Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,947
Grimoire Maudit
DIrishB has started scanning his pages and I've figured out the first 10 already so, like he wrote in an e-mail:
Quote:
Originally Posted by DIrishB
Certainly this is the Golden Age of translated and obscure Indy tales.
I want to tip my hat to DIrish, Icybro, BrodyIsDead and Rob Dangerous for all their contributions in providing these rare tales!
Before this one begins, I'm looking for some opinions on the title. On the web, the common translation for "IJ et le Grimoire Maudit" seems to be "IJ and the Cursed Book of Magic" but (however literal) it's kind of stilted and clunky. I was wondering if it's worth it to bother coming up with something better or just leaving the title as is. The word "grimoire" is also used extensively in the story's text so it would be preferable to sort this out now.
Grimoire = Book of Magic / Magic Book / Magician's Book / Black Book
It appears that "grimoire" is a widely-used term in English, according to the various web articles that I've read. Should it remain this way in the title & in the rest of the story?
Maudit: The also means "Damned" and I think it sounds better but will probably leave it as "Cursed" so as not to complicate things.
Indiana Jones and the Cursed Book of Magic
Indiana Jones and the Cursed Magic Book
Indiana Jones and the Cursed Grimoire
Indiana Jones and the Damned Book of Magic Indiana Jones and that Damned Black Book!
Indiana Jones and the Damned Grimoire
etc.
Which would you choose?
What's funny is that, chronolgically, this is Indy's 2nd of 3(!) adventures dealing with the Philosopher's Stone! All 3 stories were published within a few months of each other in 1995. How crazy is that?
The word grimoire is certainly familiar enough to most English readers. So much so that I can't imagine why you should have to change it.
Titles are hard, man. Even most authors have trouble coming up with them, and here you are trying to translate one into working English. I'd say you should keep "grimoire" somewhere in the title. It's very macguffin-esque.
Indiana Jones and the Black Grimoire?
Indiana Jones and the Maledicted Grimoire?
Indiana Jones and the Bedamnned Grimoire?
Indiana Jones and the Scourged Grimoire?
Indiana Jones and the Black Bible?
...haha, I dunno. I'm pretty crap at this. Hopefully someone proper will pop along and give their advice.
What does the grimoire actually do? Maybe you could take a lead from that. Like, let's say it raises the dead, right. Then it could be Indiana Jones and the Black Book of the Dead. Or if it was written by a notorious person, then it could be Indiana Jones and The Cursed Grimoire of ______.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
What's funny is that, chronolgically, this is Indy's 2nd of 3(!) adventures dealing with the Philosopher's Stone! All 3 stories were published within a few months of each other in 1995. How crazy is that?
What's funny is that, chronolgically, this is Indy's 2nd of 3(!) adventures dealing with the Philosopher's Stone! All 3 stories were published within a few months of each other in 1995. How crazy is that?
I'd say it's almost but not quite as remarkable as the catalog of Indy adventures involving crystal skulls... except that those were all done (and in at least one notable case, not done ) over many many years. Three unrelated Philosopher's Stone Indy tales published within a few months of one another? Far out...
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,947
Quote:
Originally Posted by |ZiR|
The word grimoire is certainly familiar enough to most English readers. So much so that I can't imagine why you should have to change it.
I'd say you should keep "grimoire" somewhere in the title. It's very macguffin-esque.
Noted and logged.
Quote:
Originally Posted by |ZiR|
Titles are hard, man. Even most authors have trouble coming up with them, and here you are trying to translate one into working English.
I used to laugh my head off at the lame, French translations for movies & TV shows. Some of my faves are:
"Lisence to Kill" = "To Kill, Not To Play" (Tuer, Ne Pas Jouer)
"The Dukes of Hazzard" = "Sheriff, Make Me Scared!" (Sheriff, Fais-Moi Peur!)
Quote:
Originally Posted by |ZiR|
What does the grimoire actually do? Maybe you could take a lead from that. Like, let's say it raises the dead, right. Then it could be Indiana Jones and the Black Book of the Dead. Or if it was written by a notorious person, then it could be Indiana Jones and The Cursed Grimoire of ______.
It's a book of alchemy (and supposedly a copy of the Book of Abraham) that once belonged to this guy, Nicolas Flamel.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crack that whip
I'd say it's almost but not quite as remarkable as the catalog of Indy adventures involving crystal skulls... except that those were all done (and in at least one notable case, not done ) over many many years. Three unrelated Philosopher's Stone Indy tales published within a few months of one another? Far out...
Yeah, 3 stories about the Philosopher's Stone in 1 year:
1933 - IJ and the Philosophers' Stone (1995 May)
1936 - IJ et le Grimoire Maudit (1995)
1947 - IJ and the Iron Phoenix (1994-95)
Indiana Jones and the Grimoire's Spell
Indiana Jones and the Curse of the Alchemists
Indiana Jones and the Tome of the Damned
Indiana Jones and the Magick of the Accursed
Indiana Jones and the Grimoire of Darkness
PS. Wouldn't you love to see that list of 50+ titles that was prepared for Indy 4?
I'll cast my vote for Indiana Jones and the Book of the Damned. There's not enough cursing in Indiana Jones titles!
...and I'm usually the first to condemn dumbing down language for an American audience (e.g. we could have handled Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone), but I'll admit I was unfamiliar with the term "grimoire."
I think "grimoire" is a fairly common term. Aren't witches' spell books often called grimoires? I'd definitely suggest not translating it, at least in the text of the story.
Personally, I like "Indiana Jones and the Cursed Book of Magic". Sure, its clunky and long, but so are just about every Indy title. And it definitely screams "pulp fiction" from the title alone. I'd choose that. After all, Indiana Jones and the Raiders of the Lost Ark is a rather long and drawn out title, maybe even overly descriptive, but thats sort of the point...just like "Cursed Book of Magic" (even without the IJ attachment, RotLA is still a long title).
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,947
I...don't...know...what...to...do...
Quote:
Personally, I like "Indiana Jones and the Cursed Book of Magic". Sure, its clunky and long, but so are just about every Indy title. And it definitely screams "pulp fiction" from the title alone. I'd choose that.
Considering you're the one supplying the pages, I guess we'll just leave it as is. You're right, DB. I mean, how much crazier is it than "Indiana Jones and the Ape Slaves of Howling Island"? Plus, it will remain consistent with any related web info. Thanks for everyone's input, though. I really appreciate it! Makes it more of a community effort. As suggested, "grimoire" will remain in the actual text.
Too bad, 'cause I really wanted "Indiana Jones and that Damned, Little Black Book"!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crack that whip
Three unrelated Philosopher's Stone Indy tales published within a few months of one another? Far out...
I'll have to thumb through my Marvels and see if he goes after it in one of those, too!
Considering you're the one supplying the pages, I guess we'll just leave it as is. You're right, DB. I mean, how much crazier is it than "Indiana Jones and the Ape Slaves of Howling Island"? Plus, it will remain consistent with any related web info. Thanks for everyone's input, though. I really appreciate it! Makes it more of a community effort. As suggested, "grimoire" will remain in the actual text.
Good point concerning the title remaining consistent with other information found on the web.
Quote:
Too bad, 'cause I really wanted "Indiana Jones and that Damned, Little Black Book"!
Speaking of which, Stoo, do you need more pages, or were you able to work with the PDF file of the entire book that Rob posted? Let me know...I may be lazy and slow, but I hate to stand in the way of fellow Indy fans getting to read this. So if you need more pages, just let me know.
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,947
Hey DB, do you mean the .PDFs that Rob linked to on page 5 of the Cité de la Foudre thread? There are no "Grimoire" scans there so if he posted them somewhere else, I missed it. Anyway, yes, I still need more pages (14 and up). So far, the cover & frontispiece are done and the handwritten blurb is nearing completion. They'll be posted soon. I received your 1st batch of americanizations and will begin changing the panels in due time.
"Goldeneye" was on TV last night and it gave me a chuckle because the Bond-girl character's name was Natalya Simonova (which bears a resemblence to Indy's Bagheera comics-cohort, Natasha Smirnova).
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,947
^Ha ha! Oops! Yes, I meant Marya. (My sister's name is Natasha and had just been talking to her on the phone.)
Anyway, as some might know, on the cover there's a stone table filled with engraved, lettering. The text is hard to decipher (and looks like a medival-type French) so I won't altering that part (it would take forever) but will try to provide a written translation as best as I can.
Hey DB, do you mean the .PDFs that Rob linked to on page 5 of the Cité de la Foudre thread? There are no "Grimoire" scans there so if he posted them somewhere else, I missed it.
Whoops, you're right. Sorry, my brain farted.
Quote:
Anyway, yes, I still need more pages (14 and up). So far, the cover & frontispiece are done and the handwritten blurb is nearing completion. They'll be posted soon. I received your 1st batch of americanizations and will begin changing the panels in due time.
Cool. Let me know when you're getting close to finishing with those first 14 pages and I'll send over another batch of 14 or 15 pages.
Quote:
"Goldeneye" was on TV last night and it gave me a chuckle because the Bond-girl character's name was Natalya Simonova (which bears a resemblence to Indy's Bagheera comics-cohort, Natasha Smirnova).
If only Henry Jones had appeared in one of these French comics...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icybro
You mean Marya Smirnova, right? Or did they change her name in Grimoire Maudit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoo
^Ha ha! Oops! Yes, I meant Marya. (My sister's name is Natasha and had just been talking to her on the phone.)
I'm glad I'm not the only one.
Quote:
Anyway, as some might know, on the cover there's a stone table filled with engraved, lettering. The text is hard to decipher (and looks like a medival-type French) so I won't altering that part (it would take forever) but will try to provide a written translation as best as I can.
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,947
Grimoire Maudit - TRANSLATED (Part 1)
Anyone reading this owes their thanks to the magnificent, DIrishB, for providing these pages! Without him, this RARE TALE would never be seen by many (and Indy's handwritten script below is so fitting because of DB's generosity.) When this one is finished, we can re-visit indyclone's, "Secret de la Pyramide" scans from last year and do that one properly, too...Then we'll have all 3.
Now, I have to admit, the painting of Indy on the "Grimoire" cover is awful and stands apart from the other two Bagheeras. I tried to hide it as much as possible when working on it. It's really ugly but the story is very good, so far! Anyway, here we go...
The first bit is the translation for the stone tablet on the cover. It won't make any sense (it's really hard to decipher and as mentioned before, looks like medieval French) but was the best I could do and could be way off the mark. (If anyone could provide any further input, please do so!) I've posted the original versions for these 3 images for comparison but the remainder will be English only.
Original Stone Tablet
Nicolas Flamel ______________
____ a _____e parlon t________ent _
____re de celle eg___e certaines
ventes et mailons qu_________
acqu__tees et achatees _____oit
vaut pour faire certain ________
d__n et dutr___ions _________
chacun an p__ au______________
chans les quinze ans ________tel du
eu et autres egales et h_______
a p__s Soit prie __ les __________
(Tiny scroll above the smaller Indy's hat)
Homme nus et ma m________
Translated Stone Tablet
Nicolas Flamel ______________
____ to _____ speaking/talking ________
______ of those _______ certain
sales and links (?) that (?) _________
acquisitions (?) and purchases _________
worthy to make certain ________
____ and _______ _________
each year ___ ________________
____ the fifteen years ___________ of
had and other equals and _______
to ____ or pray ______________
(Tiny scroll above the smaller Indy's hat)
Naked man and my ________
"Hide this book in your breast and do not place it lightly in impious hands for it contains the secret of secrets. One must not throw this pearl in the furnace, for it is a gift from God. Indiana Jones, April, 1933."
I just recently moved, so no longer have internet access from my new place, so I'm limited in scanning the pages. No worries, though, as I can always finish up the scans using my friends computer. Just let me know when you're ready for more pages. Matter of fact, I'm going by my parents place next weekend so might be able to get some scanned then.
Location: Neuchâtel, Switzerland (Canadian from Montreal)
Posts: 6,947
Quote:
Originally Posted by DIrishB
I just recently moved, so no longer have internet access from my new place, so I'm limited in scanning the pages. No worries, though, as I can always finish up the scans using my friends computer. Just let me know when you're ready for more pages. Matter of fact, I'm going by my parents place next weekend so might be able to get some scanned then.
Thanks, guys. I wish I could have transcribed the tablet a bit better but it's hard to read. Anyway, scan pages whenever you have the chance. No need to send any new ones right away as the 1st batch isn't finished yet and I'm on vacation* tomorrow. Will let you know when I'm ready for more. It's so great to read these rare tales and "Grimoire" is shaping up to be a good one.
Enjoy your new digs, DB!
(*HINT: I'm going to the same place Indy did in Bagheera's "Secret de la Pyramid"!)
Grimoire Maudit
) over many many years. Three unrelated Philosopher's Stone Indy tales published within a few months of one another? Far out...
It's really ugly but the story is very good, so far! Anyway, here we go...
