just a thought.
 
MsIndy07 said:
Perhaps Jones is now a Professor at Yale. He is 18 years older now, and i figured him retiring form archeology and just strickly teaching was a plot line they are going to use. Then someone who he either took an artifact from or jaded somehow comes to find him while he is at school. That is when they have the big chase. This in turn forces Jones to go on another, unexpected, relic hunt. Yeah!!!

Just a thought.

Mirrors my thinking too. Its not what I want, but what I'm expecting as its relatively straightforward. And its near-certain Yale is just a backdrop for another campus.
 
Joe Brody said:
This would sadden me since the last we saw him on campus, IJ was climbing out of a window to get away from this students.

On the contrary and as Attila the Professor already said thats all the more reason to go to a school like Yale which focuses on research over teaching. The schools he was at during the 30's were perhaps more teaching and less research oriented wheras a tenured professor at a place like Yale or the University of Chicago are often researchers who do alot of field work and only do teaching as a side or leave it up to graduate teaching assistants. Also its often the older and more experienced (tenured) professors that do less actual teaching in my experience, I went to a research university. I imagine Indy has been going on field adventures for the entire time up until 1957, hence why he is in such good shape for his age although even then age is catching up to him of course. Yale would actually be more likely to tolerate his field escapades, even put him on sabatical for an entire semester if he was doing a major architectural dig or something.
 

Deadlock

New member
Joe Brody said:
I'm not so much talking about Bingham as the fact that Yale is holding onto a collection. Fact could be fudge that Indy or Abner helped produce the Yale collection. You could be right about the backdrop -- but Lucas took aim at present admin in his last film and Yale might present a second target of opportunity (assuming he's not trying to get his young Jedi in there -- which I doubt since he's so Left coast. . . .where's Pale Horse when you need him?)

I think I see what you're driving at. I still think it's a scenery-only (and possibly tax-related, apparently) decision.

I would hope that if Yale really is Yale, that the reason is the summons of a latest edition of an Eaton/Musgrove-type character (perhaps Hurt, Winstone, or Broadbent?)

If Indy's teaching there... I'll be disappointed. And if there's anything as quaint as campus visit for Henry Jones III, I'll be leaving the theater. :rolleyes:
 

djdandan

New member
I go to New Haven often to visit my sister who works at Yale. They probably are filming there because its a nice looking campus, very old and classy looking.Spielburg could just really like the campus, he got as someone said an honorary degree from there, and also his son goes there for school. He and Lucas are the head honchos, so why not pick a place you really like.
 

arkfinder

New member
Because waaaayyyy back in the day Harvard & Yale were the mecca of all collages. Yale has a great history to it and the may have been enough for Lucas to put it in the film.
 

Joe Brody

Well-known member
Deadlock said:
I would hope that if Yale really is Yale, that the reason is the summons of a latest edition of an Eaton/Musgrove-type character (perhaps Hurt, Winstone, or Broadbent?)

If Indy's teaching there... I'll be disappointed. And if there's anything as quaint as campus visit for Henry Jones III, I'll be leaving the theater. :rolleyes:

Exactly. You've formed my thoughts. We should start a petition to ban IJ from academia altogether. I'm betting he's on campus to steal something.

nymph_shadowed said:
wow, you guys are thinking way to hard into this,
the reason they're filming at Yale is really two reasons:
A.) Connecticut gives filmmakers a 30% tax break if they film in Connecticut
B.) Chapel St. and the Yale Campus are places that can easily transform into a given period, like the 1950s, probably more than any place in CT.

Also, Spielberg got an honorary degree from Yale, so he might have wanted to pay them back in this way...

What state doesn't give massive tax breaks in this day and age? And I'll bet there are several colleges in Canada that are just as nice where the labor taxes and filming expenses are a LOT cheaper than CT.

scifiwolf said:
Why Yale? Why not Yale?

Ban him -- someone's talking like a Yalee (sp?).

arkfinder said:
Because waaaayyyy back in the day Harvard & Yale were the mecca of all collages. Yale has a great history to it and the may have been enough for Lucas to put it in the film.

[jokingly] ban him too -- Yale's great history 'educated' the Pres. Give me Princeton (although Nassau Hill isn't as nice).
 

scifiwolf

Member
Joe Brody said:
Ban him -- someone's talking like a Yalee (sp?).

lol - no, I was born and raised an NC State Wolfpacker, hence the screename. Ironically, I ended up going to WVU.

I actually agree that there is nothing too deep in the choice of Yale for filming. I think it's just the aesthetic quality of the campus. I mean, it can't be easy finding too many college settings that can pass for a 1950's university, right? And, like some have mentioned, Spielberg has a history with the university.
 

Finn

Moderator
Staff member
nymph_shadowed said:
And the college that will be featured in the movie is not Yale, its a fictional college in Connecticut...
Not necessarily even in Connecticut.
 
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