Digital face replacement on "stunt actors"

N

nitzsche

New member
OK. I may be waaay wrong on this call. But in rewatching the jungle scene in hi-def, I noticed something strange during Spalko's hand-to-hand fight with Mutt on the back of the jeep. In places it is clear Cate's stunt double is doing some of the punching and kicking. But at the point where Spalko is thrown into the windshield and then begins to kick Mutt, suddenly it's not Cate, but it's not really the stunt woman either - it's like a digitally super-imposed Spalko face or a CGI one. Kind of like what they did with Dooku and Palpatine in ROTS.

I slowed it down and watched it frame-by-frame and there's even a frame or two that looks like Mutt might be a double with a super-imposed Shia face.

Anyone able to do screen grabs of a few frames?

It's right as Spalko kicks high over her own shoulder and then begins to pummel Mutt with kicks to the abdomen and he begins to fall backwards onto the hood of Indy's vehicle.
 
U

Udvarnoky

Well-known member
This isn't an unusual or new technique, but yeah, there are definitely cases in this movie of the real actors' faces being digitally superimposed over the stunt guys'. A particularly glaring example is during the Yale chase when Mutt and Indy zoom through the iron gate, followed by the Russian suits crashing through it.
 
JayDee

JayDee

Member
Yo can even see it when Mutt and Indy just begin to start driving with the motorcycle. At the beginning, they have cgi faces, when they drive through the sunlight in the same shot, the faces seem to be their own ones again. Very confusing.
 
S

Sankara

Guest
@jaydee
Yes, you are right. I guess this one of the problems of this movie. We wanted REAL stunts... and not "faces being digitally superimposed over the stunt guys"... :sick:
 
Major West

Major West

Member
Sankara said:
@jaydee
Yes, you are right. I guess this one of the problems of this movie. We wanted REAL stunts... and not "faces being digitally superimposed over the stunt guys"... :sick:
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Would you prefer that we see it's stunt peoples faces or would you prefer to see the actors faces on stuntmen?
 
I

Indy's brother

New member
Major West said:
Would you prefer that we see it's stunt peoples faces or would you prefer to see the actors faces on stuntmen?
Click to expand...

Yeah, either way it's not going to be the actors doing everything. It is a movie, after all.
 
L

Lambonius

New member
Well, as "glaring" as those CGI face transplants in KOTCS are (I never noticed them until they were pointed out here,) they're nowhere near as glaring as the scene in Temple of Doom where Willie comes into the spike room freaking out over the bugs and you see Harrison's stunt double close-up, clear as day kneeling there and looking up at her instead of Harrison. Not sure where he was during that take, but it's definitely not him; see for yourself. You don't notice it right away because the focus is on Willie during that shot.
 
U

Udvarnoky

Well-known member
Sankara said:
@jaydee
Yes, you are right. I guess this one of the problems of this movie. We wanted REAL stunts... and not "faces being digitally superimposed over the stunt guys"... :sick:
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Errr...the stunts were still real.
 
Finn

Finn

Moderator
Staff member
Sankara said:
I guess we all wanted it the same way as in Raiders, Temple and Crusade.
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Vague shots taken from distance and bad trick imagery?

I fail to see how that's somehow better than few computer-enchanched shots. Not worse either, of course. But in any case, neither one is perfect.

Udvarnoky said:
Errr...the stunts were still real.
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C'mon... how dare you argue with the only REAL movie expert in these parts?
<small>(Say "Thank you" and you're banned. That's a promise.)</small>
 
Finn

Finn

Moderator
Staff member
Sankara said:
There is a differnce between a real stunt scene and CGI-Stunt-Scene...
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That being?

"Err... they used computers with the other. Yeah."
 
U

Udvarnoky

Well-known member
Sankara said:
@Udvarnoky
You know what I mean. There is a differnce between a real stunt scene and CGI-Stunt-Scene...
Click to expand...

It's not a "CGI stunt scene." It was a real stunt scene with real stunts by real stunt men, just like in the old movies. It would be one thing if the actual performances were CGI-enhanced, but they weren't (not in the campus chase, anyway). Spielberg did the exact same thing in Jurassic Park in the scene where what's her face almost gets her legs chomped off by the leaping raptor when climbing back into the air vent.

You could argue that simply not altering the stunt guys' faces on the motorcycle wouldn't have been any more noticeable than some of the glaring cases in the original trilogy, but either way it's something you have to actively look for to notice. The bottom line is that some guy actually crashed through the gate.
 
Stoo

Stoo

Well-known member
Udvarnoky said:
Spielberg did the exact same thing in Jurassic Park in the scene where what's her face almost gets her legs chomped off by the leaping raptor when climbing back into the air vent.
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Quite right and (although not a face) there is a shot when Indy is hanging onto broken rope bridge in "Doom" where his legs are animated. They were cut off from the blue-screen.

Finn said:
C'mon... how dare you argue with the only REAL movie expert in these parts?
(Say "Thank you" and you're banned. That's a promise.)
Click to expand...
Rather than Banana Islands, does The Raven have a zoo? We musn't rid ourselves of such a rare species.
The kind for people to gawk at, point and occasionally feed peanuts.
 
Finn

Finn

Moderator
Staff member
Stoo said:
Rather than Banana Islands, does The Raven have a zoo? We musn't rid ourselves of such a rare species.
The kind for people to gawk at, point and occasionally feed peanuts.
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Unfortunately some of these specimen put out so much s**t that we'd have trouble finding people to clean the cages.

Better to just let them trump the wilderness.
 
S

Sankara

Guest
Finn said:
Unfortunately some of these specimen put out so much s**t that we'd have trouble finding people to clean the cages.
QUOTE]

Yes, you are soooo right with this! :D


Vague shots taken from distance and bad trick imagery????
*LOL*

For example: The REAL Ford is running away from the boulder...

The REAL Ford is dragging behind a car...

The REAL Ford is hanging between the tank and the stonewall

The REAL Ford is driving the Motorbike in LC

and so on... and so son... :D



@Udvarnoky
In the finished movie it's a "CGI stunt scene" because "faces being digitally superimposed over the stunt guys".
Click to expand...
 
C

caats

New member
Sankara said:
Finn said:
Unfortunately some of these specimen put out so much s**t that we'd have trouble finding people to clean the cages.
QUOTE]

Yes, you are soooo right with this! :D


Vague shots taken from distance and bad trick imagery????
*LOL*

For example: The REAL Ford is running away from the boulder...

The REAL Ford is dragging behind a car...

The REAL Ford is hanging between the tank and the stonewall

The REAL Ford is driving the Motorbike in LC

and so on... and so son... :D



@Udvarnoky
In the finished movie it's a "CGI stunt scene" because "faces being digitally superimposed over the stunt guys".
Click to expand...

ok, and the real Ford runs across the boxes, jumps off the ceiling rafters, swings from the roof, does his fights.

haha wait, you don't know what you're even trying to say. This thread was about stunt men having faces of the actor's put on them. Weren't even talking about Ford doing stunts. it's like you think Harrison did every single stunt in the old movies which is obviously not true. He did everything in Skull he would have done in the old days. You're just talking utter nonsense as usual.
Click to expand...
 
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