Little things you notice about the movies

[Mephisto]

It's always bugged me in LC that Indiana Jones passes the Breath of God by using the clue only a penitent man will pass. Then he realizes a penitent man kneels before God...but does a penitent man also do a somersault thus avoiding the second blade?

Then of course I've seen it mentioned once on here, but can anyone point me to an in depth thread where it discusses how Indiana Jones is actually a lot like Belloq as was claimed in Raiders? I can't find the proper search string to use.

Indiana Jones taking the Cross of Coronado was basically the same thing as Belloq taking the Fertility Idol from him in Raiders. Yes the Idol would've went into a museum "where it belongs." But then what about Nurhachi? Didn't that urn belong in a museum and not in a private collection. And why didn't he punch Donovan in the face and steal all his artifacts in his private collection, because "They belong in a museum!" He said some of the artifacts in the collection in his apartment were quite impressive.

Of course if you watch Temple of Doom and Crusade back to back it's even worse. In a 20 minute period you here him say, "It would just be another rock collecting dust in a museum" to "It belongs in a museum!" Yes you can say Indy was being a good guy and giving it back to the village people because it was so important to them, but there are a lot of inconsistencies regarding Indy's character that LC really brings forth.

The writers even have Fedora say that "Coronado's dead and so are all his kids." So basically Indy is pulling a Belloq and stealing something he has no claim to. If you try and go the route that they were looters as Indy claimed, well that's a problem to. Chatter Lal brought up the point that Indiana Jones has been accused of being a grave robber in other countries. The whole Cross of Coronado and "It Belongs in a museum!" scenario in Last Crusade doesn't really fit together with the Indy we know in the other films.

 

[Darth Vile]

It's always bugged me in LC that Indiana Jones passes the Breath of God by using the clue only a penitent man will pass. Then he realizes a penitent man kneels before God...but does a penitent man also do a somersault thus avoiding the second blade?

Then of course I've seen it mentioned once on here, but can anyone point me to an in depth thread where it discusses how Indiana Jones is actually a lot like Belloq as was claimed in Raiders? I can't find the proper search string to use.

Indiana Jones taking the Cross of Coronado was basically the same thing as Belloq taking the Fertility Idol from him in Raiders. Yes the Idol would've went into a museum "where it belongs." But then what about Nurhachi? Didn't that urn belong in a museum and not in a private collection. And why didn't he punch Donovan in the face and steal all his artifacts in his private collection, because "They belong in a museum!" He said some of the artifacts in the collection in his apartment were quite impressive.

Of course if you watch Temple of Doom and Crusade back to back it's even worse. In a 20 minute period you here him say, "It would just be another rock collecting dust in a museum" to "It belongs in a museum!" Yes you can say Indy was being a good guy and giving it back to the village people because it was so important to them, but there are a lot of inconsistencies regarding Indy's character that LC really brings forth.

The writers even have Fedora say that "Coronado's dead and so are all his kids." So basically Indy is pulling a Belloq and stealing something he has no claim to. If you try and go the route that they were looters as Indy claimed, well that's a problem to. Chatter Lal brought up the point that Indiana Jones has been accused of being a grave robber in other countries. The whole Cross of Coronado and "It Belongs in a museum!" scenario in Last Crusade doesn't really fit together with the Indy we know in the other films.

One could posit (and I'm being generous here), that when Indy was young (a la River Pheonix in TLC), he was a lot more virtuous and believed strongly that an individual should not obtain personal gain from the illegal acquisition of ancient artifacts. As Indy matured into a professional archeologist, and collector of rare antiquities, he became more cynical i.e. the acquisition of those artifacts was no longer philanthropic, but it was for both professional and monetary reward. At some point, post events of TOD, Indy rediscovered his more academic/humanistic interest in ancient artifacts… and sought them in order that they could be examined and understood.

As I said, I’m being very generous. As you rightly point out, there is some very contradictory evidence in the movies as to Indy’s personal drivers. It seems that the initial persona Lucas/Spielberg wanted for Indiana Jones, was that of a playboy mercenary for hire type… but somewhere along the way Indy went all soft. We see elements of that initial persona in the prologues of both Raiders and TOD, but even that is contradicted somewhat e.g. Indy's relationship with Shorty.

 

[James]

As Indy matured into a professional archeologist, and collector of rare antiquities, he became more cynical

True, but there's still that moment in the LC prologue where (adult) Indy insists it belongs in a museum.

The later prequel/sequels do seem to wreak a little havoc in terms of consistency. (For example, Indy's skepticism in ROTLA and lack of faith in LC.) It's also interesting to note that Lucas usually has no problem referring to Indy as a graverobber.

Yet despite all this, we could probably argue that there is still consistency in his behavior. Far from being what he truly believes, perhaps those little moments merely show Indy attempting to put his best foot forward. Look at how he corrects Chattar Lal or Mutt in their initial conversations. It's simply how he justifies what he does to both himself and the world.

 

[Darth Vile]

True, but there's still that moment in the LC prologue where (adult) Indy insists it belongs in a museum.

The later prequel/sequels do seem to wreak a little havoc in terms of consistency. (For example, Indy's skepticism in ROTLA and lack of faith in LC.) It's also interesting to note that Lucas usually has no problem referring to Indy as a graverobber.

Yet despite all this, we could probably argue that there is still consistency in his behavior. Far from being what he truly believes, perhaps those little moments merely show Indy attempting to put his best foot forward. Look at how he corrects Chattar Lal or Mutt in their initial conversations. It's simply how he justifies what he does to both himself and the world.

That it also true... but I think this is part of the problem i.e. the "belongs in a museum" is simply a line to connect the two segments within one movie, rather than to re-enforce any deeper/real consistent Indy character trait. Therefore, we end up retrofitting examples to make Indy's persona more consistent for ourselves. It's also possible (highly likely) that we spend more time looking at/analyzing Indy's character traits than Lucas/Spielberg actually do.

 

[thehero21]

-Most of the germans in Raiders carry weapons that werent around in 1936 (Walther P38,Mp-40,panzerfaust type rocket launcher)

-sometime in the year between TOD and Raiders Indy lost his muscle mass.

-Indy's more clean shaven in LC then the others.

 

[Hans]

I thought I'd start a thread about little details or errors or whatever you have happened to notice while watching the trilogy. I'll star with some things I noticed,

The same corpse prop used as Forrestal looks like the same one int the Well of Souls that has the snake in its mouth.

Traps often reset themselves before either traping Indy or killing him, (rock crusher, spikes, spike room door, capuchan temple door, etc)

In TOD when the kids about to get whipped and then it shows Indy standing there, you see he's wearing his satchel bag is on the wrong side before it eventually magicly apearing on the other side

And the noise you hear when of Lao Che's son shoots that gong is the same noise in Revenge of The Sith when obi wan hits General Greviouses tire thing with the electro staff

What all have you noticed?

you know that well in the indy series they used the lucas arts sound effects wich are still used today

 

[thehero21]

the raiders march thats played when indy rides the statue was just tacked on from "fist fight/the flying wing" when indy dodges the flying wings tire

 

[AnythingGoes]

Don't know if anyone else pointed this out yet, but in Raiders when Marion is dangling from the Anubis Statue in the Well of Souls, we get a decent look at her black underwear...saints preserve me!

 

[martinland]

Don't know if anyone else pointed this out yet, but in Raiders when Marion is dangling from the Anubis Statue in the Well of Souls, we get a decent look at her black underwear...saints preserve me!

To quote Indy himself: "I know."

 

[AndyLGR]

When Indy ducks through the spiders web in raiders the spiders are already on his back. I always thought the illusion was supposed to be they dropped on him as he went through the web.

 

[Paul Pauley]

There's bonkers things that you don't register at the time. A few days ago I watched Indiana Jones & The Last Crusade & there's a scene where Marcus Brody (Denholm Elliott) is wondering around in some Far East town (I don't know what country it is, a sort of Hollywood generic Arab Land) & old helper from the first film, Sallah (Jonn Rhys-Davis) just bumps into him in the street, & that's it, he's in the film right to the end. In the same scene, the Germans chase Brody & he runs into a shop, the shop front is in fact the back of a truck disguised as a shopfront, so as soon as he enters the shop they shut the doors & drive the truck away! Just what are the chances of Brody going into that shop! Millions to one, but it makes for a fun scene!

 

[metalinvader]

A few days ago I watched Indiana Jones & The Last Crusade & there's a scene where Marcus Brody (Denholm Elliott) is wondering around in some Far East town (I don't know what country it is, a sort of Hollywood generic Arab Land) & old helper from the first film, Sallah (Jonn Rhys-Davis) just bumps into him in the street, & that's it, he's in the film right to the end.

"Marcus, get hold of Sallah. Tell
him to meet you in Iskenderun."

Not really a random encounter.Indy literally tells Marcus to get in contact with Sallah.

 

[Paul Pauley]

Yes i was watching a TV showing. Bits cut out to make room for ads...

 

[ShortRound]

Again, the joke was not "Tanks!" "You're welcome!".

The joke was Donovan asking the Sultan for support, and then the Sultan listing about 5,000,000 things he would provide, and then Donovan, instead of saying "Thank you", ironically says "You're welcome", since the Sultan is in fact giving all this stuff AS a thank you, an excessive one at that, and so doesn't need to be thanked. Its a cheeky little observation, wittily delivered. Watch it again. Its a joke that has been done many times.

"Tanks!"
"You're welcome."

I mean really.

Also, in that scene when the Sultan rejected the tableware from "donated by the finest families of all of Germany" I always felt a chill down my spine as kid wondering how they got them and whether donated was really what happened.

 

[ShortRound]

It's always bugged me in LC that Indiana Jones passes the Breath of God by using the clue only a penitent man will pass. Then he realizes a penitent man kneels before God...but does a penitent man also do a somersault thus avoiding the second blade?

Then of course I've seen it mentioned once on here, but can anyone point me to an in depth thread where it discusses how Indiana Jones is actually a lot like Belloq as was claimed in Raiders? I can't find the proper search string to use.

Indiana Jones taking the Cross of Coronado was basically the same thing as Belloq taking the Fertility Idol from him in Raiders. Yes the Idol would've went into a museum "where it belongs." But then what about Nurhachi? Didn't that urn belong in a museum and not in a private collection. And why didn't he punch Donovan in the face and steal all his artifacts in his private collection, because "They belong in a museum!" He said some of the artifacts in the collection in his apartment were quite impressive.

Of course if you watch Temple of Doom and Crusade back to back it's even worse. In a 20 minute period you here him say, "It would just be another rock collecting dust in a museum" to "It belongs in a museum!" Yes you can say Indy was being a good guy and giving it back to the village people because it was so important to them, but there are a lot of inconsistencies regarding Indy's character that LC really brings forth.

The writers even have Fedora say that "Coronado's dead and so are all his kids." So basically Indy is pulling a Belloq and stealing something he has no claim to. If you try and go the route that they were looters as Indy claimed, well that's a problem to. Chatter Lal brought up the point that Indiana Jones has been accused of being a grave robber in other countries. The whole Cross of Coronado and "It Belongs in a museum!" scenario in Last Crusade doesn't really fit together with the Indy we know in the other films.

The second blade for the penitent man trial is probably because the traps were made by Crusader Knights. Christian crusaders prayed kneeling up and don't bend forwards in prayer, unlike the Muslim armies they fought.

 

[Paul Pauley]

Also, in that scene when the Sultan rejected the tableware from "donated by the finest families of all of Germany" I always felt a chill down my spine as kid wondering how they got them and whether donated was really what happened.

Exactly

"donated" indeed!

I wish Indy could have been given knowledge of the future. Just so he could tear verbal strips off that SS goon and Donovan in the castle by telling them about Auschwitz, Sobibor, Treblinka. the T4 program etc.

 

[Paul Pauley]

I really hope an Indy spin-off - book, comic, audio etc. - revisits Lao Che. Lao Che almost ended Indy's life *twice*. Lao would deal with Chairman Mao's antics as if though merely swatting a fly.

 

[emtiem]

Also, in that scene when the Sultan rejected the tableware from "donated by the finest families of all of Germany" I always felt a chill down my spine as kid wondering how they got them and whether donated was really what happened.

The bit I never noticed for years in that scene (probably already mentioned in this thread) is the 'thanks'/'you're welcome' gag

SULTAN
You shall have camels, horses, an armed escort, provisions, desert vehicles
-- and tanks!

DONOVAN
You're welcome.

 

[emtiem]

I'm sure someone else has already pointed this one out, but a few months ago I was watching LC. During the climax of the movie, I noticed Indy was not wearing his bag! I never realized that the Grail Knight cut if off when he swings his sword at Indy. Which means, that old coot got pretty close to going Amok Time on Indy. Later you can also see his bag laying on the floor.

That's a great one, I have never spotted that- will need to take another look.

 

[MrEdcar007]

In TLC, Indy's scars on his face are healed after drinking from the Grail.
I watched that movie a million times, and I only noticed that in the 4K version.