Serious Question - Why does Lucas still command respect?

Jenos Idanian

New member
Indyana Joana said:
You can vent. That's your right. Just don't expect everyone to think the way you do. AND, pleeaase, stop that foul language. There's a lady in the house ... me! :gun:


My apologies on the language (although it is blanked out). I really don't expect everyone to think the same way I do, I'm speaking for myself. I never said I was speaking on anyones behalf other than my own.
 

Jenos Idanian

New member
No Ticket said:
Regardless of how you feel about Lucas now. He came up with Indiana Jones AND Star Wars. COUNTLESS numbers of people developed his ideas into the final product. It worked six times. Three Star Wars movies and three Indy films. It was through luck mostly that it all worked out for him. If you think about it, really it was mostly only twice it worked out because a lot of the SAME PEOPLE worked on each subsequent sequel in those franchises so he had already found the magic blend of people.

When the prequels started he had some good ideas but overall... his ideas were affected by tons of other people that developed the movie into what it is. His directing probably didn't help much either. He only directed the first SW after all.

And really his best ideas are almost the same idea. Star wars was the idea to make a film based on old sat. matinée sci-fi type serials and Indy was just the other side of the coin... why not an adventure serial one too!!

It was all luck. He happened into Harrison Ford for both series... etc.


George didn't make this new Indy movie by himself. So I mean, you can blame him all day but really I think there was a lot of people who are at fault. But I don't think anyone was trying to screw it up. It was different people trying to recapture something others did 20+ years ago.

Plus all of them are older now. And I think there's just a spark to people in their youth that drive them to do their very best and prove themselves... something lost in time with age and success.

I totally agree that others should share the blame this time around. But I can't shake the feeling that Lucas was at the fore front of this. It's been said that he would only make this movie if they went with his idea. Then it was just a matter of time until Ford and Spielberg gave in.
 

IrishLuck1980

New member
Well, all in all. Indiana Jones was based on old 30s action serials. Not 50s B SciFi movies. That is mostly the reason why this movie didn't work. And you know damn well if they make Indiana Jones V, it's going to have Marian and Mutt back. And one more thing because this is bothering me. Mutt Williams real name is Henry Jones III. So, how did he not know Colin Williams was not his real father?
 

No Ticket

New member
Jenos Idanian said:
I totally agree that others should share the blame this time around. But I can't shake the feeling that Lucas was at the fore front of this. It's been said that he would only make this movie if they went with his idea. Then it was just a matter of time until Ford and Spielberg gave in.

The skull/alien idea isn't really all that bad. Especially if you sit down and really think about what other options they would've had and how that would've wound up. It's the execution of the idea. The script mainly... that is the problem.

It COULD have worked even with Lucas' idea. And we have no idea who came up with what specifically, like the monkeys, you'd like to assume it was Lucas but you might be wrong.

Lucas f'd up the prequels he obviously MUST be the reason everything sucked. *that's sarcasm*

... and although I seem to sound negative, I largely enjoyed the film and I do like it... but I am definitely aware of it's problems.
 

Indyana Joana

New member
No Ticket said:
Regardless of how you feel about Lucas now. He came up with Indiana Jones AND Star Wars. COUNTLESS numbers of people developed his ideas into the final product. It worked six times. Three Star Wars movies and three Indy films. It was through luck mostly that it all worked out for him. If you think about it, really it was mostly only twice it worked out because a lot of the SAME PEOPLE worked on each subsequent sequel in those franchises so he had already found the magic blend of people.

When the prequels started he had some good ideas but overall... his ideas were affected by tons of other people that developed the movie into what it is. His directing probably didn't help much either. He only directed the first SW after all.

And really his best ideas are almost the same idea. Star wars was the idea to make a film based on old sat. matinée sci-fi type serials and Indy was just the other side of the coin... why not an adventure serial one too!!

It was all luck. He happened into Harrison Ford for both series... etc.


George didn't make this new Indy movie by himself. So I mean, you can blame him all day but really I think there was a lot of people who are at fault. But I don't think anyone was trying to screw it up. It was different people trying to recapture something others did 20+ years ago.

Plus all of them are older now. And I think there's just a spark to people in their youth that drive them to do their very best and prove themselves... something lost in time with age and success.

I have not seen the movie yet. ... Kudos to you NO TICKET. You have spoken a lot of wisdom here. I think you are on to something. The problem is the people and time. PEOPLE are expecting a story from TIME past. PEOPLE change with TIME, like friends we grew up with in high school. When we see them again, we expect things to be the same... but they're not. WE have had the opportunity to see Indiana Jones again. He is a dear friend, but he has changed. I don't know about you, but I still love him the same!!! <3
 

IrishLuck1980

New member
Yeah, Indy's changed. Yeah, keep making excuses for the failure of this film. This movie was garbage. I just tried watching it for the 6th time and had to turn it off when they arrived in Peru. I'm watching Raiders now.
 

Jenos Idanian

New member
IrishLuck1980 said:
Well, all in all. Indiana Jones was based on old 30s action serials. Not 50s B SciFi movies. That is mostly the reason why this movie didn't work. And you know damn well if they make Indiana Jones V, it's going to have Marian and Mutt back. And one more thing because this is bothering me. Mutt Williams real name is Henry Jones III. So, how did he not know Colin Williams was not his real father?


Lucas just comes up with "ideas" and leaves the details to other people. That aspect of the film doesn't bother me. Anything can be nit-picked if you try. What bothers me are the things you can't ignore like prairie dogs. They said that they only used cg when it was necessary. Why did they feel it was necessary to make CG animals? That just smells very Lucas to me.
 

Avilos

Active member
IrishLuck1980 said:
Yeah, Indy's changed. Yeah, keep making excuses for the failure of this film. This movie was garbage. I just tried watching it for the 6th time and had to turn it off when they arrived in Peru. I'm watching Raiders now.

Ok now your lying or just ridiculous! Why would you watch a movie 6 times you hate?
 

IrishLuck1980

New member
Jenos Idanian said:
Lucas just comes up with "ideas" and leaves the details to other people. That aspect of the film doesn't bother me. Anything can be nit-picked if you try. What bothers me are the things you can't ignore like prairie dogs. They said that they only used cg when it was necessary. Why did they feel it was necessary to make CG animals? That just smells very Lucas to me.

Yeah, those Prairie Dogs were bad. Right off the bat, opening credits, CGI. GREAT!!! UGH:mad:
 

IrishLuck1980

New member
Avilos said:
Ok now your lying or just ridiculous! Why would you watch a movie 6 times you hate?

Because I WANT to like this movie. It's Indiana Jones. I desperately want to find something in this movie that jumps out at me and demands it's place in the Indiana Jones verse. But I can't find it.
 

No Ticket

New member
They tried very hard to make a great film, if you don't like it... you can at least thank them for trying their best and giving you a new Indiana Jones. Sometimes things just don't work out. That's life, unfortunately.

We all knew we didn't really need another Indy anyway.
 

IrishLuck1980

New member
No Ticket said:
They tried very hard to make a great film, if you don't like it... you can at least thank them for trying their best. Sometimes things just don't work out. That's life, unfortunately.

Thank them you say? Are you mad? I wish the film was never made and they let the series how it was. A landmark in Film-Making History. Now it feels tainted. Not as bad as Star Wars is, but still...
 

Dust McAlan

New member
This is amazing to me. It's absolutely amazing to me how we can ask here how it is that George "THX, Star Wars, Indiana Jones, ILM, LucasArts" Lucas still commands respect.

The man is a pioneer. His latest work has been pretty bad, but I'm guessing what Lucas really needs is someone to translate his work. The prequel trilogy was filled with some good ideas, some bad ideas, and some GREAT ideas; the problem with them was that it felt like Lucas took the first draft of his screenplay and shot it. I think he's an amazing idea man. He comes up with this wild and crazy **** that nobody else seems to fathom, but when he writes or directs it the vision gets lost in translation. Jar Jar Binks might have been edited out by a more competent screenwriter. And Crystal Skull's MacGuffin was actually pretty interesting, but lacking in the mystique we've come to expect of Indiana Jones. Had we NOT seen an actual Grey Alien at the end or the Flying Saucer, it would have been better than Temple. The allusion of aliens rather than the physical presence of aliens would have made this film a lot lot lot lot better, but unfortunately David Koepp is the kind of screenwriter who doesn't do subtlety, and left in Lucas' UFO idea.

Lucas has mores ideas in his little finger than most of us on the forums here have in a week. I'd really like to see how you guys could have done this better, because I'm hearing a lot pretentious crap about how Lucas has fallen off. Come on, guys; do you really think you could do better than the pioneer of Star Wars and Indiana Jones?
 

Dust McAlan

New member
IrishLuck1980 said:
Thank them you say? Are you mad? I wish the film was never made and they let the series how it was. A landmark in Film-Making History. Now it feels tainted. Not as bad as Star Wars is, but still...
So here's what you do: ignore Crystal Skull. The other three films still exist and haven't been changed. There you go.
 

No Ticket

New member
IrishLuck1980 said:
Thank them you say? Are you mad? I wish the film was never made and they let the series how it was. A landmark in Film-Making History. Now it feels tainted. Not as bad as Star Wars is, but still...

I don't really care that it was made because guess what... I can still watch the originals, they didn't go anywhere. You were excited to see it just as much as they were excited to make it.

It didn't turn out well for them or you, no one could know that. Everyone "kind of" wanted to see Indy back but knew they didn't need it. It's so easy to blame them for doing it but they also gave you the originals you love so much too.

I've seen years of Lucas bashing... **** it. I'm sick of hearing about it.
 

Jenos Idanian

New member
Dust McAlan said:
This is amazing to me. It's absolutely amazing to me how we can ask here how it is that George "THX, Star Wars, Indiana Jones, ILM, LucasArts" Lucas still commands respect.

The man is a pioneer. His latest work has been pretty bad, but I'm guessing what Lucas really needs is someone to translate his work. The prequel trilogy was filled with some good ideas, some bad ideas, and some GREAT ideas; the problem with them was that it felt like Lucas took the first draft of his screenplay and shot it. I think he's an amazing idea man. He comes up with this wild and crazy **** that nobody else seems to fathom, but when he writes or directs it the vision gets lost in translation. Jar Jar Binks might have been edited out by a more competent screenwriter. And Crystal Skull's MacGuffin was actually pretty interesting, but lacking in the mystique we've come to expect of Indiana Jones. Had we NOT seen an actual Grey Alien at the end or the Flying Saucer, it would have been better than Temple. The allusion of aliens rather than the physical presence of aliens would have made this film a lot lot lot lot better, but unfortunately David Koepp is the kind of screenwriter who doesn't do subtlety, and left in Lucas' UFO idea.

Lucas has mores ideas in his little finger than most of us on the forums here have in a week. I'd really like to see how you guys could have done this better, because I'm hearing a lot pretentious crap about how Lucas has fallen off. Come on, guys; do you really think you could do better than the pioneer of Star Wars and Indiana Jones?

Damn straight, Lucas does have good ideas. I just wish he would leave everything else to other people like Spielberg.
 

No Ticket

New member
Jenos Idanian said:
Damn straight, Lucas does have good ideas. I just wish he would leave everything else to other people like Spielberg.

You have no idea what impact he had on various details of the story. It's easy to blame him because he did the prequels (he is the CGI devil) ... lots of people, including Spielberg could have their say.

If Lucas really was responsible for all the bad in this film, I'd say you should blame Spielberg or Ford for not beating the sense back into him or at least turning down the film for good and having the sense not to make it.
 
Top