Pre-History and God

ClintonHammond · Sep 11, 2006

"if it is what it claims it is"

That's way too big an IF for this cat.....

"to find his own faith"
What's the quote?? "Faith doesn't make good science, curiosity does."

Finn · Sep 11, 2006

Nicely done. There's nothing more frustrating than dismissal of your point by simply ignoring it.

Doc Savage said:
I believe as we progress in our scientific endeavors, we'll find more and more that science and the literally-read Bible are completely compatible.

But what if it goes the completely other way? How much more proof does it take to turn the heads in THAT direction?

Doc Savage said:
I agree, Finn...it's time the Body of Christ reinvigorated this practice. But it's done when people take it upon themselves to find out what the Bible says for themselves, not what a teacher, pastor, or critical scientist says that it says.

Now there's something interesting. What would happen if ALL the people suddenly stopped "teaching" religion and simply talked about it among those who already share the same beliefs. And by this, I mean most importantly the things we keep telling our youth... wouldn't it be the best they picked it up by themselves instead of being told so in churches and, to some extent, schools?

ClintonHammond · Sep 11, 2006

"we'll find more and more that science and the literally-read Bible are completely compatible"

Well, it's sure not looking that way now, nor has it.... so I don't see any indications that it's going to reverse it's trend.....

intergamer · Sep 11, 2006

fortuneandglory said:
Good god, I never said ANYTHING about the great flood! I'm just making a comment on how sometimes carbon dating can be inaccurate! Take it for what you will, but I'm tired of being insulted! I know how carbon dating works... and I know that it is accurate in quite a few cases. Just not past 50,000 years... get any farther than that, and you're going to get some wacky results.

So you agree that the earth is at least 50,000 years old?

i mean.. face it, the earth is billions of years old, that's not something that was just made up by some cult of scientists trying to screw around with religious types

Doc Savage · Sep 11, 2006

fortuneandglory said:
The Pastors, or Preachers, are not these controlling megalomaniacs that some make them out to be...

I know... I AM a pastor. And I also know that there ARE plenty megalomaniacs in the pulpit.

Johan · Sep 11, 2006

The fact is that science CANNOT proove there is no God. It's impossible. I mean its GOD! He could have easily created the earth so that many will think it is billions of years old. Maybe dinosaurs didn't exist! God could have just as easily put bones in the rocks to facinate our minds (which he loves to do). That being said, there are millions of supernatural things he has done in the history of the world and continues to do. He will reveal whatever he desires of himself and his creation, our feeble minds will never be able to comprehend his depth... This is why King David said, "One thing I ask, one thing I will seek after; to dwell in the house of the Lord and behold his beauty all the day's of my life." There are endless mysteries and revelations when you gaze on his beauty and his creation in science and in the supernatural (of course to God, they are one in the same).

Pale Horse · Sep 11, 2006

IndyJohan said:
Maybe dinosaurs didn't exist!

You and I are on the same boat, but even the Bible makes references to man and dinosaurs. See Job 40, particulary starting with verse 15ff. It's written in the presense tense, too. Something worth considering.

IAdventurer01 · Sep 11, 2006

IndyJohan said:
Maybe dinosaurs didn't exist! God could have just as easily put bones in the rocks to facinate our minds (which he loves to do).

That... that's so cruel, though it is certainly possible. God must have a great sense of humor!

fortuneandglory · Sep 11, 2006

intergamer said:
So you agree that the earth is at least 50,000 years old?

i mean.. face it, the earth is billions of years old, that's not something that was just made up by some cult of scientists trying to screw around with religious types

Yes, I do. The earth is billions of years old... It's just that we don't know how long God's days were... when man was made, the earth was already aged...

fortuneandglory · Sep 11, 2006

Pale Horse said:
You and I are on the same boat, but even the Bible makes references to man and dinosaurs. See Job 40, particulary starting with verse 15ff. It's written in the presense tense, too. Something worth considering.

By the way, that IS a very interesting passage... I don't presume to know all the answers, so I'm keeping my mind open to Old earth and Young Earth Ideas...

intergamer · Sep 11, 2006

"That being said, there are millions of supernatural things he has done in the history of the world and continues to do."

That's wrong.

Finn · Sep 11, 2006

IndyJohan said:
The fact is that science CANNOT proove there is no God. It's impossible. I mean its GOD!

I was... kind of waiting for this one to pop up. True, that's one way to explain it, but it can also be nothing but simply more proof towards the fact people like living in denial... but let's not jump into conclusions here. But still, why would the Dude do things that certainly suggest He doesn't exist? Unless, of course... He wants just that! Quick, stop believing in Him! Can't you take a hint? He hates being a celebrity!

Ah, to think about it... the Pearly Gates, a bunch of religious people trying in:
"Man, how many more idiots are there down there? I just pop my head down there for a while couple of thousand years ago and all you go ape? I'm not bloody Elvis you know! Eternity in Hell for you... and an entrance pass to these guys here who were dubious enough to believe nothing but their own eyes. You complain? Yeah, yeah. Goodbye, jerks."

Now, there's something I'd almost LIKE to believe...

fortuneandglory · Sep 12, 2006

intergamer said:
"That being said, there are millions of supernatural things he has done in the history of the world and continues to do."

That's wrong.

Oh, THATS real science there. No opinions or bias in that one.

Doc Savage · Sep 12, 2006

Finn said:
Quick, stop believing in Him! Can't you take a hint? He hates being a celebrity!

LOL

In actuality, Jesus told many that He healed and performed miracles for to keep it to themselves...

Johan · Sep 12, 2006

Finn said:
I was... kind of waiting for this one to pop up. True, that's one way to explain it, but it can also be nothing but simply more proof towards the fact people like living in denial... but let's not jump into conclusions here. But still, why would the Dude do things that certainly suggest He doesn't exist? Unless, of course... He wants just that! Quick, stop believing in Him! Can't you take a hint? He hates being a celebrity!

Ah, to think about it... the Pearly Gates, a bunch of religious people trying in:
"Man, how many more idiots are there down there? I just pop my head down there for a while couple of thousand years ago and all you go ape? I'm not bloody Elvis you know! Eternity in Hell for you... and an entrance pass to these guys here who were dubious enough to believe nothing but their own eyes. You complain? Yeah, yeah. Goodbye, jerks."

Now, there's something I'd almost LIKE to believe...

Because he desires faith not for us to believe in only the what is seen (that would be idolotry). His logic is not our logic, we cannot have any comprehension of why he does what he does, whatever we know of him is what he revealed of him-self. He is infinite in beauty and wonder. Time is not on a line to him, he sees it as a whole in one big blob as he is the Alpha and Omega (beggining and end). The end has already happened in his eyes.
He created hell because of his infinite love for humans. Because he is fully devoted to destroying all that hinders love, and anything that stands in the way of a pure bride (humanity) for his son. Scripture say's "jealousy is the husbands fury" and "God is jealous". His wrath comes when we have given our hearts to the world when they belong to Him. The translation for the word for "fire" in hell is the same word for "God's fire". He is a consuming fire (as scripture say's). We will all walk through that fire and it will consume everything that is not of Him...and hopefully it is not your heart.

Johan · Sep 12, 2006

intergamer said:
"That being said, there are millions of supernatural things he has done in the history of the world and continues to do."

That's wrong.

Has your head been in a hole?....I've seen it firsthand countless times. God is obsessed with man, he loves to meddle in man's affairs. He loves to facinate the human mind with his enormity. Hey, he even became a human, because he is so in love with us.

Finn · Sep 12, 2006

IndyJohan said:
He is a consuming fire (as scripture say's). We will all walk through that fire and it will consume everything that is not of Him...and hopefully it is not your heart.

That's what you BELIEVE, not what it has been PROVEN, please always keep it in mind.

Plus, the theory of God creating dinosaur remains is such a violation to Occam's razor it makes my heart bleed...

Doc Savage · Sep 12, 2006

Finn said:
Plus, the theory of God creating dinosaur remains is such a violation to Occam's razor it makes my heart bleed...

I believe what has been credited as legendary dragons were in actuality dinosaurs. Even fire-breathing isn't too far-fetched...the bombardier beetle effectively is a living flamethrower. According to Job concerning Leviathan:
By his neesings a light doth shine, and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning.
Out of his mouth go burning lamps, and sparks of fire leap out.
Out of his nostrils goeth smoke, as out of a seething pot or caldron.
His breath kindleth coals, and a flame goeth out of his mouth.
Job 41:18-21

The Bible also mentions Behemoth, which some have tried to write off as an elephant or hippopotamus. But read:
Behold now behemoth, which I made with thee; he eateth grass as an ox.
Lo now, his strength is in his loins, and his force is in the navel of his belly.
He moveth his tail like a cedar: the sinews of his stones are wrapped together.
His bones are as strong pieces of brass; his bones are like bars of iron.
He is the chief of the ways of God: he that made him can make his sword to approach unto him.
Surely the mountains bring him forth food, where all the beasts of the field play.
He lieth under the shady trees, in the covert of the reed, and fens.
The shady trees cover him with their shadow; the willows of the brook compass him about.
Behold, he drinketh up a river, and hasteth not: he trusteth that he can draw up Jordan into his mouth.
He taketh it with his eyes: his nose pierceth through snares.
Job 40:15-24
I submit to you that neither the elephant or the hippopotamus have a tail like a cedar. And note that God said that He created behemoth with man.

Johan · Sep 12, 2006

That's good and all...but it say's nothing about the tail being the size of a cedar...just its movements. I don't deny the possiblity of it being a dinosaur tho.
And I'm not saying there were no dinosaurs, I'm just saying with God it is possible that there were no dinosaurs. The bible also tells us that "The God of heaven laughs" I'm sure watching our little human brains trying to figure out his creation is part of that.

Finn said:
That's what you BELIEVE, not what it has been PROVEN, please always keep it in mind. Plus, the theory of God creating dinosaur remains is such a violation to Occam's razor it makes my heart bleed...

These things (not the dinosaur thing; the judgement thing) have been confirmed in my heart and proven in scripture (but not proven to the unbelieving) that I believe is infallable. I'm not saying you have to believe it, but my beliefs are what are going to save my heart in the time of judgement, so I will speak of it as fact, because I know it to be...whether you do or don't.

Finn · Sep 12, 2006

IndyJohan said:
I'm not saying you have to believe it, but my beliefs are what are going to save my heart in the time of judgement, so I will speak of it as fact, because I know it to be...whether you do or don't.

This is the most annoying in thing in some religious types. They won't be polite enough to understand that matters of faith are something you shouldn't state as facts. It doesn't matter how much one knows or doesn't know, it doesn't boil down to that... But to understanding that as long as there is a subject people have different views on, one should keep from admitting the "absolute truth" unless there really is a way to show it.

There world would be a lot better place without less conflicts if people said "I can, of course, be wrong" if out of nothing more than sheer courtesy. It's not really the way one harbors his or her faith, but the way he or she represents it.

<small>Yes, I may be wrong with the above statement.</small>

Pre-History and God

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