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Old 02-06-2018, 12:03 PM   #476
Randy_Flagg
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Originally Posted by Udvarnoky
Sure, you can't be having an Indy who is in his 70s jumping from a horse to a moving tank, but that kind of thing was never really the essence of the older movies.
Wasn't it, though? I mean, the truck chase sequence in Raiders is one of the most iconic scenes in the series, especially Indy falling under the truck, and then being dragged behind it. And yet, it's something that would look absolutely ridiculous if they tried to convince us an 80 year old man was doing.

In TOD, the rope bridge sequence is perhaps the most iconic scene. It's a scene that required a LOT of physical exertion, and even when Indy was a much younger man, he was completely exhausted by the end of it. So there's no way an audience will be convinced that an 80 year man could do it.

The tank chase sequence in LC was the central action scene of that film, but again, it was something that left Indy completely exhausted even when he was much younger, so it would look silly having an 80 year old in a scene like that.

If they make an Indy movie that's devoid of anything resembling these classic Indy scenes, is there really a point to making it at all? Sure, Indy is known for some less physical stuff, too, but I'm just don't think audiences would really get excited about an Indiana Jones movie that doesn't have Indy solidly involved in any major physical action scenes.

I guess they'll rely mainly on vehicle chases for the action scenes, so Indy can just be sitting in a truck, or whatever, ramming bad guys off the road. And, sure, that can be fun, but they pretty much already took that approach with the jungle chase in KOTCS.
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Old 02-06-2018, 01:04 PM   #477
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Originally Posted by Randy_Flagg
If they make an Indy movie that's devoid of anything resembling these classic Indy scenes, is there really a point to making it at all?
No, there isn't. And Disney know that only too well.
Look what they did with Star Wars: it was back to the roots all the way, and they knocked it out of the park.

Why should it be any different with Indy?
My bet is that they are going to go back to all action movies, just like the first three were.
And I don't think that car chases and shootouts can fully replace pivotal physical action scenes like those you described, no way.
That's why I believe there is a strong chance in the next movie we may get flashback scenes with a younger actor playing Indy in his prime.

The Ford-led section of the movie will inevitably have to rely on a sidekick to provide support for this type of action, just like we saw in KOTCS. My bet is, this time it'll be a young lady in place of Mutt, some kind of Rey-like character.

Future prequels will feature a younger Indy only, so going back to the roots will be much easier.
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Old 02-06-2018, 01:36 PM   #478
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The Last Crusade really did a great job at tricking you into thinking Indy did more physical stuff than he actually did.

The boat chase and tank chase were both mostly Indy having relatively stationary fights (ie. not a lot of running or jumping around), that were made more "exciting" by being set on moving vehicles.
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Old 02-06-2018, 01:56 PM   #479
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As I've said before Indy means different things to different people.
Some enjoy the action and high risk stunts very much.
I want to see what the character of Indy (which I have loved ever since I was a kid) is up to at the tail end of his life. What's happened to him, how he's doing. Sure I want to see him to some cool stuff to prove he's still got it but that's not the draw of the series for me, the character is.

And that is probably why I don't want a recasting, since Ford is the character to me. I can see why people who are more into it for the action and set pieces don't care as much about who's playing Indy though, but for me it would be as if somebody took my friends clothes and just pretended to be my friend.

I would be more than happy with a more dramatic movie dealing with getting older and still having a purpose or something like that.
Though I'm pretty sure that's not what we're going to get as Ford and Spielberg seem to focus on the fun adventure and family movie part whenever Indy is brought up.
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Old 02-06-2018, 02:29 PM   #480
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To me, it's always been about the character. That's why I think it'd be down right asinine to let it die with the actor.

Harrison Ford is Indiana Jones, but Indiana Jones is not Harrison Ford.


Ford gave the character its best known face, but dozens of talented authors over the years have contributed to making the character what it is today - not just actors, but writers, directors, producers, artists, etc etc. And they've done it across multiple mediums. To give credit of all that to just one man is pretty gosh darn insulting to the rest of them.

And there are plenty more waiting to keep the character alive.
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Old 02-06-2018, 03:02 PM   #481
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Originally Posted by Silvor
I want to see what the character of Indy (which I have loved ever since I was a kid) is up to at the tail end of his life.
And as a long time fan, you have every right of feeling that way.
But you've got to realize that you are part of a tiny minority, a demographic which Disney is not likely to be worried about much, if at all.

They bought the IP to make $$$, period.
It's a business venture for them, no more. Show-business, entertainment, call it what you will, but business nonetheless.

This next movie has got to be make or break for the future of the franchise, surely.
There is no planned trilogy, like when "The Force Awakens" came out.
If they blow it with Indy 5, if it fails to revive the brand with young audiences, that's it.

Their main goal is not to wrap up old Indy's story satisfyingly for older fans - it's to build the foundations for future movies aimed at Disney's typical audiences.
And that's what they'll do, you can bet the house.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn
To me, it's always been about the character. That's why I think it'd be down right asinine to let it die with the actor.

Harrison Ford is Indiana Jones, but Indiana Jones is not Harrison Ford.


Ford gave the character its best known face, but dozens of talented authors over the years have contributed to making the character what it is today - not just actors, but writers, directors, producers, artists, etc etc. And they've done it across multiple mediums. To give credit of all that to just one man is pretty gosh darn insulting to the rest of them.

And there are plenty more waiting to keep the character alive.
Precisely.
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Old 02-07-2018, 01:04 AM   #482
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Originally Posted by Z dweller
And as a long time fan, you have every right of feeling that way.
But you've got to realize that you are part of a tiny minority, a demographic which Disney is not likely to be worried about much, if at all.

They bought the IP to make $$$, period.
It's a business venture for them, no more. Show-business, entertainment, call it what you will, but business nonetheless.

This next movie has got to be make or break for the future of the franchise, surely.
There is no planned trilogy, like when "The Force Awakens" came out.
If they blow it with Indy 5, if it fails to revive the brand with young audiences, that's it.

Their main goal is not to wrap up old Indy's story satisfyingly for older fans - it's to build the foundations for future movies aimed at Disney's typical audiences.
And that's what they'll do, you can bet the house.


Precisely.

Agreed with the above. Disney probably is taking a hard look at how Jurassic World took a dead franchise and revived it into being the #1 movie of the year. And that Superbowl trailer for Fallen Kingdom was the most watched from the Super Bowl too...

If they can repeat that with Indy, revive that brand for young audiences, I can imagine they will try their best to build a foundation for more movies. Get a big name like Pratt or Gosling to carry the franchise further.
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Old 02-07-2018, 04:13 AM   #483
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The bull**** "only Harrison can play Indy!" is as bad as "only Heath Ledger can ever play the Joker now".
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Old 02-07-2018, 11:02 AM   #484
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Originally Posted by JollyGreenSlugg
The bull**** "only Harrison can play Indy!" is as bad as "only Heath Ledger can ever play the Joker now".

Consider the Curious Case of Sherlock Holmes. Leaving aside the fact that Holmes originated as a literary creation of Conan Doyle, and was soon brought to the stage by William Gillette, the cinematic Holmes was indelibly associated with Basil Rathbone, who portrayed him in no less than 14 features between 1939 and 1946. Rathbone was Holmes, and that was that. Or so I thought.

And then along came Jeremy Brett, who absolutely nailed the character and made Holmes his own. Until his untimely death in 1995, Brett brought Holmes to life in some 41 productions. Remarkable fidelity to the original texts, fine acting and high production values didn't hurt, either. Brett was Holmes, the canonical works had been definitively produced, and that was that. Or so I thought.

All along, the canon had spawned admirers and imitators. A remarkable fan literature, notably August Derleth's Solar Pons stories, created a parallel alternate universe. George C. Scott's "They Might be Giants" (1971) was the leading edge of a wave that now includes Gene Wilder, Robert Downey, Jr., and most recently and Benedict Cumberbatch. And the diversity of portrayers increases: female, Asian. I would add black, but "A Black Sherlock Holmes" was made in 1918!

It's a flawed analogy, but what I take away is, if the spirit of Indiana Jones refuses to die, it will surface in expected and unexpected ways. Expected: video games (including Lara Croft), theme park attractions, screen imitations (Tales of the Gold Monkey in 1982; Brendan Fraser's Mummy franchise; Lara Croft again). Unexpected (by clueless me): YouTube homages, Lego (a whole category unto itself); a Super Bowl halftime show; a really cool beer ad, and stuff I either don't know about or can't imagine.

The fan literature base is substantial. Forums like this continue to stir the pot (in a good way). Indy scratches the adventure itch, in the same way that Allan Quatermain did (and occasionally still does) a few generations earlier.
At some point, regardless of what happens, or doesn't, to IJ5, the spirit of Indy will be reincarnated. The trick will be recognizing it when it comes along. Kind of like the Dalai Lama.
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Old 02-07-2018, 03:34 PM   #485
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Originally Posted by Nosirrah
Consider the Curious Case of Sherlock Holmes. Leaving aside the fact that Holmes originated as a literary creation of Conan Doyle, and was soon brought to the stage by William Gillette, the cinematic Holmes was indelibly associated with Basil Rathbone, who portrayed him in no less than 14 features between 1939 and 1946. Rathbone was Holmes, and that was that. Or so I thought.

And then along came Jeremy Brett, who absolutely nailed the character and made Holmes his own. Until his untimely death in 1995, Brett brought Holmes to life in some 41 productions. Remarkable fidelity to the original texts, fine acting and high production values didn't hurt, either. Brett was Holmes, the canonical works had been definitively produced, and that was that. Or so I thought.

All along, the canon had spawned admirers and imitators. A remarkable fan literature, notably August Derleth's Solar Pons stories, created a parallel alternate universe. George C. Scott's "They Might be Giants" (1971) was the leading edge of a wave that now includes Gene Wilder, Robert Downey, Jr., and most recently and Benedict Cumberbatch. And the diversity of portrayers increases: female, Asian. I would add black, but "A Black Sherlock Holmes" was made in 1918!

It's a flawed analogy, but what I take away is, if the spirit of Indiana Jones refuses to die, it will surface in expected and unexpected ways. Expected: video games (including Lara Croft), theme park attractions, screen imitations (Tales of the Gold Monkey in 1982; Brendan Fraser's Mummy franchise; Lara Croft again). Unexpected (by clueless me): YouTube homages, Lego (a whole category unto itself); a Super Bowl halftime show; a really cool beer ad, and stuff I either don't know about or can't imagine.

The fan literature base is substantial. Forums like this continue to stir the pot (in a good way). Indy scratches the adventure itch, in the same way that Allan Quatermain did (and occasionally still does) a few generations earlier.
At some point, regardless of what happens, or doesn't, to IJ5, the spirit of Indy will be reincarnated. The trick will be recognizing it when it comes along. Kind of like the Dalai Lama.

Excellent, excellent post. And now I am craving some classic Holmes movies.
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Old 02-09-2018, 02:01 PM   #486
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Originally Posted by Dr.Jonesy
I really, really don't want a fifth film.

As I've probably said here - a fifth film should've been made by 2012-2013 at the very latest and even that was pushing it.

I recall how Spielberg and Lucas say how fun and easy these films are to make but given how much they've dragged their feet with every film past 1984 and especially since 1989 would suggest otherwise.

Harrison is too old - the film is already going to be handicapped at an action-level from the very start due to Harrison's age and the believability factor being something they'll have to watch out for. As much as I love the fourth film, it's evident that with some - the suspension of disbelief was a bit much at times. They have to tone down a fifth film to keep things even for an already potentially skeptical audience.

Plus, I think setting it in the '60s is just too far ahead. It just doesn't feel right.

I think what they should do is maybe do a prequel to Kingdom - de-age Harrison via makeup and digital effects and set it in 1954. The reason for this is simply because it'd be easier to swallow the action set-pieces with Indy not being in his 70s in the canon. Not only that, but Mutt and Marion don't have to be addressed.

A prequel to Kingdom would be ideal for the factor of believable-Indy kicking butt and Harrison does look good for his age, so aging him back 10 years shouldn't be too far a stretch.

I don't know, guys. I think this whole fifth film is a bad idea.

What makes you think a fifth film as a sequel has to be or is going to be in the 1960s? Could easily set the film in 1959. Raiders and LC are only 2 years apart chronologically despite being 8 years apart in filming.

Harrison hasn't aged THAT much (in his face) since KOTCS, so setting a film in 1959 or even 1960 on the head, at worst, wouldn't be implausible.
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Old 02-09-2018, 02:03 PM   #487
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Originally Posted by JollyGreenSlugg
The bull**** "only Harrison can play Indy!" is as bad as "only Heath Ledger can ever play the Joker now".

Really only Harrison should play Indy, but as the person below you said, why does adventure HAVE to be Indiana Jones, anyway?

I would prefer myself that the Jones character exist with Harrison Ford, personally.

That doesn't mean there can't be other films with a similar theme and concept without the Jones character that can't be great.
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Old 02-09-2018, 03:44 PM   #488
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Originally Posted by Raiders112390
Really only Harrison should play Indy
Except for the 4 other actors who have played Indy on screen...
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Old 02-09-2018, 05:01 PM   #489
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Except for the 4 other actors who have played Indy on screen...

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Old 02-09-2018, 09:08 PM   #490
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Originally Posted by JasonMa
Except for the 4 other actors who have played Indy on screen...

Because all of those guys had a massive impact right? So...I'm guessing you thought Sean Patrick Flannery did a better job than that Lucas approved hackfraud Ford, right?
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Old 02-09-2018, 09:09 PM   #491
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Originally Posted by Pale Horse

The day you just admit "I really can't wait until Harrison Ford dies" will be great, man. Just admit you hate the guy already. It'll do you some good. I know you watch those lame old 80s Indy films and wish Pratt could be digitally inserted over Harrison.
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Old 02-10-2018, 06:58 PM   #492
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Originally Posted by Raiders112390
Lucas approved

Who do you think cast Sean Patrick Flannery, Corey Carrier, and George Hall? Young Indy was George's baby.
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Old 02-10-2018, 08:12 PM   #493
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Originally Posted by Lambonius
Who do you think cast Sean Patrick Flannery, Corey Carrier, and George Hall? Young Indy was George's baby.

Obviously and they all sucked as casting choices. My point is none of those other guys made any real impact. I don't buy into Harrison Ford hate, though.
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Old 02-10-2018, 08:22 PM   #494
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Originally Posted by Lambonius
Who do you think cast Sean Patrick Flannery, Corey Carrier, and George Hall? Young Indy was George's baby.
Don't even bother, the ̶F̶o̶r̶c̶e̶ fetish is strong with this one.
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Old 02-10-2018, 08:33 PM   #495
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Originally Posted by Z dweller
Don't even bother, the ̶F̶o̶r̶c̶e̶ fetish is strong with this one.

So which of those actors do you think did a better job than Ford? Why can't you just let the series die?

Did Harrison Ford rape your childhood?
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Old 02-10-2018, 08:43 PM   #496
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So which of those actors do you think did a better job than Ford? Why can't you just let the series die?

Did Harrison Ford rape your childhood?
Easy, tiger.

Ford wasn't even their first choice, as you know perfectly well.
If Selleck had taken the part, you'd be here telling us that Tom is Indy and Indy is Tom.

Dr. Jones is a great character.
Ford did a fantastic job with it and we all love him here, despite your pathetic Pratt ramblings.

But nothing lasts forever. Ford is getting old and soon someone else will pick up the baton.
Deal with it.
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Old 02-10-2018, 08:50 PM   #497
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Originally Posted by Z dweller
Easy, tiger.

Ford wasn't even their first choice, as you know perfectly well.
If Selleck had taken the part, you'd be here telling us that Tom is Indy and Indy is Tom.

Dr. Jones is a great character.
Ford did a fantastic job with it and we all love him here, despite your pathetic Pratt ramblings.

But nothing lasts forever. Ford is getting old and soon someone else will pick up the baton.
Deal with it.

Admit you hope he dies soon.
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Old 02-10-2018, 08:54 PM   #498
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Originally Posted by Raiders112390
Say deal with it to my face and see the reaction you get. Don't you dare tell me to deal with it, who the hell do you think you are or are talking to?
Go to bed, you brave internet warrior.

Nurse Ratched is gonna switch off the lights in a minute.

Last edited by Z dweller : 02-10-2018 at 09:14 PM.
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Old 02-10-2018, 11:25 PM   #499
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Originally Posted by Raiders112390
Obviously and they all sucked as casting choices. My point is none of those other guys made any real impact. I don't buy into Harrison Ford hate, though.
Get back to me with a quote of mine that said I hate Ford, then we'll talk.
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Old 02-11-2018, 12:54 AM   #500
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Well when you have a faction of fans who want to accuse Harrison of having Alzheimer's - basically wishing something worse than death on him - just so he won't be part of the film, it's easy why others would see such as hatred.
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