People are dying in the USA

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gladhatter

Guest
I think conspiracy is the very correct word for doctors. I do not know the word for folks like that emt instructor but I know he is not I . I always herard it was a shame to try to stretch a gnats back over a washing tub and a pity when an ant was crawling up an elephants leg and the elephant was crying rape. I do not think words exist to describe a person that advocates letting some one suffer and die for fear of legal ramfications. I rather sleep on hard ground and use a rock for a pillow and lose all I ever hope to have as I had to heed the advise of a man telling me to let someone die cuz they may take criminal action if I heled them out.

I pulled a woman out of a buring old station wagon some years ago down in Louisville Ky after hearing her screm from inside an apartment plum accross the street and getting there and a whole crowd of folks was watching her begging fo help and all of them swearing I was crazy to get her out of there as I would get sued. She was returning home from the hospital witha serious operation and was simply un able to get out on her own. My Gawd, I cannot imagine how I would have felt had I stood there and watched her burn. I am sure I would have felt just fine to have went to court over helping her and lilkely gotten over it . I don't think I could have got over it if it went the other way.

Way it was she ended up fine and so did I. I do not know how them folks watching ened up but I expect they are not very happy people.
 
monkey

monkey

Guest
idealism is great. But if it is going to cost me my house, my future, and my kids future, to save some fat guy who has a heart attack while waiting in line for popcorn at the movies, then no thanks. I'll keep my house my future, and I'll go ahead and send my kids to college.
 
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gladhatter

Guest
Well idealism is what makes my clock tick and I take it seriously enough that it just became a way of life for me. I will as a result never have those luxuries at stake to lose and will have the luxury to help them in need. not being a religios man I seem to thing of stuff from the bible a lot . here I am thinking what Jesus told the rich young ruler. "What good is it to gain the whole world and lose you soul" What ever that soul thing is I reckon I just rather have it over any house or youngings that went to the best schools and learned all the books had to teach and still was too educated to help out a fellow human being. There must be a balanced conclusion here and I am sure we can reach it with a little more of seeing it from both sides.
 
monkey

monkey

Guest
Gladhatter, I'm all for helping the human race. I believe strongly in helping those less fortunate. I belive very strongly in such causes as helping AIDS orphans in Africa, helping the displaced and persecuted black Africans of the Sudan, I believe in helping rid Cambodia of land mines, I want to see justice and human rights for all the world.

But I can't do anything about any of those causes if I am destitute and without any funds because some fat guy chokes on a popcorn kernal, I give him the Heimlich maneuver, save his life, and then he sues me for every penny I've got. Why does he sue me? Oh, simple........because he has a lawyer. I didn't administer the HM correctly. I 'injured' him. I didn't have 'permission' to do it.

Sure, I believe in running into the burning building to save the baby..........it's not a matter of courage or morals, it's a matter of common sense.

Please don't assume some kind of moral high ground here simply because I am pragmatic.

OK, OK, ..........here goes....... "I will do anything to save any human life!" Ok, sound good? OK there you go.
 
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gladhatter

Guest
Monkey I reckon I could not accept waht I was hering from you as what you were trying to say as it simply does not jive with thefact you took the emt training to begin with. I sometimes play devils advocate also and oter times I just state positions I do not nessisarily share. No questioning here from me about your morals vs your humanity. really its more of a question of where do we draw the line. Damn shamed is what it is when shyster lawyers prevent us from doing what is best.

I am just a bit touchy due to a serious mistake I made once on a time. I was accused of bribing a goverment official in the official capacity of their duty and it was nothing but an out and out lie. I was dead broke at the time but was intent on proving I was right on an issue and I took it so far as to get it in front of Ed maddigans exec assitant all answering to Bush 1 and they sided with me and right when I finally thought I had them by the Scroutum, they pulled out a new bag of tricks called OIG and when office of inspector general gets involved then that excluded my supportes from being able to support or communicate with me. They decided to set an example of me and show me you cannot whoop city hall. I relented to a plea and took 6 months at federal U for some advanced learning due to my cowardice at facing 20 years for something I had not even done. I took that 6 monts and studied the federal code that was just adopted and little understood and I finessed it to the point I could quote it scripture and verse and I found me a loop hole and I jumped out of it all. I never could forgive myself for allowing them to take 6 months of my life for fear I may give them 20 years. I( resolved that from then on I would do th right thing always r=gardless of the cost and never bow down or coward out of any good deed again. Now at 45 going on 70, I wonder how much goodness I have left or how much resolve I have to do what is right and how much resolve I have left as I promised a wife to take care of her and that in its self demands I cannot do things I once did do. There is extentuating circumstances and migitating and agrevating circumstances and nothing is black and white and ther is grey. I have no doubt you would do the right thing when the time came and deal with it later. I can only hope I would also. No offence taken I hope. you have th right to do any thing or nothing any time you choose. ia mnot about to tell you to do one thing or another.
 
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kellpatton

New member
Hey gladhatter to your first thread thats bullcrap, our civil services are the best in the world, for example on 9/11 when hundreds of people were fleeing the WTC towers OUR FIREFIGHTERS ran in to save innocent peoples lifes.NOW you should shut up about america killing people HOW about the TALABAN all those terrorists that killed thousands of innocent people on september 11th.
 
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gladhatter

Guest
kellpatton said:
Hey gladhatter to your first thread thats bullcrap, our civil services are the best in the world, for example on 9/11 when hundreds of people were fleeing the WTC towers OUR FIREFIGHTERS ran in to save innocent peoples lifes.NOW you should shut up about america killing people HOW about the TALABAN all those terrorists that killed thousands of innocent people on september 11th.
Click to expand...

Hrmm , Sorry I guess you will have to remind me of whhere I have sated any of the things you are telling me to shut up about as I do not recall saying any of them and seem to instead share your position on this matter in fullest.

At any rate I am glad you have an opinion and are willing to share it . I sure hope you NEVER shut up if you choosse to agree or disagree with me and that you will continue to add your opinions to any thread. It may be nice if you got your facts correct before you start replying but it is not necessary .

Thanks again for you input.
 
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gladhatter

Guest
Well I am not sure how great our country really is but no need to get steamed even if you disagree. I am sure you would find a more pleasing result if you opted to discuss matters of disagreement with a touch more thoughtfullness. How ever if you choose to kick, gouge , throw rocks, pull guns and spit at me that too will be ok but others may interpit such behavior as that of a country that is far from great.

After all a country that allows free speech for all would surly not be great if only one side got to share their opinion then horse whooped any one that they though disagreed.

Think about it.
 
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kellpatton

New member
i dont mean to kick gouge or through rocks but our country is great but some of the people within it our the one we should be talken about. I truley respect people who respect the United States but some people dont care and think the flags just a sign that means welcome to a place that we can live in and disrespect they dont respect the flag or what it stands for and thats the people that are the problem
 
Rick5150

Rick5150

New member
Wow - I thought this was a post about killing people indirectly through the media circus who would rather have the scoop on a story than save a life. Or the fact that government spending is out of hand. Or the medical coverage is non-existent for too many people and abused by those who really do not need it. I must have missed a turn somewhere.

The United States can be a great place to live, but it is not perfect. I have seen places from Newark, NJ to Stockton, California where people are living under bridges and eating from dumpsters. The wealth is here, but those who manage it line their pockets and spend it on unnecessary items abroad rather than deal with the problems in their own back yard.

Kellpatton, you are correct if (I read your post properly). I think it is great to have people from all walks of life in the US. But many of them actually come here to live and resent the US all the while. There is too much disrespect brought forth from immigrants even as they are living within American borders.

How do you feel about the people living in areas where there is graffiti strewn about as far as the eye can see? Broken windows abound and people are afraid to walk down the street. For the most part, these conditions are created by the same people who live there to complain about it. It is not the upper class that runs down to an urban area and spends time to spraypaint garbage on the walls. It is sad too, because looking at some of the "graffiti" these people have a real talent. Just not the proper outlet to express it.

Sure the US is a great country, but it is not perfect. The people who run into the burning buildings and stand up to face the enemy (and our military and police etc., etc.) are laying a terrific foundation, but we do not seem to be able to construct or improve the rest of the country with any degree of skill.
 
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monkey

monkey

Guest
America is a great country, no doubt about it.

Rick made some excellent points. There are indeed a lot of people who come to America just to live and take advantage of it. These are people who don't even consider themselves Americans, don't want to assimilate, in fact, in the case of certain peoples they are traitors plotting the destruction of the country.

Translation: Terror Cells

Then there are other immigrants who want very much to be Americans, who are patriotic, whose sons and daughters wear the uniform of America's Armed Forces. There are a lot of men and women serving bravely in the Armed Forces with names that end in 'Z'.

You can think about that one for a while.....

Anyway, that's my take on immigration.

As for other problems. A lot of America's problems have to do with the uneven distribution of wealth. No, I'm not talking about having a communist revolution, but simply putting a little bit more control on such things as huge tax breaks for the super rich (who don't need it), and the exporting of American jobs to China and India to cut Corporate costs and line the pockets of the rich fat cats even more.
 
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gladhatter

Guest
Rick and Monkey and lellpaton all make good points.

No, I'm not talking about having a communist revolution, but simply putting a little bit more control on such things as huge tax breaks for the super rich (who don't need it), and the exporting of American jobs to China and India to cut Corporate costs and line the pockets of the rich fat cats even more.


This one I am as ambililant on as many others just plain not sure about it.

I think it is great we can choose to buy abroad or to buy locally as well. I think its just plain sad that America has priced its self out of so much work and there remains a desire to send jobs off shore.

Fact is trends change and jobs are created and diminished. In the 40's there were 843 hatters in NYC alone and now there are 3, Why because peole stopped buying hats. That is for anoter thread.

Steel, You go to Pittsburg and you do not see all them huge old steel mills in operationany more. You hear how all the steal is being produced in Japan now and and how we are all suffering from it. The story is a nice one to rant about but fact is Pittsburg is steal making a great deal of our steel and they are doing it in small ultra productive mills that are almost polution free and are very price competitive and fit the bill for those that deman "Made in USA" . I am by no means a Anti USA person and while I do not worship my country and I know its far from perfect, it still remains the best place I know to live or I would have already moved. On the other hand I am tollerant of ote countries as well and especially the people from any nation or race and think the world seems to be big enough for us all... On the oter hand I think its small enough that we probably cannt sponser much more growth and while we are a progressive world, we may well find ways to support larger populations and may not go extinct as all competent scientist agree that we will as humans and all other species do. I say we ort to support the country we live in and be competitive and yet not down oter people for being different from us. I further think we could learn a lot from others and be better citizens our selves.

I sure cannot understand why people wrek and paint grafetti on the neighborhood they live in but then I think back to when I was a kid and how we as dumb hillbillies dumped trash just over the hill out the way a bit. Mind you I do not condone what we done then nor what oters are doing now but I can justify it by the fact we did not have any other palce to put our trash . Of course we had out door toliets back then also and carried water from a spring and drank from a dipper.

Times change and some peole get an oppertunity to change but I guess oters simply do not get any oppertunity to learn differently.

Education has to be the key and our nation al beit a fair one could do with much improving.

I for one miss many of the days of youth and the more remote and conserative life. but then I really missed it one day several years ago and I decided just because oters live differently , I do not have to and I started building me a little mountain cottage. ?Well 20 years latr I am still building it and many things on it will change and live will change a bit from what I envisioned it then but I have found a happy balance between the old and new and a balanced conclusion that works for me. I hope others can be so fortunate.
 
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