Indy IV and the real world

'allo

The trilogy have very little to do with the real world, the Nazis are cartoon villains, the whole colonial questions ultimately come down to the fact that the Indians are all cultists/in need of a messiah. And America is presented as just one big suburbia with a dotty englishman running the local museam. The trilogy could have been set at any time between the wars.

There has been a lot of discussion about Indy IV having something to do with the real world in the 50's such as McCarthyism, a rather more complex presentatation of Cold war, the untrustworthiness of government, Indy becoming more 'human'.

So the question is, is it time for the trilogy to rise above being a popcorn film and look into (or at least acknowledge) the issues that were important at the time; or at least seek to be based in the real world. Or maybe that isnt Indys place.....

Good questions Bob. My guess is they will stay pretty consistent with the Indy genre like they've said, which is a sort of cartoon version of the real world. McCarthyism, the cold war, etc. could likely be played that way. "Is it time for the trilogy to rise above being a popcorn film" - My guess is NO, but they will have fun surprises in store for us, which may include taking risks we would not expect. Of course I'm not sure I have any idea what I'm talking about, but I do know I love the genre.

Hey I want to welcome you all! This is my first post!

I think that they should avoid communists in the 50s
Maybe some plot with mad cultists or secret society
placed in locations not shown previously, like Greece,
Yucatan, Pacific, Mesopotamia?Good example is old Golden
Fleece comic book with that ancient constantinople sect...
Only acceptable involvement of communists to me,will
be in year 1951 (Stalin still alive, Korean War)or in the
late 40s (1947,48?) when we still have splendor of the
adventure era (similar to the 1930s) mingled with nervous
atmosphere of coming Cold War.If Spielberg wants to place
commies desperately, then he cannot avoid showing Berlin
a city crucial to the cold war battles with all chaos and
poverty of the postwar Germany.
In any case they shouldn't place action in late or middle
1950s (1953 is the latest date acceptable)-in 1956 or 1958
the New Era is coming - era of bitniks,rock'n'roll,drugs,
contestation,black power etc. which symbolizes new global world of fast communication and space flights.Indy has no
link with that world.His world is a world of brave explorers, rusty airplanes, colonial empires, prohibition
gangsters- this era definitely ends in the early 1950s.
So I'm not afraid that Spielberg will show old Indy but that he will show Indy in a world in which Indy is a relic of the past - an artifact itself.

[Edited by Nur - Ab - Sal on 12-24-2003 at 04:22 am]

temple of john said:

Part of the reason that I enjoy the idea of the enemies being nazi's or commies, etc, is the shear numbers involved. Part of the fun for raiders was the fact that Indy was in an area entirely surrounded by nazi's. There was a feel that he is so outnumbered that he could not possibly win.

Click to expand...

But still the numbers for an action movie were not huge, there were only about 20 - 30 armed Nazis in total and he never takes on all of them in Raiders which gives it some realism....

As for ToD he was generally running away

And in LC in the tank chase once all the sillyness with the magical 3 in 1 bullet he spends most of his time beating up one Nazi

I hope there is no robots or lasers or razor bladed-hats like Bond. LOL

Renderking Fisk said:

So the question is, is it time for the trilogy to rise above being a popcorn film and look into (or at least acknowledge) the issues that were important at the time; or at least seek to be based in the real world. Or maybe that isnt Indys place.....

Click to expand...

Spielberg spends his time in his other flicks to look at the other "serious" issues of that era. Shindler's List, Empire of the Sun, Color Purple. I believe Uncle Steve and George are keeping Jones4 with in the same genre of the first three. I think Jones might have to face "cartoonish" KGB right to the edge of this being a James Bond satire.

Click to expand...

I'm not so sure that the Soviets can just replace the Nazis as:
1. The Cold War is long gone
2. Only a decade or so before the events of Indy IV the Soviets were instrumental in beating the Nazis and suffered millions of casualites; Indy cannot just go around squishing Soviet soldiers.
3. SS has tried to become a more serious film maker
4. YIJ was about Indy being a vessal through history is learnt and that was the last time we saw Indy on screen, might some of the spirit that drove GL/SS to use the character that way still exist?...

I do not know about Mccarthism either. I doo not particularily see Indiana Jones getting blacklisted.

Henry Jones Junior said:

I do not know about Mccarthism either. I doo not particularily see Indiana Jones getting blacklisted.

Click to expand...

Why not?

He was a public figure who has links and friends across the world including probably the USSR.
And if he was ever to speak out about his adventures, Walter Donovan the industrialist being in-bed with Nazis and dodgy army intelligance people people might see him as a crank trying to discredit America and capitalism.
At the very least he could face losing his teaching position

bob said:

He was a public figure who has links and friends across the world including probably the USSR.[/B]

Click to expand...

He does have friends in the USSR check out the book Indiana Jones and the Genesis Deluge.

I agree with Temple of John

I agree with Temple of John. USSR as bad boy may enrage
Russians who today are seeing USSR as a period of their
greatness (although they also remember the crimes
which soviet government committed on them).That may destroy
succesful promotion of Indy IV in Russia.And don't forget that today Russia is a biggest european market (150 million citizens). In the 1980s Soviets were showing all
Indy films becouse of their anti-nazi meaning so Indiana Jones is well-known among Russians.Spielberg is not a fool to destroy this...
Besides all of this, kicking commies' ass is rather boring after all these silly James Bond movies.What new Spielberg could possibly show on that field? All good ideas were exploited in Infernal Machine.
I told you that best idea is an ancient Secret Society
or some kind of Evil Worship

I think that the main villain may well be Soviet i.e. renegade army officer like in Goldeneye or KGB.

But the real question is going to be who is going to be the enemy of which Indy can kill with impunity with funny one liners...

Spielberg and Lucas are independent enough to avoid political correctness.They show what whey want.Always
they were outsiders of the bubble-hollywood environment.

Hmmmm i dont see how that letter really applies to Indiana Jones

(And i dont see why escapist (science fiction) tv shows should have to provide commentary on the current geo-political situation of the world)

Also Indy IV is set in the 50's which is a very different kettle o'fish