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Old 06-24-2008, 06:11 PM   #26
Zealot
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walton
True. It won't change what was...but it can affect what will be. Action scenes should accelerate the story. Exposition should slow things down but keep it moving forward. FX sequences should enhance a moment, not detract, not pull the audience out of the story.

We've lived. Have we learned?

I really doubt that Lucas or Spielberg will ever read this. And even if they do, who can guarantee us that they will listen?
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Old 06-24-2008, 06:39 PM   #27
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Just a small one, but Indy's 'bumble-mumble' gesture to Mutt just before he was scooped into the vines would have been better replaced with a 'lookout kid' or a 'duck'!

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Old 06-24-2008, 07:07 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zealot
I really doubt that Lucas or Spielberg will ever read this. And even if they do, who can guarantee us that they will listen?

Again, true enough. But I also imagine there to be next-gen filmmakers who are still learning the ropes of what works and what doesn't. GL and SS aren't the only great minds out there. And they'll have to hand their empires over to someone or let them go the way we all must go.
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Old 06-24-2008, 08:36 PM   #29
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I've yet to see the entire film (sadly, I would really like to, but economically I'm a bit pressed), but I did manage to see bits and pieces online, one being the sandpit scene, with the quicksand. I noticed there were subtitles underneath. I believe they were Spanish. Well in that version Indy made a comment along the lines of "My whip is at the camp!"

I do remember hearing that and at that moment looking at his belt and seeing him not have a whip.
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Old 06-24-2008, 09:55 PM   #30
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Since this is limited to editing room stuff, I would cut the Doom Town sequence completely. I don't really think it adds anything to the plot, and it drags the beginning on a bit. I didn't care for it. That being said, it would make it difficult to then show Indy being interrogated by the agents, but I'm sure that they could think of someway to smooth the transition.

I suppose that's a pretty major tweak, but it could feasibly be done.
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Old 06-24-2008, 11:41 PM   #31
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I still feel the best thing to cut from this movie would have been the fridge scene. Just have the fight with Dovchenko longer, with Indy wrapping the chain around him and kicking him up, just as the rocket sled shoots off... cue Indy theme as it rockets across Nevada.. ends with Indy waking up to American soldiers and weapons... go to interrogation... go to campus.

Killing Mac through Spalko would have been the best idea, actually, and now that someone here mentioned that, I'll never get that idea out of my head.
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Old 06-25-2008, 09:36 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A_True_Believer
I was recently reminded of those Scion commercials that talk about how a small change can have a huge impact (Horse --> Unicorn, or "1-800" --> "1-900"). If you're not familiar with them, that's okay. My point is it got me thinking about what little tweaks could be made to Indy 4 that would make a big difference.

Let me start off by saying I liked Indy 4. I'm not talking about changing the entire film here, but literally seconds here and there; bits that though short would greatly improve the movie. Here's my list:

- In the fridge scene, I would remove the few seconds we see it bouncing along the ground. That's what made it unbelievable for me. If they had faded from the russian car being overtaken to a dense dust cloud, then panned over to the fridge already settled on the ground, I think it would have been more plausible. It's sort of like in LC when Indy climbs up the roots after the tank goes over the cliff. By not seeing exactly how it happened, we can rationalize it in our imagination.

- In the sanitarium, when Indy says the drawing on the floor is of the cemetary, it's not really clear how he knows that. I would have added a quick line where he says it matches some description or drawing in Oxley's letter.

- In the end of the cemetary fight, besides adding back in the cut bit with the whip, I also would have rather seen Indy shoot the last warrior instead of just scaring him off. I think it would have added a nice punch to the end of the fight.

- In the russian camp, when Mutt is being threatened, and when Indy and Marion are arguing, if you look at Spalko she has a rather amused expression on her face. I think it would have been neat if they cut to Spalko briefly to emphasize that even she found the exchange funny.

- During the sand pit scene, it would have been nice if they mentioned why Indy didn't just use his whip to get out. Just one line like "I could use my whip if the damn Russians hadn't taken it!" would have helped fill in that plot hole.

- When Indy takes control of the truck at the start of the jungle chase, it would have been nice to actually see the fight instead of just watching Marion and Mutt getting tossed around in the back. I envisioned seeing the driver, then seeing Indy's arms descend from above, grab him under the chin, and throw him to the side.

- The vine swinging was cheesy, but what put it over the edge for me was seeing Mutt so smoothly transfer from one vine to another in mid-swing. If they had showed him more clumsily swinging from tree to tree it would have been much more tolerable.

- I would have focused on Indy's face for a moment when he was driving along the cliff edge just before Mutt swung in to save the day. Just a brief glimpse of that classic, hopeless, "Oh crap I'm going to die" look before he was rescued would have been great.

- When the duck went over the last waterfall, I would have liked to see them drag out the approach a bit and maybe add in some suspenseful music that built up to when they went over the edge. Then, I would have had the camera linger on the water at the bottom of the falls for a few seconds just to build up tension before seeing them bob to the surface one by one.

- I liked the Ugha warriors, but seeing them break out of the walls made no sense at all. I think seeing them crawl and slither out of concealed holes and cracks in the wall would have been more believable, as well as creepier.

- When the group finally got to Akator, I think there should have been a few seconds to allow them to take in the sight of the lost city before the Ugha started chasing them. This was their goal for the whole movie. Seeing it for the first time should have had a major emotional impact, with looks of awe and swelling music, like when they first see the Grail temple in LC.

- When they fell onto the spiral staircase, I wouldn't have had the trap spring right away. I would have added a few seconds so they could take in how high they were and see the bed of spikes in the water below. I think establishing the danger first would have greatly improved this scene. Then, as they got to their feet, one of them could have accidently sprung the trap.

What little tweaks would you make?

you seem to expect alot.....
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Old 06-25-2008, 12:58 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mutt willams
you seem to expect alot.....

I'm not sure what you mean. I'm not expecting anything, and I still really enjoyed the movie. Such things are just fun to discuss, at least for me.
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Old 06-25-2008, 02:59 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A_True_Believer
I'm not sure what you mean. I'm not expecting anything, and I still really enjoyed the movie. Such things are just fun to discuss, at least for me.

im sorry if i offened you (pun intended)
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Old 06-25-2008, 03:01 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mutt willams
im sorry if i offened you (pun intended)
whats the pun?
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Old 06-25-2008, 03:16 PM   #36
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look at his avatar, remeber where the marahaj spoke up and said some stuff, and indy said im sorry if i offended you, i guess it wasnt that funy
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Old 06-25-2008, 06:23 PM   #37
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Fans meddling with films should outlawed quite frankly.
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Old 06-25-2008, 06:35 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mutt willams
look at his avatar, remeber where the marahaj spoke up and said some stuff, and indy said im sorry if i offended you, i guess it wasnt that funy

Nah, it was funny. I just didn't make the connection at first. I'd love to respond. Unfortunately, the Maharajah doesn't say anything after that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Major West
Fans meddling with films should outlawed quite frankly.

I totally agree. If you ever catch me breaking into Spielberg's editing room to hack up the footage of Indy 5, lock me up.

Fans discussing films in a civil manner, however, is fine.
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Old 06-25-2008, 06:56 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blueseattle
Killing Mac through Spalko would have been the best idea, actually, and now that someone here mentioned that, I'll never get that idea out of my head.

Thank you. Thank you!
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Old 06-30-2008, 05:54 AM   #40
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I would change the monkey/tarzan scene so that when Mutt is in the trees, he see's the action in the distance, then see's the monkeys, in particular, a monkey swing on a vine. Then the camera does a close-up shot of his face to see him to an 'indy-like' side of the mouth smerk/smile and then cut back to the action where after a while, mutt swings in on a vine.

It wouldnt take much to put it like this and i think it would really tidy-up that scene by getting rid of the CGI vine swinging and a good few seconds of the monkeys crouding round him while adding a bit of supprise and comedy to the sequence. Not to mention making it feel alittle less childish.
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