Mathematical curiosity

Jay R. Zay

Jay R. Zay

New member
qafir said:
You Germans are obviously disadvantaged by losing those two world wars. Isn't it a shame the French always beat you?
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i'm sure you now want to tell us about your knowledge of world wars and then google "thousands of thousands" of people who also don't know about these things... right? ;) i for one don't remember france beating anyone in world war II, but so much just for the record. it actually would have saved a lot of time if they had.

about the rest, well, this was pretty entertaining but you might want to read my reply again, and think about whether you really made a smart move with this reply. or not. :) to agree with the staff for once, this discussion was over before you bothered to reply. no need for you to tell me you dislike me. open a "why i hate jay" thread and cry around there. *here* you were wrong and, in your arrogant ways, surely are not the one to complain that i didn't inform you politely about this. over and out.
 
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qafir

New member
And what happened to the Abel Prize, the Nemmers Prize, and the Nevanlinna Prize? Germans have NEVER won. I must speak to someone about this. Perhaps we could institute some form of affirmative action policy. You Germans are obviously disadvantaged by losing those two world wars. Isn't it a shame the French always beat you? Please don't drown yourself in beer or anything rash like that.
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Jay, once again, your inability to read amuses me. In language, there's a concept called, "context." You might want to study up on it some time...:whip:

P.S. I'm so very disapointed you had nothing to say in defense of Germany...I thought it was highly amusing that France consistently beats you in all the mathematics awards.:whip: :whip:
 
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intergamer

New member
vaxer said:
I'm not asking you to prove that in an Integral domain φa is injective, it's part of the definition. you have to prove that φa is injective in a field.

ok, well here's the "official" solution to this exercice:

given a belonging to I, φa: I -> I: x -> ax
φa(x)=φa(y)
a*x = a*y
a*a^(-1)*x = a*a^(-1)*y
x = y, meaning φa stays injective of I into I.

also, since I is finit, φa is surjective: x exists so that φa(x)=1.
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I don't know what you're talking about. it is sufficient to find a multiplicative inverse for any element of the finite integral domain, and I did so. integral domains and field are very closely related.. there's no distinction here between a proof "within an integral domain" or "within a field"
 
Jay R. Zay

Jay R. Zay

New member
qafir said:
P.S. I'm so very disapointed you had nothing to say in defense of Germany...I thought it was highly amusing that France consistently beats you in all the mathematics awards.:whip: :whip:
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if you had this ability to read, that you are missing in me, you would see why i don't have to defend germany. as you entirely failed to understand my post and as you unfortunately didn't reconsider so far, i think you are the one who is highly amusing at the moment. :)
 
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qafir

New member
Jay, seriously, you're embarrasing yourself.

Originally Posted by Jay R. Zay
because you're not german, it's as simple as that. everybody knows that outside germany, all people are idiots*. i did a great service to my vaterland and our führer by fighting you. there's nothing bad about displaying the german superiority. it's my duty, just as it is your duty as a foreigner to write stupid posts and get corrected by me. i've accepted my role, you should accept yours, as well.

______
* especially the french, that's why we can ignore intergamer's and vaxer's replies altogether. no matter how nice you thought they were.
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I quite humbly submitted

Oh, bunny, I’m so sorry I irritated you. I can see why you NEED to defend your vaterland. You poor Germans are constantly under attack mathematically. For example, there are all those awful dwedful meen meen bad peopwel at all those mathematical foundations that discriminate against you.

With such an anti-German bias, I can’t believe the Fields Medal is still considered the award with the highest prestige given to mathematicians. How could that be, when Frenchmen have won it nine times since 1936? And what sort of bribes do the US, Russia, and Japan make to “buy” their repeated awards? It must only be German pride and integrity that keeps “your” mathematicians from corrupting the awards committee. Because you’ve only won the prize once. At least you’re keeping up with Finland and Australia, though…

Of course, Germans do much better in the Wolf prize, founded by a German. They’ve picked up two awards. Granted, nothing since 1988...but the French seem to do well, at least.

I hate that your mathematical patriotism is so assaulted all the time. Would it make you feel better to give me a math lesson, oh guru? If a German won the Schock prize once, and Americans won five times, and it’s only been awarded seven times, how much better does the US perform statistically?

And what happened to the Abel Prize, the Nemmers Prize, and the Nevanlinna Prize? Germans have NEVER won. I must speak to someone about this. Perhaps we could institute some form of affirmative action policy. You Germans are obviously disadvantaged by losing those two world wars. Isn't it a shame the French always beat you? Please don't drown yourself in beer or anything rash like that.
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Jay, I love you. It makes me so very happy to think of you sitting at your keyboard, fuming and unable to respond. It brings me joy that you're a bigot from an inferior race (at least mathematically. Have you considered moving to France?). How does that feel?

Any time you're willing to read my posts and respond to them, please send me a private message. I'm done with this thread now.

But before I go, let me clarify a few points:

1) You won the math point. I was an idiot, and an arrogant idiot, to boot.

2) The French consistently beat the Germans in coming up with original, creative contributions to mathematics.

3) You should take some writing classes.

:D
 
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Jay R. Zay

Jay R. Zay

New member
qafir said:
Jay, I love you. It makes me so very happy to think of you sitting at your keyboard, fuming and unable to respond.
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...waiting for you to notice the sarcasm in my previous statements that obviously must have escaped you somehow. :) did this shake your happiness? i seriously don't see what i should be fuming about, considering the fact that i barely need to write a reply (any reply, in fact) to have you make a clown of yourself once again. no matter what i say, your attempts to say the very opposite of this are rather entertaining.

qafir said:
But before I go, let me clarify a few points:

1) You won the math point. I was an idiot, and an arrogant idiot, to boot.
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:confused: so what? i know; i told you so like 60 posts before...

qafir said:
2) The French consistently beat the Germans in coming up with original, creative contributions to mathematics.
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my nazi statements about my duty to defend my superior vaterland obviously match your idea of the average german so perfectly that you never even considered me being sarcastic, did you? :) unfortunately, i'm entirely un-patriotic so i can't really say i feel responsible for this mathematical weakness in my fellow countrymen. actually, i just feel responsibly for myself. and so should you. and this very situation isn't about my country or your country or vaxer's semi-country, it's rather about you and me. as you've said in 1): you idiot, me right. it's more simple this way, isn't it? :)

qafir said:
3) You should take some writing classes.
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wouldn't it be enough to claim that my language is perfect and you must be wrong? i'm sure google will find me "thousands of thousands" of people whose ideas of english don't match yours...

finally, stop critizising my language, kid. you failed on such a common ground as maths, i'd really like to see you acting behind enemy lines. want to give a sample of your german?

keeping up that little tiny rest of arrogance and self-confidence is hard, isn't it? the façade is crumbling away.
 
vaxer

vaxer

Moderator Emeritus
intergamer said:
I don't know what you're talking about. it is sufficient to find a multiplicative inverse for any element of the finite integral domain, and I did so. integral domains and field are very closely related.. there's no distinction here between a proof "within an integral domain" or "within a field"
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Well, it's just that if I compare your solution with the "official" solution, it looks like something's missing.
 
Jay R. Zay

Jay R. Zay

New member
intergamer said:
shut up, boys. i'm trying to talk to vaxer.
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no need so. :rolleyes: vaxer is right. you explain the missing aspects with the fact, that they are part of the definition of a finite integral domain. but to proof that something is a field, you need to prove every quality a field must have. you can't just say "it's obvious", even though it may be obvious.

in the end, everything can be obvious. this whole matter is obvious. just as it is obvious that |Q is a subgroup of |R. but a proof is not supposed to make everyone believe. it's supposed to trace every step of the way in clear maths. you're right about the solution but vaxer is right about the missing part of the proof. k?
 
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intergamer

New member
Jay R. Zay said:
no need so. :rolleyes: vaxer is right. you explain the missing aspects with the fact, that they are part of the definition of a finite integral domain. but to proof that something is a field, you need to prove every quality a field must have. you can't just say "it's obvious", even though it may be obvious.

in the end, everything can be obvious. this whole matter is obvious. just as it is obvious that |Q is a subgroup of |R. but a proof is not supposed to make everyone believe. it's supposed to trace every step of the way in clear maths. you're right about the solution but vaxer is right about the missing part of the proof. k?
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No, not ok. Thanks for the lesson about what a proof is (I am done with my degree in mathematics). My solution and vaxer's official one are just different. A field is an integral domain with only 1 additional property, that every nonzero element has a multiplicative inverse. That is all that needs to be proven.
 
Jay R. Zay

Jay R. Zay

New member
intergamer said:
No, not ok. Thanks for the lesson about what a proof is (I am done with my degree in mathematics). My solution and vaxer's official one are just different. A field is an integral domain with only 1 additional property, that every nonzero element has a multiplicative inverse. That is all that needs to be proven.
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you may be right. at my university, we've been taught that a proof needs to prove every quality of the result. my tutors frequently complained about my proofs not being elaborately enough and frankly, i believe that they would have this to say about your proof, while i'm sure vaxer's proof would rather match the requirements (which i don't usually match myself, either).

however, as i've said, i see your point and i have to admit that it doesn't leave any real questions unanswered. sorry for this.
 
vaxer

vaxer

Moderator Emeritus
The thing I've never liked with abstract algebra, it's that it hardly applies anywhere in physics. It's like some sort intellectual masturbation.

I know it's applies to some braches of "theorical physics", but I personnaly never encountered any left primitive ideals during the five years I've studied physics.
 
Jay R. Zay

Jay R. Zay

New member
vaxer said:
The thing I've never liked with abstract algebra, it's that it hardly applies anywhere in physics. It's like some sort intellectual masturbation.

I know it's applies to some braches of "theorical physics", but I personnaly never encountered any left primitive ideals during the five years I've studied physics.
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well, the solutions you find might become useful later. and if they don't, see it just as a step to revealing the greatness of maths. i expect that some day, all natural sciences will find their explanations in maths. understanding maths would be understanding the world. as computers, spaceflight and many other things show, you someday can use parts of maths that were just gray theory when they were developed.
 
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intergamer

New member
group theory is very applicable to physics, actually, and elsewhere, even simple things like ideals by extension. it has a lot of applications in applied physics especially in crystals, waveforms, and energy levels
it's only when you get into more specialized/advanced classes like commutative algebra and you're studying modules and so forth, that it becomes so obscure it might not ever be applied; intuitively at least its very easy to see how simple group theory is applicable theory, it's just a technique to abstract objects to an algebra for more fundamental analysis
 
Finn

Finn

Moderator
Staff member
Violet Indy said:
My head hurts looking at this thread :confused:
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Canyon said:
But then again, maths was never really my strongest subject... :)
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That being the case, could I interest you ladies in an avatar from our... special collection?

avyb.PNG


Gee... math and whipcracking is soo hard!


<small>Time to duck and cover... I just couldn't resist, forgive me.</small>
 
Canyon

Canyon

Well-known member
Why, you son of a $%@~#!!! :whip:

It's okay Finn. I forgive you. ;) Partially, because I guess I expected someone to reply to me in a sarcastic manner. :p

I consider myself to be an intelligent person, I have just always struggled with maths. (I am more of the creative type, as you know) (y)

BTW, nice avatar! :D
 
Finn

Finn

Moderator
Staff member
Well, I guess you all know what to expect from a dumb stooge like meself...
 
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ninepinejones

Member
magic number nine

The number nine in Taoism(Chinese philosophy) is the most highly regarded number. Nine times any # equals nine, for instance....9x3=27, 2+7=9 and so on and on and 9 plus any # ='s the number you add to it, example...9+2=11, 1+1=2 and so and on. The Taoist's have their most famous Sage who was Lao Tzu, Lao Tzu wrote a book of poems describing the philosophy of Taoism, the book contains 81 poems....8+1=9 and the Taoist Sage Chang sang Feng who created Tai Chi created the martial art to have 108 changes or postures...you can see where Im going with this...In tai chi Yang style there are nine kicks, nine cloud hands, nine brush knees and so on and on. The Taoists are also famous for creating Acupuncture, in acupuncture there is the nine needle technique which was used in to alleviate ghost rambling or in catholic terms...demonic possesion, I use the technique today in modern times for Bi-polar and shcizophrenia which in ancient times was reffered to "ghost rambling". The most powerful point in acupuncture, the point which has more literature written about it than any other point is Zusanli or as its called in the west Stomach 36....3+6=9. There are nine planets and nine months in pregnancy and I find magic number nine winking its its hollowed eye when the yin and yang come together to form the Tai Chi symbol, the symbol for balance in the number 69. Later... from ninepinejones.;) :whip:
 
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